billg Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 At Harrogate , VRW221 owned by Pascal from Begium was fitted with a front grille which had been modified to give maximum airflow. i.e.quite spindly spars. All modern repro grilles have much wider spars than the Stanpart originals fitted to production cars. I am in the process of modifying a modern repro grille to match those used in factory entered cars which I believe were tweaked in a similar way as Pascals. Some factory rally cars do seem to have the apertures maximised. One exteme picture I've seen looks as if someone had taken a can opener to two squares on the apron! So TR overheating seems to been around for a while, though lots of cars in period seemed to cope with spotless and horns in the air space in front of the radiator core. Has anyone else modified their grille a la factory rally cars? Will post pictures when I've finished it. It's a long job! Billg@NB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ianc Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 The ever-inventive Maurice Gatsonides was the driver who minimised the width of the bars in the grille, and also the man who cut a big hole in the apron on one particular Rally. Maurice ('Mo' of 'Gatso') was very successful, but how much of his success was owed to his own modifications might be difficult to assess. He drove Richardson the whole distance on the 1954 Mille Miglia, and they finished 27th overall, and he had considerable success in sidescreen TRs - see Robson's "The Works Triumphs". Ian Cornish Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 I've modified my grille by reducing the width of the spars. I also fitted an aluminium air duct. If anyone would like a photo. of the air duct then please PM me your eMail address. Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 It's a quick enough job to deal with the horizontal bars - hefty flat weld clamp and snap the blighters flat, one by one. If necessary, smaller clamp and do the verticals too. I've had to do that in the paddock on an unusually hot day years ago, given that the scrutineers would not allow removal of the grille. Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dick Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Standard sidescreen cars don't overheat unless there is something wrong with them. Used to crawl around central London in the 70's winter and summer without a problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cvtrian Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 And if you/anyone wants an original 3A grille with the smaller/thinner horizontal bars, not a repro item - send me a pm, (spare one in my shed). Regards Ian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
billg Posted October 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Hi Ian I have Gatso's book and he certainly was I inventive. Will post pics when I've finished Bill G@ NB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Hi Dick, how the cars performed on 70s fuel doesn't take into account the intervening 40 years of successive fuel reformulations . . . . . the stuff burns hotter now. Add to that waterways clogged with deposition, not to mention that relatively few TRs are driven hard enough to blow the **** out on a regular basis. Then consider a modestly out of sync ignition system, and maybe a carb mixture in need of improvement. Fine recipe for overheating. But nevertheless, there shouldn't be a problem with a correctly tuned standard car on an original or a repro grille. That won't stop many a TR owner from seeking expensive bling solutions, any more than it will encourage them to get the basics right. Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Larnder Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Alec You have forgotten air temperatures in Hot countries like Spain with it being well into the thirties most of the year round and in the 40´s in Summer. I am still toying with the idea of a BETA type grille. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Hi Dave, Not forgotten, I was referring to the UK, not seeking to discuss hot climates - I'll leave that to those with first hand experience. Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 pics of all these examples referred to would be good - I had thought of the plates to clamp one by one method. maybe my array of lamps and rude badge on badge bar are actually helping cooling by increasing the speed of the airflow going into the duct, of course the bigger 700 lamps with a flatter glass lens will create more turbulence, stall the airflow and result in less downforce at the front !!! I wonder what Adrian Newey would do with a TR3 (part from overtake it !) ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jbenajes Posted October 16, 2014 Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 (edited) I am also driving the TR3A in a hot climate (you know, Dave) and are using a repro grill with the smaller openings (the original one hanging on the garage wall has definitely wider openings). However, at speed I never had problems with overheating. And the grille restriction would be evident in these conditions. At low speed, the effect of the fan is more important. I experienced overheating in city traffic, but this was not caused by the grill but by the original four-blade fan, with practically no pitch angle in the blades. I changed to a six-blade “tropical fan” and problem solved. Of course, everything counts, but my feeling is that the additional flow restriction of the smaller openings is negligible compared to other factors. Has somebody solved overheating problems by just removing the grille? Jesús Edited October 16, 2014 by jbenajes Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Larnder Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Jesus The answer to my overheating problem was the air duct behind the grill, problem solved! even in traffic jams then the Kenlowe suction fan takes over, but then I usually manually engage it before it starts to climb (if I remember). Alec What measures, if any, did ST take for the export cars to warmer climes like America, Australia, S. Africa etc? none I bet, never really considered it I suppose. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 What measures, if any, did ST take for the export cars to warmer climes like America, Australia, S. Africa etc? none I bet, never really considered it I suppose. Dave Tropical fan, different temp thermostat and different viscosity engine/transmission oils. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlanT Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Expect some fractures from vibration if you mess with these grilles. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
