ULEZ - not the rant you might be expecting!

[Crawfie]

14 minutes ago, Kiwifrog said:

Geez I thought I was a grumpy old man, I see now I am just a beginner but I do find racist comments unsupportable especially being an immigrant myself. I always giggle to myself when British people living in foreign climes describe themselves as expats but people of other nationalities living in the UK are always immigrants.

One day we shall all live in peace and get on with each other ……hopefully before we blow each other up !!

Might take a few hundred years though 

But there  always seems to be one nutter who wants to rule the world ….

[PodOne]

Why when there is any sensible debate around this is it deemed as racism? It seems that freedom of speech and even thought is to be decried and verboten this is what stokes long term devision.

Yes we ruled a quarter of the world and left a stamp on it along with many other countries but then the romans and Greeks did the same and wrote the history that’s what victors do and then left a legacy for people to with what they wished. Values were some what different and appropriate to the times and should not judged with those reasonable for today without going all soft over it. Man up it’s history.
 

Bottom line we are full we can’t even home our own homeless. Let the surrounding countries in Africa and Middle East some of whom are oil rich and by the way created by the British pick up the bill they charge plenty at the pumps. It’s not our responsibility if Afghanistan has slipped in to medieval barbarism let other Muslim countries get them to change and adopt a more enlightened government. But they won’t as fundamentally they harbour the same values and intent. Alexander the Great and then British Army failed to subdue them in the 1800’s followed by the Russians and Americans so be it let them get on with it and revolt from within we lost too many good men and for what? A lot of these vets are living on the streets unable to find homes.

Agree the British ex pats don’t present a great image overseas and are akin to so called football supporters mentally. I feel ashamed of them. But then they are allowed to behave that way at home as there are no boundaries in place from the first entering school where woke lack of discipline begins. Bring back the birch and public flogging I hear you say! Might help, might not!

Integration is a political myth for many and has failed why add fuel to the fire?

Andy

[Mick Forey]

3 hours ago, Crawfie said:

British people living in foreign climes describe themselves as expats but people of other nationalities living in the UK are always immigrants.

Haha, so true. When living in the states my visa defined me as a "resident alien". I needed Roger's hat.

Mick

[acaie]

Judgung from the above I think it's about time we had a Political Scene forum, separate from the Social Scene and Alec's Inn.

[cp25616]

Totally agree wth your comments Andy, how refreshing to read your views and others who think along the same lines as myself for example. I am not affected by the London ULEZ money grabbing debacle living in southern Scotland BUT our version of a money-grabbing idiot namely this weeks SNP leader has made a ULEZ zone in central Glasgow!  Why. when the levels of pollution were below the set limits anyway. Yep you guessed it.... money!  Very little consultation took place in Glasgow's central district but they never listened anyway and rail-roaded it in. Now the Glasgow council are hiring ULEZ compliant vans and transport at the cost of £3,000 per week in order to allow their workers to avoid paying £60, yes £60 fines (half that if paid within a fortnight). How hypocritical is that then? This country is run by idiots unfortunately most of these so-called political idiots live in Scotland!  I was once proud to say I am Scottish now I hang my head in shame! The SNP couldn't run a raffle if it was for free.

What we need is a Common Sense Party. I, for one, would certainly vote for them as the rest are idiotic tossers.

Now look what you have started lol

Alan G

[harlequin]

14 hours ago, cp25616 said:

 

What we need is a Common Sense Party. I, for one, would certainly vote for them as the rest are idiotic tossers.

Now look what you have started lol

Alan G

Unfortunately nowadays our choices are, in most cases restricted to career politicians who's interests are seated first in promoting the wellbeing of the cosy little party that they belong to, followed, I hope by, this country's affairs and trailing a long way behind are the interests of the voters.

Previous generations of voter's had the likes of Wilson and Macmillan who had experienced life outside Westminster and therefore had a degree of empathy for their fellow man rather then the contempt that the current shower display. They also had a belief in the country rather then running it down at every opportunity, as seen in some of the previous posts which delight in highlighting the wrongs of Britain's colonial past and completely ignoring the many positive things that were achieve in that period of history.

George 

[Steve-B]

15 hours ago, cp25616 said:

What we need is a Common Sense Party. I, for one, would certainly vote for them as the rest are idiotic tossers.

Alan G

What we need desperately is a "None of the Above" write-in campaign at the elections. When "None of the Above" wins, they're all thrown out and a new election then ensues. Sure it will take longer, but we might have the chance at a better form of cretin in office...

