Alternator Kit recommendations

[ChrisR-4A]

UPDATE. Having researched online I rechecked the dynamos and when turned with a fully charged nutrunner both we working fine. Back to the car, control box not working, cleaned contacts and sprayed with cleaner and it started working. It's nearly 20 years old so have replaced with new one, keep g old as spare. 

Thanks for all reply. 

 

 

 

 

Hi guys, after running dynamos for the last 28 years I now have two showing no output so I'm looking to fit an alternator to the 4A.                        I already have a narrow belt conversion and electric fan and don't intend to fit any other electrical upgrades. Can anyone recommend which kit to buy. 

Thanks, Chris

Edited July 26, 2023 by ChrisR-4A
Update

[RobH]

If you need to buy the mounting hardware and electrical connector too, the options are really limited to the usual suppliers of TR stuff Chris.

If you do fit an alternator, don't forget a heat shield to keep the exhaust manifold heat away. I don't think you can buy one ready made. 

Are your dynamos really defunct or do they just need new brushes?

Edited July 21, 2023 by RobH

[lynchpin]

Hi 

If you can't do it yourself you will be able to find someone to overhaul a dynamo, (had mine done about 3yrs ago, much cheaper than getting an alternator kit (unless you now need more output)..

   Phil..

[Hamish]

If you want to go alternator consider the Racetorations kits. 
https://www.racetorations.co.uk/product/alternator-fitting-kit-tr2-4a/

https://www.racetorations.co.uk/product/lightweight-40a-universal-alternator/
 

You can search cheaper alternators  

 

 

[Nigel C]

Have to say I just made up a support post, found a suitable bolt in my neighbours garage, used the same dynamo top adjuster bracket and bought a small alternator from Car Builder Solutions for £120 

 

 

[ianc]

I believe Revington can supply a heat shield, as well as alternator, mountings & narrow belt conversion.

Ian Cornish

Edited July 21, 2023 by ianc

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

1 hour ago, Nigel C said:

Have to say I just made up a support post, found a suitable bolt in my neighbours garage, used the same dynamo top adjuster bracket and bought a small alternator from Car Builder Solutions for £120 

 

 

Ditto.

 

[PaulAnderson]

My alternator is a 40 amp Nippon Denso unit from Bastuck in Germany as described in this forum  Post  where it’s listed as a 40A E310 comp unit as per this link

Paul

Edited July 21, 2023 by PaulAnderson

[John Morrison]

Chris 

check out Ian C’s article in technicalities very comprehensive and do the job yourself for not a lot of dosh

Did it twenty odd years ago never an issue and very glad I did

Done 2 or 3 group members cars since

Ask anything you want to know 

John

[Malbaby]

You could go all the way and fit a harmonic balancer as well.

[Lebro]

New can of worms opened 

ob

[Ralph Whitaker]

17 hours ago, ChrisR-4A said:

Hi guys, after running dynamos for the last 28 years I now have two showing no output so I'm looking to fit an alternator to the 4A.                        I already have a narrow belt conversion and electric fan and don't intend to fit any other electrical upgrades. Can anyone recommend which kit to buy. 

Thanks, Chris

You can get a 45amp alternator from ebay for £60, Lucas 15ACR type, that comes complete with fan and pulley. Make sure you buy one with the correct orientation of mounting and adjuster holes.  You can buy a loom if you don`t want to make your own from Moss, and you need a10x 975mm belt (or at least that`s what mine uses part no GCB10975.). I used some spacers on the existing dynamo bracket to mount the alternator and  I used the existing adjuster bar but re positioned on to a pump housing bolt instead of the dedicated boss at the side of the pump housing. I opted to keep my regulator box as a junction box, soldering link wires across the terminals underneath, out of sight, and removed the guts and the space is now used to carry spare bulbs and fuses. I have never fitted a heatshield and it has been OK for the last three years with some long runs of 150 miles non stop and loads of 75 mile runs, this is a 3A with standard exhaust manifold and single down pipe. I figure that if the plastic cover on the alternator is showing no signs of getting too hot then the works inside should be OK too. I opted for the 45amp alternator as I could not see the point of buying a higher output one and then running it through a 30amp ammeter, although it only ever goes near the 30 amp mark immediately after starting and then only briefly.

Hope this helps, Ralph

 

[RobH]

15 minutes ago, Ralph Whitaker said:

You can get a 45amp alternator from ebay for £60,

You can but there is a lot of cr*p out there being sold cheaply.   IMHO it's better to go to a reputable source even if it is more expensive.