billg Posted October 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 I've noticed as I mess with my grille that it is getting appreciably more rigid , so the aperture will need to be just right, no bending to fit! Thinking of fitting a cold air duct as well as the radiator shielding , as once the old grille comes out I'll have the chance to do this. Toucan tell I've too much time on my hands Bill@ NB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 I've fitted a cold air duct to my aluminium air duct. If anyone would like a photo. of the set-up then please PM me your eMail address. Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
billg Posted October 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 I've noticed as I mess with my grille that it is getting appreciably more rigid , so the aperture will need to be just right, no bending to fit! Thinking of fitting a cold air duct as well as the radiator shielding , as once the old grille comes out I'll have the chance to do this. Toucan tell I've too much time on my hands Bill@ NB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MilesA Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Bill I have made and fitted a scoop to focus air on the lower third of the rad under the valance (based on a design from another forum user). If interested, PM me and I will send you some photos. No obligation! Miles Quote Link to post Share on other sites
boggie Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 I agree re the duct. For years i had occasional overheating issues on my Seven, especially in slow traffic. I spent a fortune on quad core custom alloy rad, uprated water pump, custom pulley to increase rpm, lower temp thermostat, bigger kenlow etc, I tried everything. As soon as i made / fitted a duct to force all air entering the nose to pass through the rad that incorporated a fan shroud the issue went away. First thing we did with the TR cooling was to bin the cardboard duct and make i proper one from ally sheet. All the air now passes through the rad... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted October 18, 2014 Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 "What measures, if any, did ST take for the export cars to warmer climes like America, Australia, S. Africa etc? none I bet, never really considered it I suppose." Hi Dave, of course they considered it. Standard cars had a healthy export market from the early days. Postwar car production was based on 'export or die' thinking, the home market was entirely secondary. Standards and Triumphs alike were designed for the export market, and expected to cope with climes both colder and hotter than the UK's gentle (in comparison) weather. Hence only minor options were required for relatively extreme conditions, as Stuart notes. Long ago in Sussex I knew a former TR owner who had driven his then new TR3A overland from London round the Mediterranean and Near East to Cairo, then down the length of Africa to Capetown. Special preparation amounted to little more than an extra bootrack-mounted spare wheel, couple of fitted suitcases, spotlights, a tropical fan, continental touring kit, and a tool roll. I inherited one of those cases, still bearing the labels of the liner on which car and owner returned to England - it's now with a pal in Switzerland in his 3A. Something of a priceless TR curiosity, so we agreed priceless really meant notalot and agreed to share a bottle of wine next trip to Switzerland ! Jesting apart, a well driven car in standard trim could achieve rather more than we might expect. Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Larnder Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 Hi Boggie (sorry no nasme given) and Tom I have 2 x two inch flex. air tubes through the top left hand side of my 2mm thick ali air duct next to the rad. to pass cold air to the carbs. I think Tom has one bigger one. DAve Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Larnder Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 Hi Alec and Stuart That´s funny, my car came from Arizona and had none of those so called warmer climes mods on it even the fan was standard, hence my original question. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 Hi Alec and Stuart That´s funny, my car came from Arizona and had none of those so called warmer climes mods on it even the fan was standard, hence my original question. Dave Did the Arizonans give up and sell it because it kept overheating perhaps? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vivdownunder Posted October 19, 2014 Report Share Posted October 19, 2014 There were a few upgrades along the way put down to feedback from warmer climes - Sliding window sidescreens at TS5255 Front scuttle air vent at TS6157 TR3A fibreboard radiator air deflector at TS40104 6 bladed fan announced 19 July 1963, thereafter known as the tropical fan. Conveniently, this item was just the standard fan from the soon to be released Triumph 2000 sedan. Aeroscreens were arguably competition derived rather than for driver cooling. Great fun until hitting a locust plague !. Viv Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.