[james christie]

Bring back David Sutch and his Monster Raving Loonies - or are they back already?

james

[RobH]

5 minutes ago, Steve-B said:

What we need desperately is a "None of the Above" write-in campaign at the elections. When "None of the Above" wins, they're all thrown out

I have long advocated a change in procedure where you do not vote for a candidate, but vote against all the ones you don't want. The candidate with fewest anti votes wins.  This has two benefits -  firstly every vote counts unlike at present,  and secondly it would demonstrate to the winner just how unpopular they actually are despite having won.  

[Hawk]

1 hour ago, RobH said:

 it would demonstrate to the winner just how unpopular they actually are despite having won.  

I love that idea

[SuzanneH]

4 hours ago, RobH said:

I have long advocated a change in procedure where you do not vote for a candidate, but vote against all the ones you don't want. The candidate with fewest anti votes wins.  This has two benefits -  firstly every vote counts unlike at present,  and secondly it would demonstrate to the winner just how unpopular they actually are despite having won.  

That suits me as since living in Hayes from 1976 when I married, my vote has never counted. I have even voted for The Monster Raving Loony Party too……..

Edited August 4, 2023 by SuzanneH

[Paul Hogan]

On 7/31/2023 at 8:47 PM, PodOne said:

ULEZ is nothing to do with air pollution just cash generation. Respiratory disease has aways being endemic and now more related to smoking, vaping added to pre-existing illnesses such as COPD/Asthma.  The figures are simply been manipulated for political gain. People are not bothered about the car being compliant or not its an unfair tax full stop and I would suggest restricts peoples freedom of movement based on the ability to pay added it now seems peoples ability to have free speech which has also quietly been removed with any opposition put down with the usual default of the r card followed by other woke bs.

 

Some years ago this country was able to declare that TB ( tuberculosis) had been eradicated.  That was a great plus for the National Health Service and especially for London where TB was was quite common.  However, TB is now back  and is on the rise in London, Leicester and places like Bradford with Scotland having the highest rate of TB mortality for women.  interestingly, our prison population is also a hot spot for catching or developing TB. 

Why is that  you might ask?  Well the government's own website says that the rise in TB is due in part to immigration from high risk countries where TB is endemic and yet it was our very own government - whose main job is to defend and safeguard its people-   that allowed this to happen by removing the need for international travellers from countries like India and Pakistan etc. to  have certified proof that they were not carrying the disease.  The reason for getting rid of this certificate was because it was thought to be discriminatory.  Well that may well have been the case but the upshot is that our country, which not so very long ago was declared free of TB, is now experiencing an alarming growth in it.  Having eradicated TB it was madness to allow it back in just because some people objected to getting a clean bill of health. 

Mass International air travel has been one of the greatest strides in technology  but it has also been one of the biggest vectors for its ability to spread disease around the world.  In contrast, the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic took over six months to spread around the globe due to it being transmitted via world shipping routes. Covid took less than six weeks due to air travel but did we stop people arriving from Covid hit countries? No we didn't and people died as a result. 

hoges. 

[Ian Vincent]

15 minutes ago, Paul Hogan said:

Some years ago this country was able to declare that TB ( tuberculosis) had been eradicated.  That was a great plus for the National Health Service and especially for London where TB was was quite common.  However, TB is now back  and is on the rise in London, Leicester and places like Bradford with Scotland having the highest rate of TB mortality for women.  interestingly, our prison population is also a hot spot for catching or developing TB. 

Why is that  you might ask?  Well the government's own website says that the rise in TB is due in part to immigration from high risk countries where TB is endemic and yet it was our very own government - whose main job is to defend and safeguard its people-   that allowed this to happen by removing the need for international travellers from countries like India and Pakistan etc. to  have certified proof that they were not carrying the disease.  The reason for getting rid of this certificate was because it was thought to be discriminatory.  Well that may well have been the case but the upshot is that our country, which not so very long ago was declared free of TB, is now experiencing an alarming growth in it.  Having eradicated TB it was madness to allow it back in just because some people objected to getting a clean bill of health. 

Mass International air travel has been one of the greatest strides in technology  but it has also been one of the biggest vectors for its ability to spread disease around the world.  In contrast, the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic took over six months to spread around the globe due to it being transmitted via world shipping routes. Covid took less than six weeks due to air travel but did we stop people arriving from Covid hit countries? No we didn't and people died as a result. 

hoges. 

