TR4A/TR6 wiper motor conversion - looking for the correct dash switch to use

[RogerH]

Hi Rich,

 the 105 degree wheel may be a litle too big.

90 degree has a good sweep and possibly 95 will give that bit extra.

 

Roger

[RobH]

2 hours ago, phil Dean said:

RobH I haven't as yet taken the wiper switch out but wonder why do I have to change/ modify the switch  if this car had twin speed wipers when new and looks like the wiring and switch  suggests this.

The two-speed DR3A motor, which your car should have, works in a completely different way to the two-speed TR6 14w motor and consequently the wiper switch required has a different switching pattern. Your switch and wiring would be fine for a two-speed DR3A motor.

The DR3A is a two-brush wound-field motor whereas the TR6 one is permanent magnet type with three brushes and a different self-park arrangement. 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2023 by RobH

[phil Dean]

Ok thanks Rob

Phil

[Tr4aJim]

Well, I have made some progress with my wiper conversion.

Using a mounting plate template I got from Dave Connit (mentioned above), and sourcing some 11 gauge aluminum (aluminium) plate from a friend, I got to work. Unfortunately the piece of plate had a lot of scratches, so I used a Dremel and a wire cone brush, to make some simulated machine turning marks. That hid the scratches fairly well. Now I’m just waiting for the 90 degree gear to be delivered from SVC and the motor install will be completed.

Following Roger’s instructions on modifying the stock TR4A wiper switch (posted earlier in this thread), I carefully separated the switch body, and then promptly dropped it on the concrete garage floor! Pieces went flying everywhere! Very graciously, Roger offered to modify a switch and send it to me, for the price of the switch and shipping.  What a legend!!

With a great deal of help from Roger, I believe I understand the required wiring. So I decided to draw up a diagram showing how the modified TR4A switch is wired. I also decided to make an alternate diagram where a ‘73 TR6 wiper/washer switch is used instead. Please comment on any errors.

I will post status once I get the new motor gear, and get things wired.

Jim

Edited January 2 by Tr4aJim

[phil Dean]

Some progress Jim, well done any chance you can post on here a copy of Dave Tr drawing of the base plate. I know on right hand drive cars over here the dimensions are not as tight because we don't have to contend with the master cylinders but it would be useful all the same.

 

Phil

 

 

[Tr4aJim]

Phil, let me check with Dave and get his permission.

Jim

[phil Dean]

thank you

[Tr4aJim]

Phil I checked with Dave. He said he is working on a PDF that will include all the dimensions.

Jim

[phil Dean]

Thanks Jim.

Just going back to Jim post when he should a picture of a switch from SVC and Rob said he he would like to see a picture of the back of the switch.

I spoke to SVC and they said it will work fine with a 14W TR6 motor. However I would like to retain the original wiper switch if possible. Like Jim although I am not bad at wiring once shown a wiring diagram when it comes to taking switches apart and reassembling I am useless. In evidence I have a box full at least 6 of Hillman Avenger heater switches in various states of being disassembled. These switches are like rocking horse droppings for early Avengers and on several occasions I had failures trying to fix them. Roger do you convert these as a side line and would you want to take mine on.   

 

Phil.

[RobH]

2 hours ago, phil Dean said:

I spoke to SVC and they said it will work fine with a 14W TR6 motor.

I don't think it will on its own.

That looks to be the same switch sold by Car Builder Solutions (except the base is black) - it has the same lettering on the terminals. The CBS one needs a relay to achieve the odd switching pattern and they show the necessary circuit on their website - similar to the one I posted on page1 of the thread:

Edited January 3 by RobH

[phil Dean]

Thanks Rob I am not beyond wiring a relay in if I have to

 

Phil.

[ianc]

The simulated machine turning on the alloy plate looks splendid now, but all the sh!t muck will stick to it very firmly - and access round there for cleaning is rather difficult!

Ian Cornish

[Motorsport Mickey]

Thought the same Ian. I think a coat of Matt finish varnish or poly something might make living with the cleaning easier.

Mick Richards

 

[Tr4aJim]

No worries. That pic was from the final trial fit. I still have to install the new motor gear when it arrives, as well as the drive cable, so it all has to come out again. I planned to spray a clear onto the plate to prevent tarnishing. Also those simulated turnings are more visual than tactile. The plate still feels smooth to the touch, (other than the scratches I’ve hidden), as the Dremel brush is very soft.