17 minutes ago, Ralph Whitaker said:

I figure that if the plastic cover on the alternator is showing no signs of getting too hot then the works inside should be OK too

Not necessarily the case at all.     Heat is a killer for all semiconductors - don't forget they are dissipating heat themselves and need air circulation to remove that heat.  The hotter the air around the device the hotter the device gets internally because it cannot lose its heat as well, so although the air isn't hot enough to harm the plastic it may well be hot enough to harm the rectifiers.  You are lucky to have got away with it for so long. 

[ianc]

Heatshield: on the Works' TR4 Rally cars, the Comps Dept fitted a heatshield to protect the dynamo from the 4-branch exhaust, and it was still in place when I bought 4VC in 1969. 

When Revington re-built the car for me in 1990-1993, I asked him to fit an alternator, and used the type fitted to the TR7 (LRA101, quite bulky by modern standards and not a large rating, about 34 amps).  The heatshield was re-fitted.

When, a few years later, Neil acquired 6VC, he fitted an alternator, but not a heatshield - and he cooked his alternator.  He made a copy of the shield from 4VC for his second alternator.

A heatshield is easy to make from a sheet of aluminium or an old tin can, and costs almost nothing - so why take the risk of ruining an alternator?

Ian Cornish

[Tr4aJim]

I’ve been running with no heat shield on my alternator, even though just about every year my intensions are to fit one. Instead of fitting a fixed metal one, what about those heat resistant “wraps”? I’ve seen them listed for starter/alternator use (for example DEI). The advantage is they are easy to add/remove with no fabrication. Opinions?

Jim

[RobH]

You definitely don't want to enclose the alternator in anything Jim - that will stop the vital cooling air from circulating. 

[ianc]

Rob is correct - the alternator needs to pass air internally from front to back in order to stop it overheating, and, in addition, some heat will be lost from its casing to passing air.

Ian Cornish

[monty]

Easiest option is the heat shield from Revington. Fits well & does the job.

[Tr4aJim]

Thanks!

[Ralph Whitaker]

17 hours ago, ianc said:

Rob is correct - the alternator needs to pass air internally from front to back in order to stop it overheating, and, in addition, some heat will be lost from its casing to passing air.

Ian Cornish

I have been mulling over the picture I posted above, and unless I am mistaken it looks like the fan fitted to the alternator would pull air from the back to the front, which seems wrong as it will be fighting against the air flowing through the radiator. I have looked at loads of pics of new alternators and all use the same fan. If I am right then it means the fan is pulling hot air from around the exhaust into the alternator, so perhaps a heat shield is even more neccessary.

I also note that on my A35, Triumph Vitesse, and Dolomite, all have the alternator on the side of the engine AWAY from the exhaust, so obviously placement on the TR3/4 is less than ideal.

I will have a look at Revingtons heat shield I think.

Ralph

[Lebro]

It's a centrifugal fan, so it pulls air from it's center, & flings it out wards. In this case, the way it is constructed, it will be drawing the majority of the air through the alternator, it cannot do anything else.  I guess that is why the 6 pots have it on the other side.

Bob

Edited July 23, 2023 by Lebro

[RobH]

5 minutes ago, Lebro said:

It's a centrifugal fan, so it pulling air from it's center, & flinging it out wards.

Yes, I believe it is done that way so the electronics at the back supposedly gets the coolest air first, before it is further heated by the field and rotor windings which are less susceptible to heat damage.   

[Nigel C]

and this is why the cook, I have tried to get a fan that operated the other way...I am told they are out there but rare...hence I have gone down the smaller alternator and a heat shield 

[RAHTR4]

Hi Chris,

You have a P.M.

Regards, Richard

[Andy Moltu]

Alternators also tend to draw air from the rear to limit fan belt debris from being blown into the alternator.

Genuine Nippon Denso alternators are good but there are a lot of repro ones from China on the market. The original fitment may well have been for a Nissan Micra I believe.

There is not always a linear relationship between price and quality/longevity so do check what you are getting. The other thing to consider is that one of the design parameters for race alternators may be weight and size rather than longevity. The four pot engines do give alternators a combination of vibration and heat which isn’t ideal for electronics. Heat shielding is readily available from the likes of carbuilder solutions and EBay and simple to cut and protect your alternators from the exhaust manifold. A length of 2” ducting from the rad cowl aimed at the alternator/manifold could help.

Heat shielding can be cut with scissors and bent by hand. (No skill required)  Manifold wrapped too.