kiwican Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 I am looking for a part number for a replacement Bosch fuel pump, does anyone what the current number is? I have done a search and there are various references but when I look the part number up the pumps operating pressure is 72 psi and I am thinking we need higher than that. I have the old Lucas pump which I would like to get refurbished and from reading here Neil Ferguson is the guy to do this. I have this as his email: neil.fergusontr6 at gmail dot com Can someone please confirm it and is this the best way to make contact? Thanks Simon James Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HSM Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 Part no. for Bosch roller cell fuel pump B 261 205 413 to run at 8 Bar Regards Harvey S. Maitland Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DaveN Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 Hi Simon That address is good and I've been in contact with Neil today, he got back to me within half an hour too! Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
k_raven_smith Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 That's it. neil.fergusontr6@gmail.com. Cheers Neil Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kiwican Posted March 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 Thank you everyone. Neil I will be sending you an email, it will be from kiwican at embarqmail. Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 some tech here on pump selection. from the looks of the various kits I have seen they use a 979 pump. http://www.lucasinjection.com/bosch_and_lucas_fuel_pumps.htm Snowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steves_TR6 Posted March 14, 2017 Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 some tech here on pump selection. from the looks of the various kits I have seen they use a 979 pump. http://www.lucasinjection.com/bosch_and_lucas_fuel_pumps.htm Snowy The pump in the photos, and the one to go for if you can find one as not made now, is the 996. Steve Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kiwican Posted March 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2017 Most of the pumps I have looked up are all 72 psi, is that an issue? The higher pressure ones are either NLA or horrendously expensive which would mean the kits sold by the various suppliers do not the correct pressure pump. There does not seem to any complaints about the kits so maybe the lower pressure pumps work OK. I am a little confused. Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiTR6 Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 (edited) Simon, My Bosch pump is a Moss kit I believe (sorry don't have the model number to hand) and it gives the requisite pressure as per the photo. All pumps have a performance curve and the pressure at any particular flow rate (or vice versa) can be read off that curve. I suspect the 72 psi figure may be at the pump's maximum flow rate which is probably a lot higher than needed in this application. The pressure will be higher with less flow, and in practice the PRV will determine the pressure in the system (provided the pump is spec'd accordingly). Hope this helps Gavin Edited March 15, 2017 by KiwiTR6 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 you can see from the charts on the link i posted that the pumps can run at higher pressures. Requiring higher current and producing lower fuel flow rates. Snowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted March 15, 2017 Report Share Posted March 15, 2017 On the 996 pump, i have heard that it is the best on but it is NLA and I have not been able to test. Bosch consolidated its fuel pumps into a smaller 'more manageable' line i cant see a x reference for the 996 pump in Bosch's tables. The 979 pump works fine on my car and appears to be the one on the kits i have seen. If you have a high performance engine you can go for the higher output 044 pump, which works fine, I have tried it but it was more noisy than the 979 and higher current required. Snowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tim D. Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 I have a couple of 996 pumps. I am not 100% sure but I think one of the issues regarding the high price of these is that they were used on 911 Porsches which means they sell for a premium. They do work well though. Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kiwican Posted March 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 Thank you every one, I will get a 979 pump. Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
barkerwilliams Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 Simon, Whatever you decide check out http://www.glencoeltd.co.ukwho have many, many pumps and ancillaries including Bosch and keen prices. Just a customer, no connection. Alan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nick Jones Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 Bosch motorsport series FP200 aka 0580 254 044 http://www.bosch-motorsport.com/media/catalog_resources/Fuel_Pump_FP_200_Datasheet_51_en_2776426379pdf.pdf 220 l/h @ 8 Bar (116 psi) http://www.glencoeltd.co.uk/bosch-0580254044-fuel-pump-fp200-5-bar/ (Sytech copy?) or FP 165 aka 0580 254 979 http://www.bosch-motorsport.com/media/catalog_resources/Fuel_Pump_FP_165_Datasheet_51_en_2776390667pdf.pdf Also worth considering Pierburg E3T series. Slightly different operating principle from Bosch (gear pump rather than roller cell) and possibly a better suction characteristic. 130 l/h @ 8 Bar (lower flow could be an advantage - less going through the relief valve and less fuel heating!) Info here (near bottom) http://www.pierburg-service.de/ximages/pg_pi_0034a_en_web.pdf and fairly reasonably priced https://www.amazon.co.uk/Pierburg-7-21659-72-0-Fuel-Pump/dp/B00BHWHLNY Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted March 16, 2017 Report Share Posted March 16, 2017 yep Glencoe good for me too. SNowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jogger321 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Just saw this thread...I have a 996 Bosch pump....The last time I used the car which was many years ago the pump was fitted below the tank and fastened onto the chassis behind the back wheel exposed to the elements...It was actually fitted like this professionally by one of the TR experts (who are still going) Does anybody else have a bosch pump fitted in that position now? ......I did drive the car like that for 3 years but as I am now getting it going ...on reflection it does seem a bit exposed to getting caught by stone chips and other worse things! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiTR6 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Just saw this thread...I have a 996 Bosch pump....The last time I used the car which was many years ago the pump was fitted below the tank and fastened onto the chassis behind the back wheel exposed to the elements...It was actually fitted like this professionally by one of the TR experts (who are still going) Does anybody else have a bosch pump fitted in that position now? ......I did drive the car like that for 3 years but as I am now getting it going ...on reflection it does seem a bit exposed to getting caught by stone chips and other worse things! Jogger, I have just moved the pump etc out of the boot of my car to get rid of the petrol smell and create a little more room. So far it's working well plus their is virtually no audible noise from the pump. I do have some concern about possible effects of the elements in this location (plus Stuart has warned me about likely damage to the post-filter pipework if a drive-shaft fails), but as I plan to only use the car in the dry I don't imagine it will be too much of an issue. I'll keep an eye on it and if need be fabricate a cover shield out of light aluminium sheet. Some photos below. The upright stainless item is the pressure sensor. Gavin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Gavin, If you have had petrol smells in your boot and they have now gone, you have the wrong spec. rubber hoses fitted? They s/b US spec. SAE J30 R9 or R14 depending upon pressure. I fitted this type to my TR & BSA, petrol smells are gone!!! The problem is, in simple terms: the petrol vapour travels through the side walls of the hose if R6 is used for example which is the common hose supplied/used here in the U.K. I have used the Gates product which exceeds the spec. requirements of R9 & R14. Simon James My Bosch pump is over 35 years old and the part number is 0-580-254 -952 which I believe has now been superseded, ask your Bosch dealer for the new part number. Filter part number 045-905-975. The other information that was given to me by Bosch UK was that this pump would not give full flow below 10 volts, wiring to pump to be rated at 25amps,power supply to be through a relay, battery to be of 400 cranking amps preferred and alternator output not less than 45amps. I complied with all these requirements and have never had a problem. Bruce Bruce Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiTR6 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Gavin, If you have had petrol smells in your boot and they have now gone, you have the wrong spec. rubber hoses fitted? They s/b US spec. SAE J30 R9 or R14 depending upon pressure. I fitted this type to my TR & BSA, petrol smells are gone!!! The problem is, in simple terms: the petrol vapour travels through the side walls of the hose if R6 is used for example which is the common hose supplied/used here in the U.K. I have used the Gates product which exceeds the spec. requirements of R9 & R14. Bruce, I'm sure you're absolutely correct about the vapour permeating the original hose. The new hose I've used is the low permeability type but I also wanted to tidy up the original pipework layout and move the high pressure pump and lines to the outside of the car in case a leak ever develops. The elimination of noise from the pump was a bonus. Gavin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Gavin, Your install looks to be well done! The Gates product is available in Australia through a company call Speedflow but I suspect it is in NZ as well? Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR NIALL Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Hi Bruce,can you please give the exact spec of that Gates Hose,I would like to Order some from a Supplier here but they need a Spec/Type Number,Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Niall, The Gates product is a market leader not even German engineering cannot get any where near its performance? Gates call their product Barricade, I used their fuel injection type 4219BF rated at 225 psi. This product can be used with Diesel, Petrol and Ethanol, up to E85??? It can also be used for carburetion fuel lines and is made in the following sizes 1/4",5/16" & 3/8" for Injection. There is a carburetion type 4219BG which has a lager size range, rated at up to 50 psi. The permeation rate of the Gates hose is 1gr/m2 per day, the usual R6 sold in the UK is < 400gr/m2 per day hence petrol smells in the boot! Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR NIALL Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 Niall, The Gates product is a market leader not even German engineering cannot get any where near its performance? Gates call their product Barricade, I used their fuel injection type 4219BF rated at 225 psi. This product can be used with Diesel, Petrol and Ethanol, up to E85??? It can also be used for carburetion fuel lines and is made in the following sizes 1/4",5/16" & 3/8" for Injection. There is a carburetion type 4219BG which has a lager size range, rated at up to 50 psi. The permeation rate of the Gates hose is 1gr/m2 per day, the usual R6 sold in the UK is < 400gr/m2 per day hence petrol smells in the boot! Bruce. Thanks Bruce,I'll baffle my supplier with all that info,Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kiwican Posted April 18, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2017 I have now had a new Bosch fuel pump, filter, larger supply from tank, upgraded electrical feed, and a new fuel tank fitted. The car runs but when the ignition is turned off the car runs on / diesels for a few seconds. Any suggestions on what is causing this? Can too much pressure be the cause? The pressure has not been checked yet. Except for the fuel pump issues car was running fine previously. Regarding the new tank, this one would be a North American spec and I believe I have read that these dont vent the same as the PI tanks. Have I got that right? If so could this be part of the problem. Thanks Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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