Paul J Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 The wood rimmed after market wheels would seem to be of a much safer design than the leather clad wheels and the originals as the rim and spokes are manufactured from the same plate. My original wheel is showing signs of the Bakelite type material cracking between rim and spokes, replacing it is priority but what with, not sure a restored original is the answer as the fabric is older than it was probably intended to last. Wood rimmed seems a strong design and probably the safest alternative. Paul Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Paul, Wood splinters embedded in the abdomen or chest in a head-on might not be a good thing. They may not show up on Xray and carry bugs in the grain. But I get the message about one-piece rim and spokes, as long as the hub is welded on ! Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stillp Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Aren't the spokes of the original wheels welded to a steel core in the rim? Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted June 19, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Hi Hamish The manufacturer should be very very worried. This could have resulted in a colossal liability claim against them. No response is no good. They should promptly, like within hours, issue a statement of intent re this product. If thy don't go to the Motoring Press to ensure someone isn't killed by such a catastrophic failure. Iain Hi I do understand the concerns. I have them as well. Hence me raising it here. However it is my father that is the purchaser and end user and I have impressed upon him the wider issues. And that it is a trading standards matter as they have the nationwide picture and this incident could be information that they need. Also they are the body that can demand recalls. I am confident that he will address the issue asap. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 (edited) Hamish, will you fill out the report on this incident for the TRR's Parts Quality Initiative? The PQI could follow up using their role as an organ of the Register and perhaps light a fire under something that would seem to be a critical safety-related quality issue. Edited June 19, 2017 by Don H. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted June 19, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 Hamish, will you fill out the report on this incident for the TRR's Parts Quality Initiative? The PQI could follow up using their role as an organ of the Register and perhaps light a fire under something that would seem to be a critical safety-related quality issue. This is on the register web site "Clearly, we require the assistance of our members in this initiative. However we do expect that any transactions will have been entered and completed in "good faith" by both parties, with constructive dialogue and efforts made, and recorded if necessary, to resolve individual issues and problems." This is what will be happening first as I understand it. Then if needed it can be escallated. Please don't shoot the messenger. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 (edited) Not trying to sound at all like I'm shooting the messenger, Hamish, and apologies if it came across that way.The idea was to give you more tools to address the issue that didn't involve you or your father if you guys didn't want to take the subject on yourselves. Edited June 19, 2017 by Don H. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 If a woodrim wheel has splintered sufficiently to spear you, then the impact causing said splintering is likely to have been of sufficient ferocity to render the splinters the least of your worries . . . . . The original Bluemels wheel is a pretty solid piece of kit, but anno domini and rust can weaken the steel core very significantly, and ageing Bakelite can splinter into pretty effective spears . . . . . The point with Hamish's Dad's wheel is that it is almost new - old wheels failing is one of life's risks, but it shouldn't happen with a newish wheel. But then, if it's your day to die . . . . fate is inexorable. That's life. Cheers, Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ragtag Posted June 19, 2017 Report Share Posted June 19, 2017 I have several Mountney steering wheels that have been used on my cars over the years and it never dawned on me that the spokes and rim wouldn't be one continuous piece of metal because, as Hamish notes in his first post, there is a leather covered aluminium finisher covering the 'offending area. In the light of this report I just checked the oldest rim and sure enough it is held on by one rivet per spoke. The rivets are not pop rivets but steel rivets of the type used in shipbuilding that are peened from both sides. This steering wheel is at least 40 years old and did several seasons attached to my tarmac stages, rally car which had big tyres and no power steering. I suspect the issue reported by Hamish is either down to a bad batch or a cheapening of the materials used in the manufacture. It can't be the basic design or theis would have come to light a long time ago. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 I have several Mountney steering wheels that have been used on my cars over the years and it never dawned on me that the spokes and rim wouldn't be one continuous piece of metal because, as Hamish notes in his first post, there is a leather covered aluminium finisher covering the 'offending area. In the light of this report I just checked the oldest rim and sure enough it is held on by one rivet per spoke. The rivets are not pop rivets but steel rivets of the type used in shipbuilding that are peened from both sides. This steering wheel is at least 40 years old and did several seasons attached to my tarmac stages, rally car which had big tyres and no power steering. I suspect the issue reported by Hamish is either down to a bad batch or a cheapening of the materials used in the manufacture. It can't be the basic design or theis would have come to light a long time ago. Probably out sourced now to up their profit margin. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
