peejay4A Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 On the left of the picture is the remains of the left outer front wheel bearing on Eric. It let go about 10 miles south of St Malo on Saturday around 8:30 am. Thanks to slick work by Britannia Rescue I was home at 22:10 the same day - with a considerable fuel saving. The roller carrier has disintegrated which caused the rollers to bunch up and allow the wheel to move about on turns causing severe pad knock back. I was able to manoeuvre on and off the relay trucks and the ferry with great care. No nasty noises but dangerous to continue. I’m meticulous about bearing adjustment so I think this failure is down to rubbish parts. The bearings are less than 5000 miles old. I’ve fitted new on both sides and added the stub axle stiffening mod so we’ll see how that goes, notwithstanding the mucking about with shims that it entails. I’ll be checking them at least annually from now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 Hi Pete, What make were your bearings. I note on the Moss WebCat that the outer bearing is £20 and the inner bearing is £21 These are NTN Japan. However the kit (both bearings) comes in at a miserly £12 - no manuf markings. Why sell rubbish Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glasgow4a Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 Stub axle stiffening mod? please explain cheers Ian. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MichaelH Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 Front bearings wobble because the tightness is so uncontrolled by adding a shimmed tube between inner and out bearings the use of a DTI ensures that the bearings and tube have a fixed measured end float This means that the two bearings act as one with no wobble between thwm Cost £50 ish plus the use of a DTI Then get the best bearings which are expensive- like timkens And you;ve saved a lot of hassle You could always go for the new big stubb axles and hub kits Or save money and go on worrying about your front berings Quote Link to post Share on other sites
badhuis Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 2 hours ago, glasgow4a said: Stub axle stiffening mod? please explain cheers Ian. 2 hours ago, MichaelH said: by adding a shimmed tube between inner and out bearings the use of a DTI ensures that the bearings and tube have a fixed measured end float Would also like to know about the stiffening mod. And what is a DTI? Guess I am still lucky - as far as I know (owned for 28 years) my car still runs on its original bearings. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AndyR100 Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 An example supplier of the stiffening modification: https://www.triumphspecialtuning.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=40&product_id=87 DTI is Dial Test Indicator - used in this case to measure the amount of play. …… Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Moltu Posted September 19, 2022 Report Share Posted September 19, 2022 There have been some supply issues with Timken bearings over the past year or so. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mikej Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 I assume this stiffening mod is like the wheel bearing spacer fitted to Minis etc? If so then it seems well worth the effort. Is this something we should air in TRA? MikeJ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 For decades the stub axle was happy. It was only when people took it to the extremes, or there about's, of handling that people had to do something. In theory, tensioning the stubby will make it stiffer. But, where do you stop. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
iain Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 53 minutes ago, mikej said: I assume this stiffening mod is like the wheel bearing spacer fitted to Minis etc? If so then it seems well worth the effort. Is this something we should air in TRA? MikeJ This may well make an interesting article, however we need to be clear why this mod is needed. Is it because you are trying to avoid brake pad knock off due to stub axle flex at extreme cornering forces, rallying or racing? Or is just because it feels sensible, which as Roger implies is probably wholly unnecessary on a normal road car. Personally I’ve never induced this phenomenon……must try harder…..Not :-) Revingtons website states why the system was developed and it certainly reads like it’s for those who race and rally ….hard. Iain Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 1 minute ago, iain said: This may well make an interesting article, however we need to be clear why this mod is needed. Is it because you are trying to avoid brake pad knock off due to stub axle flex at extreme cornering forces, rallying or racing? Or is just because it feels sensible, which as Roger implies is probably wholly unnecessary on a normal road car. Personally I’ve never induced this phenomenon……must try harder…..Not :-) Revingtons website states why the system was developed and it certainly reads like it’s for those who race and rally ….hard. Iain +1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tr4aJim Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 Way back in the 70s I was driving my Mk1 Capri on the highway (around 60 mph) when the left front outer bearing failed. Luckily I was able to keep control and get it to the side of the road. The entire cage had disintegrated and the inner race “welded” itself to the stub axle. I had never driven the Capri over aggressively (well not so much), but about 2 years before I had upgraded the suspension to heavy duty components (shocks, bushings, Koni’s, heavier roll bar, wider wheels/tires, etc), but replaced the bearings with the stock Ford parts. I always suspected that the bearing failure was due to the increased stresses from those components. When I did the repairs, a mechanic I knew told me to make sure I used Timken bearings as they were the best. Several years ago when I rebuilt the front suspension on my TR4A, I was amazed (and concerned) at the difference in prices for wheel bearings at the various US and UK suppliers. I finally decided to pay more, and go with Timken. Jim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 Just to be clear -ALL bearing manufacturers make different grades of quality for the same part number. The number may havea special suffix for application The part number is a reflection of the bearing size and the price runs along with the quality So not only do you need a quality makers name but the correct quality for the application. Do NOT buy cheap. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
