Fuel Tank Rust

[Keith66]

Hi All

Still struggling with my fuel tank rust or contamination issue. (See Pics)

It’s a std original TR6 Pi fuel tank and its now in pretty poor condition internally due either to rust or a resin type contamination or a combination of the two, the fuel filter keeps getting blocked, which means the car breaks down regularly. So it needs to be rectified or the tank replaced.

So a bit of history, the tank was rusty internally when I got the car (a non runner) so I put loads of nuts, bolts and water in and sloshed its about to remove some of the worst rust. Once empty and dry I used 5L of 45% concentration Phosphoric acid to neutralise any remaining surface rust. 

To be honest it looked great after that, no rust and I’d read that using phosphoric acid left a phosphate layer that resisted further rusting to a degree, so good to go I thought.

But it’s not worked out quite that way with the tank being unusable after about 18mts/ 2 years or so. Unfortunately we are now in an era of E5/E10 petrol and due to the limited use the car gets and the ability of E5/E10 to absorb moisture a mild steel tank will rust inside.

But the inside of the tank now looks very different to the original rusty pics, so is it rust or something else? Some kind of resin gunge from **** petrol?

Externally the tank is mint, it was sprayed in 2 pack gloss black but internally poor, sure I can acid it again but if it simply rusts again I’ll have to clean it again and I don’t want to have to do that every couple of years.

Is there a process to stop that, what is it and is there a company that can do it professionally?

I’m not keen on the various DIY pour in sealants as I’ve read about them failing and I don’t want to end up with a tank full of peeled off sealant. But such a failure could be one in a 100 or 1000, I’ve no idea.

I’ve looked at new tanks, alloy and steel, and the response from various suppliers has ranged from its uncoated mild steel and will rust to we don’t sell alloy ones as we get them returned due to cracking.

Sense would say tanks should be made from galvanised steel (assuming the zinc is not affected by petrol, don’t think so) or stainless but it seems they are not.

So how are everybody else’s steel tanks doing in this era of E5 (or E10 if no E5 about)?

It seems that as time goes by with only E5 (or E10) available the problem can only get worse unless there is a specific problem with my tank or there is a longer term solution.   

 So is there a solution, a process or a company out there that can sort my tank or protect a new one if I have to buy one.

Cheers  Keith

[Jonny TR6]

My Allycool aluminium tank is approx 20yrs old and going strong. Pretty much fit and forget.

[kcsun]

I have used "Slosh" before and had success on a Jaguar fuel tank quite a few years ago. Rustbusters now have a selection of tank treatments including ethanol protection. May be worth giving them a call to discuss it or possibly do the treatment for you

https://www.rust.co.uk/product/cat/fuel-ethanol-proof-tank-sealers/

kc

[rcreweread]

I believe Coolex are now manufacturing alloy fuel tanks for our TRs, having acquired drawings and jigs following Alicool's demise - I saw these new tanks on their stand at Stoneleigh and they appeared well made. I understand they were all snapped up very quickly!

I don't think criticism of good quality UK made alloy tanks is justified in terms of cracking etc - yes cheap foreign tanks were responsible for cracking/splitting and poor fit some years ago when supplied by a well known TR supplier - this then tarnished the reputation  of quality UK made alloy tanks. The resultant fallout keeps getting trotted out both here and in the market on a regular basis, and is just not correct, in my experience.

It's a free world so the choice is yours, but I know which sort of tank I would go for every time!

Cheers Rich

[rogerguzzi]

Hello All

              I was looking at the tanks on their stand  and asked them for a price on a tank for my Spitfire 1500 with built in fuel pump and a relief to fit the outside filter and a screw up type fuel guage flange and larger capacity?

He said they had all the plans for them and I said I could make the pump flange and he said that would lower the cost by £50!

The price for them to do it all was about £500

Roger

[Pontious]

2 hours ago, kcsun said:

I have used "Slosh" before and had success on a Jaguar fuel tank quite a few years ago. Rustbusters now have a selection of tank treatments including ethanol protection. May be worth giving them a call to discuss it or possibly do the treatment for you

https://www.rust.co.uk/product/cat/fuel-ethanol-proof-tank-sealers/

kc

+1

[dblenk]

Pete Felon has a tank available for free

David

[mleadbeater]

At the recommendation of a friend, I add Lucas fuel treatment to my tank, supposed to stop acids forming as rhe ethanol absorbs water. My friend reports the insides of his motorcycles tanks are corrosion free after several years.

Mike

 

[Paul Hill]

5 hours ago, Jonny TR6 said:

My Allycool aluminium tank is approx 20yrs old and going strong. Pretty much fit and forget.

My Allicool aluminium tank is 4 years old and perfect. 

[Keith66]

Hi All

Thanks for the replies.

I’ve thought about a number of things.

First one is it just rust? As can be seen the rust in pic 1 tank looks very different from pic3, but maybe thats the way the water content of ethanol petrol causes rust in a part full tank.

If it is simply rust a quality ally tank would certainly be an immediate cure and as many have said theirs has lasted years so pretty simple solution.

But I’m aware that the tank, bolted in place is part of the rear structure of the car and some say this can lead to cracking. Now that might be just cheapo Chinese tanks but that some retailers won’t even sell me an alloy tank does indicate they think there is an issue. Now not being an engineer or TR professional I’ve no real idea which is correct.