Jim

[RogerH]

4 hours ago, phil Dean said:

Thanks Jim.

Just going back to Jim post when he should a picture of a switch from SVC and Rob said he he would like to see a picture of the back of the switch.

I spoke to SVC and they said it will work fine with a 14W TR6 motor. However I would like to retain the original wiper switch if possible. Like Jim although I am not bad at wiring once shown a wiring diagram when it comes to taking switches apart and reassembling I am useless. In evidence I have a box full at least 6 of Hillman Avenger heater switches in various states of being disassembled. These switches are like rocking horse droppings for early Avengers and on several occasions I had failures trying to fix them. Roger do you convert these as a side line and would you want to take mine on.   

 

Phil.

 

Hi Phil,

I can supply an original TR4A switch to operate the TR6 14W motor.   No good at your Hillman switches.

Drop me a PM for more info.

 

Roger

[phil Dean]

Hi Roger.

I have sent you a pm I think !!!

Phil

[Tr4aJim]

Phil, Dave Connitt generously sent me this PDF file to share.

For additional information, check out Dave’s YouTube channel “”DavesTR4A”.

Jim

TR6 Wiper Motor Adapter Mounting Plate.pdf

[phil Dean]

Thanks Jim

[phil Dean]

just wondering with all thy rewiring I am doing on my wiper motor tr4a is it worth looking to wire it into a auxiliary fuse box (which I fitted when wiring in the dynamo to alternator conversion instead) of the standard fuse box especially as it shares that fuse with stop lights or is it protected because it comes thro the voltage stabilizer first.

 

Phil.

[RobH]

Ideally, the more circuit separation and separate fusing you can do the better Phil - though at the expense of originality if you are concours oriented.  Triumph's original parsimony with fuses was not a great idea, as a fault in one circuit takes out everything else fed by the same fuse.   For example on the 4A, a short circuit in the heater fan motor - not itself an important thing -  will also lose you the brake-lights, indicators, wipers and instruments which are all pretty important. 

 

Edited January 8 by RobH

[stuart]

4 minutes ago, RobH said:

   For example on the 4A, a short circuit in the heater fan motor - not itself an important thing -  will also lose you the brake-lights, indicators, wipers and instruments which are all pretty important. 

 

Yes but it will still get you home unlike a modern

Stuart.

[RogerH]

Hi Phil

easy enough to fuse the wipers separately - either in-line or multi fuse box.

 

Roger

[phil Dean]

Every time I put a spanner on that car it gets less original concours and this particular tr4a are not two words That sit comfortably in the same sentence  as usual thanks for your help and advice.

i might be able to use the original wire from the v regulator the auxiliary fuse box is not far away from the original  put it on my things to do list. 

Phil 

Edited January 8 by phil Dean

[Tr4aJim]

Folks, I wanted to post a picture of the modified 4A wiper switch that Roger provided, after I ruined mine by dropping it (Thanks again Roger!).

You can see the new contact Roger added in position 2. It might be hard to see, but he also covered contacts 1&7 with shrink tubing as these should not be used.

So these are the connection paths of the new switch (see my diagram above for wire locations/colors):

- with the switch pushed all the way in (off) - pins 2&6 connected

- pulled to the first stop - pins 4&6 connected

- pulled to the second stop - pins 4&8 connected

So I guess that’s all for my switch/wiring questions.

I am still waiting for delivery of the 90 degree wiper motor gear from SVC. Once I get that, I’ll hook everything up and give it a try. I’ll post a new topic with my results.

Thanks to all for the help!!!!

cheers,

Jim

[phil Dean]

Because its to cold to go in the garage today its -6 degrees outside and probably colder in the garage , I have been looking at wiring up the new 14W wiper motor.

Again electrics sometimes confuse and baffle me. Wire thickness. I have measured the wires including insulation on the mini loom coming out of the w/motor at 2.52mm  I have some 8.75 amp wire which measures 2.32mm with insulation presume this is to thin the next one up I have is 17.5amp wire would this be ok to use.

Thanks as usual Phil.

Edited January 18 by phil Dean