trchris Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 I'm with Roger don't go cheap, as another alternative than the usual suspects try a bearing specialist, I use Anglia Bearing Company in Boston (they have other units and do mail order) they exactly match original bearings of all kind's wheel/ gearbox etc high quality and a hell of a lot cheaper and they do seals although I don't think the front hub seal. Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 My "go to" supplier of bearings is "Simply Bearings" They do mail order, & for any given part No. they list a range of qualities (& corresponding prices). You can also look up the bearing you need by dimensions if you don't have a part No. I made the mistake of buying a gearbox overhaul kit from Moss last year, the main bearings that came with it were Cr*p. Luckily when I complained I was sent proper ones FOC. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 We are back to this cheap rubbish parts topic again! If people stop buying this cheap stuff maybe it will disappear. These are good cars so spend the extra for a good quality name such as Timken from a bearing specialist. Too many inferior parts out there for our cars! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malcolm Tatton Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 Apparently Timkin no longer list the TR front bearings in their catalogue (according to the 'bearing specialist' that we use at work) and the numbers that I provided weren't recognised, so does anyone have the correct part numbers please? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
qkingston Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 Hi Malcolm, I got these from Bearing King: 07100S/07210X Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 1x2x0.5910 inch (07100S/07210X Timken) 03062/03162 Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 15.875x41.275x14.288mm (03062/03162 Timken) Also sold by Wych Bearings and others Rgds David Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malcolm Tatton Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 16 minutes ago, qkingston said: Hi Malcolm, I got these from Bearing King: 07100S/07210X Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 1x2x0.5910 inch (07100S/07210X Timken) 03062/03162 Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 15.875x41.275x14.288mm (03062/03162 Timken) Also sold by Wych Bearings and others Rgds David Thanks very much. I'll see what they say Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mick Forey Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 My TR6 has always had brake pad knock-back so giving a long first push of the brake pedal after some good cornering and a rattling noise, often reflected off walls. I have tried all sorts of wheel bearings and adjustments but it never went away. However, earlier this year I bought one of the TR Enterprises kits through TRGB. An amazing difference, hard pedal no matter what you do with the car and no rattling noises. I recommend this mod even if you have the smallest amount of pad knock-back. Mick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Priest Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Mick Forey said: My TR6 has always had brake pad knock-back so giving a long first push of the brake pedal after some good cornering and a rattling noise, often reflected off walls. I have tried all sorts of wheel bearings and adjustments but it never went away. However, earlier this year I bought one of the TR Enterprises kits through TRGB. An amazing difference, hard pedal no matter what you do with the car and no rattling noises. I recommend this mod even if you have the smallest amount of pad knock-back. Mick That's exactly my experience as well Mick. Personally, I think the kit does very little to stiffen the stub axle. Rather, it simply allows the free play to be set precisely. Steve Edited September 20, 2022 by Steve Priest Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 4 hours ago, qkingston said: Hi Malcolm, I got these from Bearing King: 07100S/07210X Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 1x2x0.5910 inch (07100S/07210X Timken) 03062/03162 Timken Tapered Roller Bearing 15.875x41.275x14.288mm (03062/03162 Timken) Also sold by Wych Bearings and others Rgds David Those are the ones I used a few years ago on a TR4. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Moltu Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Interesting that Bearing King also list the NTN equivalents. NTN are also listed in the word’s top 9 bearing manufacturers along with Timken. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Moltu Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 16 hours ago, Steve Priest said: That's exactly my experience as well Mick. Personally, I think the kit does very little to stiffen the stub axle. Rather, it simply allows the free play to be set precisely. Steve I agree. There is nothing wrong with the stub axle. Play/pad knock if is a reflection of out of adjustment wheel bearings as a general rule. However over tightening is a recipe for bearing failure. The anti knock off kits allow you to set the bearing end float accurately without the risk of over tightening the nut and overloading the bearing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glasgow4a Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 I used BRT Bearings part no BRT 298, These are NTN Bearings and available nationally, cheers Ian. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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