Tom Boyd Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Neil, myself and my millers rep are waiting for your extensive explanation as to why people shouldn't use there products. I look forward to your reply. Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Tom I did not mention any product.......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Boyd Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Yeah..... You did. Well that's how I read your posts like others have ???? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Hi Neil & Tom, can you grow up just a little bit and get back on topic. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rog1 Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 (edited) "Yeah..... You did. Well that's how I read your posts like others have " Really!? This forum offers great info from many contributors. I can't see why some would misread this as endorsing or not, a particular brand of oil? It's not the only place for info & as ntc stated, "A search will tell you all not just on here " So we can all do a bit of off-forum research & find other useful info. Useful contributions are usually more helpful than crass comments. Regards Edited November 17, 2016 by rog1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Boyd Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Hi Neil & Tom, can you grow up just a little bit and get back on topic. Roger No problem, apologies. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 Personally I'd utilise an old-fashioned running-in oil, straight mineral oil SAE30, for a newly built/rebuilt TR engine . . . . . at least for the first 500 miles or maybe a bit more. Then filter change and switch to whatever oil is preferred for normal running . . . . . Thereafter, it doesn't really matter if you mix oils of similar specification . . . . at least not in my experience ! Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted November 17, 2016 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 but do 20-50 and 20-60 from different brewers represent 'similar specification' ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted November 17, 2016 Report Share Posted November 17, 2016 but do 20-50 and 20-60 from different brewers represent 'similar specification' ? IMO/E, yes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 +1 Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aardvark Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 I don't know if I've missed the point but should the question be 'is penrite classic triumph exactly the same as penrite classic light but with a different label?' Anyone know? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GT6M Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Penrite would seem to differ. They note Penrite Classic Light 20W-60 is a mineral oil, with 1600 ppm Zn. http://www.penriteoil.com.au/products.php?id_categ=1&id_viscosity=118&id_products=638 Err yer look,n at wrang stuff, ordinary light 20/60 is no synth, as said the 20/60 +, the racing blend,so t,speak, is fully syth, look it up. M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Err yer look,n at wrang stuff, ordinary light 20/60 is no synth, as said the 20/60 +, the racing blend,so t,speak, is fully syth, look it up. M Well, sure, if you pick a different grade of oil from that Austin is referring to in his original post, then yes, the racing grade is synthetic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Hi Austin,. I wouldn't think twice about mixing the two oils in question, no problem, I'd just pour whichever in with t'other ! Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GT6M Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 but do 20-50 and 20-60 from different brewers represent 'similar specification' ? Nope,it dont. the Halfuds stuff, Castrol, comma,all the classic stuff is the same, its all Comma,ina diff tin, Ringo Starr,m an fin oot frae their Tech Boffins. as for others 20 /50 quality varies alott. I, an some others got some oil a few years ago, a SM rated oil,{modern } butt, cos for some obscure reason,, it ed 1600 PPM ZDDP, so I got some }crate of 4, at a v v good price, others got theirs atspots where they live. Oil pressure dropped like a stone after 500-700 miles,like 20 PSI doon. others said same thing basicly,it reverted to a straight 20 weight, Just like all 20/40, 50,60,or 70,s are just a 20W wid modifyers. some modifyers are better than others, and somes Base stok is also better,n others. I, an others just seem t,find that the 20/60Racing is better than alot of others ive tried. there some on eer that have gone owa to it, an report good things, Im sure they will churp up if they reading M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GT6M Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 I don't know if I've missed the point but should the question be 'is penrite classic triumph exactly the same as penrite classic light but with a different label?' Anyone know? Yes, they changed the tins a while back, speak to Aylesbury oils, cos I asked the same thing at Stonehenge show M Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Moltu Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Somehow I don't think Penrite is going to brew a special one for Triumph. The only difference would be the label. A lot of the oil suppliers sell the same product under different names for their target market. Millers did the same with their "Classic 20/50" brand which was sold as Pistoneze 20/50. The difference being the price as the latter aimed at the garage market rather than the home mechanic with a classic. (Millers used to have a depot in Leicester with a very helpful manager who was classic friendly and would natter for ages and sell you the oil you wanted with the least expensive label! Penrite were always more expensive as they had a much bigger marketing budget! These days the market for 20/50 has diminished as modern cars use lighter grade oils with different additive packages without the ZDDP which is potentially harmful to the cats. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 If only it was a case that you get what you pay for , alas it is not as in many items. I hope you all worked out that I was referring to how to use specific oil after a rebuild,note Alecs comment, I do it just a bit different. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted November 18, 2016 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Fortunately Neil, Olde Oily is unable to remember its re-build date (or decade !) The only 20W-50(or 60) I could get my hands on for tomorrows session in t'garage was Valvoline VR1, which has been suggested by more than one on here and as folk say I can mix it - it will be used to top up the existing sticky Penrite 20-60. With both new "Racing" oil and a new "Race" oil rad - I will be expecting an instant 250 bhp extra to knock Hamish's socks off ! ps - having found the rolling road printout from way way back in Olde's file, i've decided its not BHP that's important, but getting good strong torque early on and maintaining it throughout the rev range bhp is for show, torque's for dough !!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Fortunately Neil, Olde Oily is unable to remember its re-build date (or decade !) The only 20W-50(or 60) I could get my hands on for tomorrows session in t'garage was Valvoline VR1, which has been suggested by more than one on here and as folk say I can mix it - it will be used to top up the existing sticky Penrite 20-60. With both new "Racing" oil and a new "Race" oil rad - I will be expecting an instant 250 bhp extra to knock Hamish's socks off ! ps - having found the rolling road printout from way way back in Olde's file, i've decided its not BHP that's important, but getting good strong torque early on and maintaining it throughout the rev range bhp is for show, torque's for dough !!!! Yep -- VR1 is a fine choice. No worries there at all. Actually, for a quart or so you could probably use just about anything, Austin. It's a TR, not a F1 car. BHP is pretty much only for fun. BMEP is what makes the difference to the utility of an engine. There's a reason Standard-Triumph put the BMEP chart at the front of the TR2 workshop manual. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 Horsepower is how fast you hit the tree, torque is how far you moved it! Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted November 18, 2016 Report Share Posted November 18, 2016 With both new "Racing" oil and a new "Race" oil rad - I will be expecting an instant 250 bhp extra to knock Hamish's socks off ! ps - having found the rolling road printout from way way back in Olde's file, i've decided its not BHP that's important, but getting good strong torque early on and maintaining it throughout the rev range bhp is for show, torque's for dough !!!! Hey don't bring me into this !! You should know by now - I don't do technical ?!? My halfords classic oil is, I was assured by the lad in the shop, worth 100bhp on top of the 30bhp the airfreshener would give me ???? McM you'll be across any line before I've got through scrutineering - if I get there???? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spit_2.5PI Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 I, an some others got some oil a few years ago, a SM rated oil,{modern } butt, cos for some obscure reason,, it ed 1600 PPM ZDDP, Markus, I'm sure I've read recently that the current oil ratings (SM? SN?) have a "get-out" for high viscosity formulations, allowing much higher ZDDP. Presumably because they realise these are for older engines. Cheers, Richard Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MostEasterlySteve Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 Markus, I'm sure I've read recently that the current oil ratings (SM? SN?) have a "get-out" for high viscosity formulations, allowing much higher ZDDP. Presumably because they realise these are for older engines. Cheers, Richard Quite right, the hysteria about low ZDDP in SN rated oils is irrelevant to us because most viscosities - certainly the ones we would be using - are exempt from the limit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted November 19, 2016 Report Share Posted November 19, 2016 (edited) BHP is pretty much only for fun. BMEP is what makes the difference to the utility of an engine. There's a reason Standard-Triumph put the BMEP chart at the front of the TR2 workshop manual. Nearly 90 hp nett ( ie with water pump, fan, dynamo powered by crank). Wasn't 90 hp given as the gross hp quoted in another recent post ?? For us nerds: 1. The power( hp) and torque lines dont cross at 5250rpm because they will only do that if torque is expressed in ft-lbs. Triumph used inch-lbs. So, dividing the 5250 rpm torque (estimated 1050 inc-lbs) by 12 we get 88 hp, and the torwue and power lines intersect. Faith in dyanometer graphs restored. 2 The BMEP lines. Note how the power lines 'kisses' the 145psi MEP line. This is the point where cylnider filling with mixture is best ( its at ca 3300rpm). Max torque corresponds tomax MEP. Below that 'kiss' late inlet valve closing ( mainly) loses a bit of mixure back into the manifold so MEP falls off. Above the kiss the higher rpm limit cylinder filling, as there's not enough time to complete the process. BMEP applies here to full throttle conditions, only rpm vary. There are of course a multtude of bmeps at part throttle loads. Peter Edited November 19, 2016 by Peter Cobbold Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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