I’ve heard the name Allicool (probably on here) can can’t find it when search WWW. Did they go bust? got a dim and distant memory they might have done but could be wrong.

I’ve looked at petrol ethanol treatments, Millers do one called Tank Safe, which claims similar things to the Lucas one. But not sure how they work, do they reduce the amount of moisture absorbed by the ethanol or just stop the rust forming and does that apply to the top of the tank where the air gap is and where condensation may occur with E5 petrol, again I’ve no real idea. So if re-acid strip my tank or buy a new steel tank will the additives stop either rusting in the air space?

So decisions decisions. As I said it would be interesting to how other steel tanks are doing, has anyone got any pics of perfectly working steel tanks with no issues.

Would be great to here from a TR specialist or pro restorer to get their recommendations.

Cheers   Keith

[Andy Moltu]

We had some ali tanks made for the Leicester group a few years back.

The fabricator who makes automotive prototype parts suggested that the tank mounts be attached to an alloy strap so that as the body flexes, it is passed to the strap which flexes rather than passing the forces directly to the tank.

Unfortunately he has given up the small scale stuff and has been persuaded to build the chassis for Ultima which is keeping him fully occupied.

[Paul Hill]

Keith Alicool we’re just a mile from my house and I purchased my tank direct after a visit to their factory, the guy who did the welding was a skilled guy and the fit is first class also the fuel outlet was bigger which proved a great advantage for the PI system.

As far as I know the company ceased trading due to the partners disagreeing. Rich might know more

[Andy Moltu]

Companies House suggests insolvency and liquidation of Alicool.

What led up to that who knows.

[stuart]

2 hours ago, Andy Moltu said:

Companies House suggests insolvency and liquidation of Alicool.

What led up to that who knows.

There was a disagreement between the partners and so they wound the company up, apparently there is a possibility of one of them restarting a similar company soon.

Stuart.

[stuart]

14 hours ago, Keith66 said:

Hi All

Thanks for the replies.

I’ve thought about a number of things.

First one is it just rust? As can be seen the rust in pic 1 tank looks very different from pic3, but maybe thats the way the water content of ethanol petrol causes rust in a part full tank.

If it is simply rust a quality ally tank would certainly be an immediate cure and as many have said theirs has lasted years so pretty simple solution.

But I’m aware that the tank, bolted in place is part of the rear structure of the car and some say this can lead to cracking. Now that might be just cheapo Chinese tanks but that some retailers won’t even sell me an alloy tank does indicate they think there is an issue. Now not being an engineer or TR professional I’ve no real idea which is correct.

I’ve heard the name Allicool (probably on here) can can’t find it when search WWW. Did they go bust? got a dim and distant memory they might have done but could be wrong.

I’ve looked at petrol ethanol treatments, Millers do one called Tank Safe, which claims similar things to the Lucas one. But not sure how they work, do they reduce the amount of moisture absorbed by the ethanol or just stop the rust forming and does that apply to the top of the tank where the air gap is and where condensation may occur with E5 petrol, again I’ve no real idea. So if re-acid strip my tank or buy a new steel tank will the additives stop either rusting in the air space?

So decisions decisions. As I said it would be interesting to how other steel tanks are doing, has anyone got any pics of perfectly working steel tanks with no issues.

Would be great to here from a TR specialist or pro restorer to get their recommendations.

Cheers   Keith

You could always talk to Ben at Revival motorsports as he makes really nice tanks for the race guys so if its good enough for them then its going to be fine for road use too. Im not going to post a link or this post will be left in moderators limbo. Just Google them.

Stuart.

[rcreweread]

15 hours ago, Paul Hill said:

 

As far as I know the company ceased trading due to the partners disagreeing. Rich might know more

Paul - that was my understanding of the situation which led to the business ceasing - I'm not aware of what happened after that.

I knew the team at Alicool well and I often talked to them about the continual criticisms people raised about "cracking"  and tank "stresses" - I'm not party to the numbers of tanks made in total, but I'm pretty sure it was quite a lot, and I'm also pretty sure they told me the truth when they said this wasn't an issue in their experience - I'm aware of 3 tanks, over the course of many years, which were returned for leaks occurring around the mountings caused by cracks - on closer examination, it appeared that the tanks in question had all received some form of significant external impact to cause the cracks - given that the tanks are all pressure tested once built, then these defects clearly occurred after build. That doesn't mean the tanks are weak to start with, by the way.

Alicool built lots of tanks for race cars etc so I'm sure they knew what they were doing in design terms, and also bear in mind there are some pretty exotic ( and corrosive ) fuels used in that sector, but corrosion never raised it's head- so that's another often quoted criticism which doesn't ring true.

I'm only trying to be objective about this but at the end of the day, it's your money, your decision, so go with what you are comfortable with.

Cheers Rich

[Paul Hill]

Thanks for that Rich

[Topoff]

Hi. I have had several original tanks restored by a local guy (I’m in Surrey). He splits the tank along the seam in to 2 halves, shotblasts the rust away, re- tins the inside, joins the tank back together and pressure/leak tests it in a large tank. The outside is painted and it’s as good as new. I think the last one he did for me was around £180. Let me know if you would like his contact details.  Laurence. 

[PodOne]

That’s a rare talent nowadays I could live with that over a aluminium tank.