In the 1980s I went to work in Australia, accompanied by my wife.  Part of the process of obtaining our visas involved both of us having to have chest X-rays to confirm we were TB free.  Because we (well my wife) had just had a baby and my wife was breast feeding, she asked if there were any alternatives - "Yes" said the immigration official at the Australian Consulate, "You don't get to go to Australia".  I don't know if they still have the same requirement but at the time it was explained that it was down to Australia being a relatively TB free country and if it did get established it would spread like wildfire.

Rgds Ian

[stillp]

Does the ULEX fee apply in addition to the congestion charge?

Pete

[Steve-B]

2 minutes ago, stillp said:

Does the ULEX fee apply in addition to the congestion charge?

Pete

Yes it does, and for the privilege of driving you also get to pay Road Tax and fuel duty. So quadruple taxation!

[stillp]

£27.50 per day then? Ouch! I'm pleased I don't need to go to London any more.

Pete

[RobH]

1 hour ago, stillp said:

£27.50 per day then? Ouch! I'm pleased I don't need to go to London any more.

 

Don't forget the £30+ to park too. 

[mike ellis]

I wonder if it is known what percentage of cars entering the zone have to pay the ULEZ charge.  I have two 14 year old petrol cars plus the TR, none of them are liable for the charge.

[Mick Forey]

In a news article I read a few days ago, it was said that over 90% of the residents vehicles were already compliant.

[PodOne]

5 hours ago, Paul Hogan said:

Some years ago this country was able to declare that TB ( tuberculosis) had been eradicated.  That was a great plus for the National Health Service and especially for London where TB was was quite common.  However, TB is now back  and is on the rise in London, Leicester and places like Bradford with Scotland having the highest rate of TB mortality for women.  interestingly, our prison population is also a hot spot for catching or developing TB. 

Why is that  you might ask?  Well the government's own website says that the rise in TB is due in part to immigration from high risk countries where TB is endemic and yet it was our very own government - whose main job is to defend and safeguard its people-   that allowed this to happen by removing the need for international travellers from countries like India and Pakistan etc. to  have certified proof that they were not carrying the disease.  The reason for getting rid of this certificate was because it was thought to be discriminatory.  Well that may well have been the case but the upshot is that our country, which not so very long ago was declared free of TB, is now experiencing an alarming growth in it.  Having eradicated TB it was madness to allow it back in just because some people objected to getting a clean bill of health. 

Mass International air travel has been one of the greatest strides in technology  but it has also been one of the biggest vectors for its ability to spread disease around the world.  In contrast, the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic took over six months to spread around the globe due to it being transmitted via world shipping routes. Covid took less than six weeks due to air travel but did we stop people arriving from Covid hit countries? No we didn't and people died as a result. 

hoges. 

Very true there continues to be a rapid growth in the numbers of TB cases and its criminal that anyone planning staying here long terms isn't required to prove they are TB free and can hardly be classed as discrimination rather common sense. The current system simply ends up costing the NHS resources to deal with a problem which should have being tackled in the country of origin.

Often cases will not respond to first line triple therapy as the TB strain/case has developed resistance to the usual antibiotic treatments due in part to incomplete treatment in the home county due to cost or even here in the UK as patients send the medication home to relatives to self treat again to no avail as its an incomplete regime of treatment. Sub clinical doses are the result = resistance. In fact there are now some trains of TB which are completely resistant to antibiotics which is worrying situation. The solution would be to hold people in isolation from high risk countries until proven negative or until treatment has led to a negative result. While also testing for Hepatitis C which takes 50k to treat and again there is a thriving black market for drug treatments especially in Russia and Eastern Europe with the UK being seen as a good place to come for free NHS treatment. There is also a thriving black market in acquiring National Insurance numbers which is a ticket to everything else tax payers have paid for!

TB wise it may take us back to long term sanatoriums of the past along and see the other long term complications that TB can cause. Not much hope as we can't even fund what we have!

Falling vaccination rates in the bigger cities as well as London is a problem along with the idiot anti vac brigade (for me if your child isn't vaccinated then no school place or child benefits. Why should my grandchildren or children be put at risk?). Also there is little resources to track and trace contacts as often the cohort of people wish to stay below the radar to the authorities eg drug users and illegal immigrants. The rising lack of housing and crowding similar to those of victorian Britain is a factor as are our over crowded prisons. Lovely combination to boost TB rates.

Off topic but hey ho.

Andy

[PodOne]

On 8/5/2023 at 7:46 PM, Mick Forey said:

In a news article I read a few days ago, it was said that over 90% of the residents vehicles were already compliant.

If its 90% then was it worth the capital cost for the remaining 10%? Given the 10% in 10 years most likley dropped to 2-5%. 