boxofbits Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 In my view Mountney have never shown any real quality aesthetically in their products, and it now appears the safety is dubious also. I never liked the Pseudo leather ugly sleeves on the spoke-to-rim and often wondered if it was covering a poor joint. If made in China also it's likely to be doubly sub-standard. When I rebuilt my Mk1 Mini I looked for a period wheel, and found an Avanti (Frederick Butler) original which is very well engineered, robust and looks great. Kevin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted June 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 I have submitted some info to TR Register PQI http://www.tr-register.co.uk/pqi both the buyer and seller have been in contact and the seller has given assurances that the matter will be addressed. Stocks checked and sales of similar followed up. They were very concerned about this issue and it was felt they were taking appropriate action. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Did they ask ID questions, for the faulty item to be returned, so that it's origin could be identified, and process correction made? Did they offer a replacement PDQ? Or even a refund? John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cvtrian Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 I have submitted some info to TR Register PQI http://www.tr-register.co.uk/pqi both the buyer and seller have been in contact and the seller has given assurances that the matter will be addressed. Stocks checked and sales of similar followed up. They were very concerned about this issue and it was felt they were taking appropriate action. The PQI form has been submitted, by Hamish, it is formally recorded on the TRR system, and we will await the feedback and actions from the original supplier, clearly they have acted responsibly and promptly in the first instance. I expect they will return the item to the manufacturer for their examination and detail report before feeding back their findings to their customer as the wheel supplier, and hence hopefully to Hamish's father and then back to the PQI team. There are a number of PQI topics that have been researched and resolved in the last 12 months. Although this is not a TR related incident, (it was a Triumph Vitesse) nor was it a TR Register event (it was a TSSC event), and I have no idea if Hamish's father is even a TR Register member, due to the safety implications and the fact that a similar wheel could be (and many probably are) fitted to a TR, we (PQI team) will await the response and actions of the supplier, well known to many TRR members (although not a mainstream Triumph TR parts supplier - they primarily supply oils.............) before deciding what may/may not need to be done. Happy to support Hamish. Regards Ian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Well done, Hamish and Ian! I love this forum! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted June 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Ian Thank you for yours and the clubs lightening response to my PQI submission Your post above is also a very accurate and concise summary. And I appreciate that you have taken this on when there is really no direct link to TR's but have taken the safety related bigger picture to heart Thank you Agreed a wonderful club H Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Once again it appears you get what you pay for! Pay a bit extra & buy a Motalita wheel. Had them for many years & never had any problems. Great product that is all a one piece alloy rim bolted with numerous screws & nuts to a substantial boss. Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 An excellent response and I how outcome. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted June 20, 2017 Report Share Posted June 20, 2017 Excellent. Those of us with looong memories will recall the club alerted the Minstry of Transport that front wishbone brackets were failing. Glad to know that this willingenss to act responsibly lives on. I had never, ever, considered a steering wheel could fail....."learn and live". Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 (edited) Well, well! Rimmers clearly believe that all publicity is good publicity, and that steering wheels will be in the minds of all Triumpheros. Anyone else got this email this morning? John Edited June 21, 2017 by john.r.davies Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Well, well! Rimmers clearly believe that all publicity is good publicity, and that steering wheels will be in the minds of all Triumpheros. Anyone else got this email this morning? rimmers steering wheels.jpg John Not on their mailing list luckily. FWIW I did talk to Jeff Marks at Moss about this yesterday and they stopped selling Mountney products a while ago but he was concerned about it and will pass this information on to other suppliers he knew that were. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 In my limited experience with quality issues with vendors it became clear to me they do not all (always) follow techical forums like this one, certainly not on a daily basis, which is understandable, as some suppliers sell parts for several marques. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR5tar Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 A great example of the PQI offering support to members. Anything that can place more pressure on manufacturers and suppliers to acknowledge and rectify these problems is a good thing. One thing I'd like to see the club do, is really highlight the PQI on its home page, as I'm still not sure it's as well known as it should be to the wider membership. Extra promotion of it has to be a good thing and not only for TRR members. Cheers, Darren Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 For those with a real concern for safety and 'xtremely' deep pockets: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRIUMPH-TR2-3-ORIGINAL-60s-steering-wheels-Les-leston-SPINGALL-VILLEN-HANN-/253002579553?hash=item3ae820fe61:g:dGkAAOSwLnBX9rTW (Seller's name is appropriate) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobH Posted June 21, 2017 Report Share Posted June 21, 2017 Well at least the p&p is free..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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