EFI for TR5/6?

[Andrew Smith]

On 7/30/2022 at 8:55 AM, cp25616 said:

Andrew if it ain't broke don't fix it. Standard system works spot on for me and costs me next to nothing.

Alan G

Or maybe fiddle with it until it is Alan.......

Cheers, Andrew

[marki]

Hi Andrew.

  Emerald were fantastic when I did my conversion about 5yrs ago, better fuel economy and an extra 20hp on the rolling rd.

I’m also running an idle air control valve, starts just like a modern. You don’t even have to get in when it’s cold to start it.

  Good luck, Mark.

[stuart]

14 hours ago, marki said:

 You don’t even have to get in when it’s cold to start it.

  Good luck, Mark.

 

Remote starter?

Stuart.

[FatJon]

I use a Megasquirt 3 ECU with Jenvey throttle bodies, wideband lambda controller and idle speed control. Runs fantastic, no stink of over rich mixture and much improved performance and economy.

 

[TRTOM2498PI]

Hi Andrew,

I think the kit has been developed further since the early days with Emerald.

I run a Newman hybrid cam, with more overlap than a CP 150 cam. It idles beautifully, & smooth low down and power when you you're on flat chat.

A well balanced engine, with a more aggressive cam does not idle like a standard engine, even on Lucas PI, much smoother.  Seen several built like this.

 

Cheers.

[TriumphV8]

I started with one of the first conversions on TR6.

Mine was the Rover V8 engine in TR6 more than 20 years ago.

System was Megasquirt 1, later swapped to Megasquirt 2 and some years I got one more TR6 with 6 cylinder and again Megasquirt 2 with CP manifolds and six throttle plates. I am happy with both. 

[harrytr5]

Andrew

If you are going to the weakened International I will be there in the modified class so you can have a gander. I will be judging the other categories.

Regards Harry

[Andrew Smith]

1 hour ago, harrytr5 said:

Andrew

If you are going to the weakened International I will be there in the modified class so you can have a gander. I will be judging the other categories.

Regards Harry

Harry,

Thanks, but I'll not be there as the dates clash with a planned motorbike road tip to Germany and the Austrian Alps.

Cheers, Andrew

[Andrew Smith]

On 8/1/2022 at 2:11 PM, TRTOM2498PI said:

Hi Andrew,

I think the kit has been developed further since the early days with Emerald.

I run a Newman hybrid cam, with more overlap than a CP 150 cam. It idles beautifully, & smooth low down and power when you you're on flat chat.

A well balanced engine, with a more aggressive cam does not idle like a standard engine, even on Lucas PI, much smoother.  Seen several built like this.

 

Cheers.

Hi Tom,

VUX's engine is bog standard (apart from being gas flowed) on an original 150 cam and ideal for touring (which I plan to get back into) and my kind of driving these days.

I need to chat to Emerald.

Cheers, Andrew 

[Richard Pope]

15 hours ago, TriumphV8 said:

I started with one of the first conversions on TR6.

Mine was the Rover V8 engine in TR6 more than 20 years ago.

System was Megasquirt 1, later swapped to Megasquirt 2 and some years I got one more TR6 with 6 cylinder and again Megasquirt 2 with CP manifolds and six throttle plates. I am happy with both. 

As part of my restoration I'm converting to EFI but still need coil packs and ECU. On my other car I have a MegaSquirt MS2/Extra and it was a nightmare to get it going simply because it needs a map and if you do not know how to do this in detail, it is a pretty difficult. Having got there it is great.

Emerald is pretty expensive vs MS system so does anyone have a map for a TR6 one could use as a base?

[FatJon]

6 hours ago, Richard Pope said:

As part of my restoration I'm converting to EFI but still need coil packs and ECU. On my other car I have a MegaSquirt MS2/Extra and it was a nightmare to get it going simply because it needs a map and if you do not know how to do this in detail, it is a pretty difficult. Having got there it is great.

Emerald is pretty expensive vs MS system so does anyone have a map for a TR6 one could use as a base?

Yes, I have a working map for ms3 which runs purrfectly on my 71 TR6 PI engine.

It’s setup for 6x200cc bosch injectors, 6 tower wasted spark coilpack, jenvey idle speed controller and a zeitronix wideband.

and 36-1 crank wheel and VR sensor.

It will likely get you running but every engine needs further tuning to get it just right. For example the temperature sensor curves, exact angle of crank position sensor, tacho drive, type of MAP sensor etc.

The TR was about my 10th MS install of the last 20 years so I’m fairly experienced with it. I still spent some weeks getting things just right, and a lot of wiring, relays fuses and pit language. To be brutally honest, if tuning and electronics are not really your thing you may be better spending the extra on the Emerald which also comes with Dave Walkers wisdom and help.