It's just a ruse to use the technology to charge for anything that moves on 2 or 4 wheels including electric. Get the masses used to paying and they will keep paying later on while we can waste the income on as many loon polices as we want. I hope all the hackers out there take the system down on a daily basis.

Even robbers wear masks.

Andy

Edited August 7, 2023 by PodOne
spelling!

[SuzanneH]

14 hours ago, PodOne said:

Very true there continues to be a rapid growth in the numbers of TB cases and its criminal that anyone planning staying here long terms isn't required to prove they are TB free and can hardly be classed as discrimination rather common sense. The current system simply ends up costing the NHS resources to deal with a problem which should have being tackled in the country of origin.

Often cases will not respond to first line triple therapy as the TB strain/case has developed resistance to the usual antibiotic treatments due in part to incomplete treatment in the home county due to cost or even here in the UK as patients send the medication home to relatives to self treat again to no avail as its an incomplete regime of treatment. Sub clinical doses are the result = resistance. In fact there are now some trains of TB which are completely resistant to antibiotics which is worrying situation. The solution would be to hold people in isolation from high risk countries until proven negative or until treatment has led to a negative result. While also testing for Hepatitis C which takes 50k to treat and again there is a thriving black market for drug treatments especially in Russia and Eastern Europe with the UK being seen as a good place to come for free NHS treatment. There is also a thriving black market in acquiring National Insurance numbers which is a ticket to everything else tax payers have paid for!

TB wise it may take us back to long term sanatoriums of the past along and see the other long term complications that TB can cause. Not much hope as we can't even fund what we have!

Falling vaccination rates in the bigger cities as well as London is a problem along with the idiot anti vac brigade (for me if your child isn't vaccinated then no school place or child benefits. Why should my grandchildren or children be put at risk?). Also there is little resources to track and trace contacts as often the cohort of people wish to stay below the radar to the authorities eg drug users and illegal immigrants. The rising lack of housing and crowding similar to those of victorian Britain is a factor as are our over crowded prisons. Lovely combination to boost TB rates.

Off topic but hey ho.

Andy

+1 and it’s worse than Victorian Britain, what about all the houses in multiple occupancy and the rent the LL gets is paying the mortgage for the house and so it goes on on the LLs property portfolio. My property/ home ( which I own) is currently surrounded by three such properties in multiple occupancy but the tenants have no duty of care, responsibility or  pride.
And just don’t mention TB and all the spitting in the street and my front garden, absolute pigs.

My grandmother died in St Mary’s Paddington in 1931 of TB……!!! My mother was aged just 4 with 3 older siblings. Imagine this happening again in this day and age?

Edited August 6, 2023 by SuzanneH

[Ian Vincent]

What makes me smile are the constant references in the media to ULEZ being a green policy. It isn’t, it’s the opposite of green.  After 29th August I will stop taking my Euro 5 diesel car to London and take my wife’s 3 litre petrol car.  ULEZ compliant but emits twice as much CO2. 

Rgds Ian

[Keith66]

On 8/6/2023 at 8:35 PM, Ian Vincent said:

What makes me smile are the constant references in the media to ULEZ being a green policy. It isn’t, it’s the opposite of green.  After 29th August I will stop taking my Euro 5 diesel car to London and take my wife’s 3 litre petrol car.  ULEZ compliant but emits twice as much CO2. 

Rgds Ian

Think you've missed the point of ULEZ its NOT about CO2 and global warming its about local emissions of NOx and Particulates which studies indicate are linked to increased respiratory disease esp in built up areas with high traffic volumes err like London.

So your petrol 3.0 is fine but your old diesel emitting ten times the the amount of NOx and more particulates is not.

Moving away from high CO2 activity is a global problem as what the USA and China does will affect world climate, the emissions of NOx and particulates are much more localised hence restricting the use of the most polluting vehicles in built up areas.

The message is simple don’t drive an old diesel in London, It can’t be too much of a hardship for most people on here with TR classics in the garage as even my old £500 Rover 25 daily driver is compliant.

 Keith

[Hawk]

On 8/10/2023 at 10:06 PM, Keith66 said:

 .....its about local emissions of NOx and Particulates which studies indicate are linked to increased respiratory disease esp in built up areas with high traffic volumes err like London.

......hence restricting the use of the most polluting vehicles in built up areas.

 

Which is precisely why I am pissed off about having to pay a charge for my motorcycle. 

Many motorcycles (even older ones) would meet the standards but emissions are not tested at MOT or always provided by manufacturer .... so we get charged.  

My motorcycle is most certainly NOT in the most polluting vehicle category and significantly cleaner that my exempt TR.