[JohnRoberts]

EFI conversion

Talk to Kevin at Classic Fuel Injection. 07968 448803.

He is more than helpful.

Regards JohnR

[CK's TR6]

When I went from MS2 to MS3 the tune wouldn’t load. Had to enter everything in manually. I may have a MS2 map around in an old desktop. I will look around. I use an EDIS setup which may change things some. As for VE, 0.030” over, TSI275 cam, 1.55 rollers, port n polish, Triumph Tune header, bespoke intake. 3 bar fuel. 

[CK's TR6]

Found a old thumb drive. 2015 it was a MS2 ECU. 

 

2015-09-05_18.41.43.msq

[JochemsTR]

21 hours ago, Richard Pope said:

Emerald is pretty expensive vs MS system so does anyone have a map for a TR6 one could use as a base?

VE Table is based on Fuel injectorsize, Fuel Pressure, Fueling type, Lambda Target. So be carefull with copying. 

[Richard Pope]

Thanks all. Appreciated.

[roy53]

On 7/29/2022 at 9:20 PM, ntc said:

Hi Andrew 

Hope your well , begs the question why? After all the miles you have covered with the std pi system, me no way would I change it.

+1     Why ?

ROY

Sorry Andrew just found your reply to Neil.   Still +1 though

Edited August 7, 2022 by roy53
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[unclepete]

Hi Andrew

Thought I'd pose a few questions about EFI as I'm also considering going that route!

1. 6 Throttle bodies or Just 1 ?

2. Crank Position Sensor or Distributor Mounted Engine Position Sensor (hall effect)?

3. Which ECU? seems the consensus is Megasquirt or MaxxECU.

4. Idle Air Control Valve - Drill and tap the inlet Manifold or use the balance screws on the throttle body?

Edited December 2, 2022 by unclepete

[Spit_2.5PI]

Peter, for your idle air you might consider using a hose barb fitting, like one of the two you have already for the metering unit and brake servo. Substitute this for the blanking plug which is in the third throttle body and then you can run a hose off to your idle air valve. This is what I'm experimenting with in my (still mechanical) PI setup. I have a small stainless ball valve on the other end of the hose, just under the dash. I can set the fast idle, or close it completely and then the PI idle valve on the front throttle body determines the rpm. See the pink tube at the bottom of the picture, which goes off to the cabin. Note, no brake servo on a Spitfire. It's 6mm bore tube which is perfect for fast idle, but should probably be slightly larger bore for a modern car start, crawl along, etc. without having to use the throttle at all.

Cheers, Richard

[unclepete]

Hi Richard

I'm not using an original retrofitted PI set up. The 6 Throttle bodies would be Jenvey or similar.

The above picture is Marki's set up by the way.

 

Ta Peter

Edited December 3, 2022 by unclepete

[FatJon]

With a crank position sensor you can lose the entire distributor and fit a blanking plug.

I use an Megasquirt 3, Easy to tune, had them on numerous cars with perfect reliability. Independent throttle bodies give excellent performance and sound lovely. They are a little more challenging to tune than a single throttle setup but nothing to difficult. I used Jenveys on a  Baustuck manifold. I also used a jenvey idle controller and their screw in idle takeoffs to fit into the ready made holes in the bodies. If you want idle control you will need the megasquirt hybrid ITB mode which uses manifold vacuum as the fuelling and ignition reference at low load and transitions to using throttle angle at higher loads. Not all aftermarket ECUs have this facility. Idle speed control is lovely, I would not be without it!

An wideband EGO (lambda) system is well worth the small extra cost. It makes initial tuning a doddle.

 

[CK's TR6]

I converted an extra distributor body to a “cam” sensor for the MS3x. This allows sequential injection versus batch. And it simplifies the whole tachometer thing (ie remains as manufactured).

[PodOne]

6 hours ago, CK's TR6 said:

I converted an extra distributor body to a “cam” sensor for the MS3x. This allows sequential injection versus batch. And it simplifies the whole tachometer thing (ie remains as manufactured).

Clever idea suspect it will give a smoother idle control. Did you use a Hall effect sensor?

Combined with a crank sensor would also reduce timing scatter and help further.

Andy

[unclepete]

19 hours ago, FatJon said:

With a crank position sensor you can lose the entire distributor and fit a blanking plug.

I've already got a distributor so why lose it? Also what would drive my tacho?

If I fitted a crank position sensor, wouldn't I also need a Coil pack etc?

Is one system better than the other?

[JochemsTR]

IDLE Video

This is my idle video. seems pretty stable to me....no sequential.

Edited December 3, 2022 by JochemsTR