Dave McDonald Posted March 3, 2019 Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 14 hours ago, ed_h said: The two bars are the bottom supports for the US front license plate plinth. Ed 8 hours ago, InfinityJon said: Hi Dave, The two bracing bard are from the us spec front end. Just crossed them out the way once the bumper was removed. The radiator protection? Not sure I will investigate when the body is removed. Really on stop at the moment as SGS cried off the inspection on Friday due to bad health and now I’m delayed by another week. Jon and Ed, thanks for clarification of the two bars. I guessed it would be something like that, but just hadn't seen them before. Other than for connecting snow clearing equipment, I can't see any need to reinforce the rad shield like that. Jon, Who are/is SGS exactly? Presumably art of/attached to the DVLA? Are you saying that they will allocate a new age related registration number to your USA car prior to it being dismantled and rebuilt? I ask because I have a USA TR6 to start rebuilding. The last time I did a USA TR6, twenty years ago, I rebuilt it, got it MOT'd using the Commission plate as an identity, got it insured with that MOT and identity and then had to trailer the rebuilt car to a DVLA office in Nottingham for inspection before a number plate was issued. Dave McD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 So they say restoration is full of ups and downs. Today was a down! Having now taken both front wings off, it’s apparent that the old gal has had a small amount of front end damage. Which explains why the bonnet was slightly mis aligned to the Right (stood in front of the car looking at the screen). Setting out the centre line of the car reveals the front valance is not central and is 25mm too far right. Running a straight edge along the inner wings show the drivers side(UK) dips in from the centre of the tyre forward 25mm ish. The passenger side is a mashed straightish line but falls outside of the bonnet line by 25mm.(see the image with the two pen marks- the left line is the centreline of the chassis, the right is the centreline of the valance) Further examination of the passenger inner wing shows the mashed and bodged remains are pulling the cars nose to the right. It’s taken several hours to sus our what’s was wrong as all the upper bodywork looked ok. So I think I will need one, possibly two inner wings and a new valance. Before we even discuss new outer wings. The existing valance is in my opinion beyond repair as it’s bent in many places and out of shape. On the plus side, the chassis shows no sign of damage with no kinks or puckers in the box section. I just think it’s a poor repair on the tin work- bend what’s there rather than replace it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 26 minutes ago, Dave McDonald said: Jon and Ed, thanks for clarification of the two bars. I guessed it would be something like that, but just hadn't seen them before. Other than for connecting snow clearing equipment, I can't see any need to reinforce the rad shield like that. Jon, Who are/is SGS exactly? Presumably art of/attached to the DVLA? Are you saying that they will allocate a new age related registration number to your USA car prior to it being dismantled and rebuilt? I ask because I have a USA TR6 to start rebuilding. The last time I did a USA TR6, twenty years ago, I rebuilt it, got it MOT'd using the Commission plate as an identity, got it insured with that MOT and identity and then had to trailer the rebuilt car to a DVLA office in Nottingham for inspection before a number plate was issued. Dave McD Dave, in short yes, though I am learning as I go... I was not aware the car needed inspecting at this stage if I want an age related plate. The inspector just looks at the engine number, chassis, gearbox and has a general poke around and takes some pictures. It’s supposed to be confirmation of what I put on the application form (so i’m told) They want to know what you are doing to it and his report supports your application. It’s a bit late for it being road worthy as I had already started the tear down before I applied - not knowing about an inspection. SGS (DVLA inspection body) don’t seem too stressed about this fact. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 (edited) Further images of today. Ok so first image shows the crumpled inner wing and valance second and third image and the one with my finger on the post above shows a gap between the bracket and the inner wing which is not present on the other side. 4th image is a shot showing misaligned metalwork on the troubled side. The two images in the post above with the yellow levels along the inner wing shows the shape of the wing. The RH with the damage is almost straight and can be just seen as the image is a little but outside of the bonnet line dark. Edited March 3, 2019 by InfinityJon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tr graham Posted March 3, 2019 Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 John with good metal like you are showing , I would be looking to straighten rather than replace , a good body jig and ram would soon pull that back into place , it’s never the same with repro panels. graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 1 hour ago, tr graham said: John with good metal like you are showing , I would be looking to straighten rather than replace , a good body jig and ram would soon pull that back into place , it’s never the same with repro panels. graham Hear what you are saying and I am tempted to sort the location issue with what’s there. The front valance may be a different story. Imagine a screwed up ball of paper you ask someone to make look like a virgin sheet of A4. Don’t think it’s going to happen. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted March 3, 2019 Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 +1 John I'd try to use what you have. I had the pleasure of fitting a repro inner wing it was half the gauge of the original and lets just say I might as well have made it from scratch very poor fit. I went on to fix the other side and returned the panel. If the chassis is straight a bit of pulling while its on the chassis using ratchet straps/scissor jack and blocks may work well enough. Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mark69 Posted March 3, 2019 Report Share Posted March 3, 2019 Hi John. A NOS front valance as been listed on ebay today, I couldn't find one at the time I was replacing mine and used a Bastuck repo, really pleased with result. Apparently these are made with thinner sheet steel. Wishing you the best with your project. Mark Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sapphire72 Posted March 4, 2019 Report Share Posted March 4, 2019 Jon, You are doing a fine job presenting your advances via photos & description. It's good to follow along. As others have written, the pickings for the inner wing replacements are poor fitting- better to hammer out the original panel you have- it's mostly flat & the gutter. To protect the radiator it was a simple matter to attach a mesh screen to the back side of the valance. No plow attachment needed. Walt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted March 4, 2019 Report Share Posted March 4, 2019 Regardless I would repair what you have as its by far (short of NOS) your best bet, you would be surprised what you can do with a bit of patience. I definitely wouldnt opt for a thinner panel. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 4, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2019 Question: Does the top line of the inner wing follow the bonnet, is it straight or have a slight curve? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted March 4, 2019 Report Share Posted March 4, 2019 19 hours ago, InfinityJon said: Dave, in short yes, though I am learning as I go... I was not aware the car needed inspecting at this stage if I want an age related plate. The inspector just looks at the engine number, chassis, gearbox and has a general poke around and takes some pictures. It’s supposed to be confirmation of what I put on the application form (so i’m told) They want to know what you are doing to it and his report supports your application. It’s a bit late for it being road worthy as I had already started the tear down before I applied - not knowing about an inspection. SGS (DVLA inspection body) don’t seem too stressed about this fact. Hi Dave! The DVLA are very worried about cloning as they have been caught with their pants down on this subject too many times and if they have any suspicions that something is not right. They will not issue any paper work let alone a number plate. My advice to anybody with a USA import is to get a Heritage Cert ASAP and submit a copy with your application for a V5. All this is based upon my own experience with motor cycles & DVLA advice. I have not failed yet!. My last point is, although this car was imported from the USA it might not have gone there straight away as what is known as a 'Direct Export'? Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted March 4, 2019 Report Share Posted March 4, 2019 1 hour ago, InfinityJon said: Question: Does the top line of the inner wing follow the bonnet, is it straight or have a slight curve? Hi John, if you have a good wing, the part that bolts on the inner wing can be your reference. If you install the (straight) bonnet and straight front wings, it will show you what is needed. Once you know what you need to correct, think twice, discuss with another (near by) TR member and then make the corrections. my car had a rear end collision, the sides of the boot floor were a bit rimpled, I used a hydraulic cylinder and carefull beating until it was straight while the hydraulic force kept the material under tension. After that, the rear wings fitted nicely again. I’m in the camp of “better using original parts” too. Work in small steps, so you see if you are heading in the right direction. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sapphire72 Posted March 5, 2019 Report Share Posted March 5, 2019 (edited) Bonnet-to-Wing lines. Edited March 5, 2019 by Sapphire72 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 8, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2019 SGS inspection done. Confirmation of engine number, chassis number, steering column, rolling chassis, mileage. Photos to show the originality of the car despite the lack of interior and everything not fixed down. Really nice bloke actually. Ex panel beater so gave me a 30 min instruction how to sort out the front end. Great guy. Now we have to wait for the report to go in and the wait for the next excuse for dvla to throw it back at me, or issue a plate. Practical progress wise: work bench frame welded together and installed. Tops and shelf to go on over the weekend. Car wise, Hope to get the rear wings off and start to look at straightening the front end. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave McDonald Posted March 8, 2019 Report Share Posted March 8, 2019 Jon, That all sounds positive. Based on your experience, I'd better start to contact DVLA/SGS to inspect my USA TR6 in the near future before I go too far with the strip down. Please keep us informed of the continuing progress from here, both Registration wise and dismantle/rebuild wise. Dave McD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 8, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2019 54 minutes ago, Dave McDonald said: Jon, That all sounds positive. Based on your experience, I'd better start to contact DVLA/SGS to inspect my USA TR6 in the near future before I go too far with the strip down. Please keep us informed of the continuing progress from here, both Registration wise and dismantle/rebuild wise. Dave McD Dave Engine has to be in the car and it is supposed to be a drivable vehicle. Also, SGS won’t accept any of your pictures of the car, they have to be taken with their camera. So historical pictures are no good. You could wait until the car is restored. I just want a plate in case legislation changes in the time it takes to restore the car and I can’t get an age related plate. I may be worrying unnecessarily but if I’ve got one, I’ve got one! I should know what’s what in a couple of weeks so I’ll keep you posted. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2019 Work bench finished. Makes such a difference having somewhere to work. Bonnet is off and the front end stripped down. Now I can see what needs sorting on the front end. Speaking with my new panel beater friend, he said that the front needs really pulling with a ram but in the absence of that, it could be done by drilling out the spot welds in the front valance, removing and sorting each side, checking the alignment from the centreline with the bonnet and the wings making sure I keep the bonnet with the correct spacing using packers pushed hard against the bulkhead. The reason behind the removal of the valance is to allow each side to move with the panel beating and not distort the valance because adjusting one side will not make the other side move. It will just bend the valance. Both front bumper mount brackets show signs of damage so will try and straighten or source some others. Surprised you can’t buy these. Chassis is fine no sign of damage. Comments and advice please re the above method. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted March 10, 2019 Report Share Posted March 10, 2019 I have had to "Move" the inner wings/arches around a bit to get the front of these straight a few times and a small bottle jack on its side (Pump side down) and some various shape/sizes of bits of wood will work wonders, if you still have the engine in then it can be used as a brace/back stop to keep one side in place while pushing the other out, Sash cramps also help if you know any carpenters as they can be used in lieu of the bonnet to provide a fixed measurement. Also small ratchet straps too though be careful when using across sharp edges. I would use this method first rather than unpicking the front panel as you may lose your datum points. TR Shop, TR Bitz, TRTrader may well have the bumper irons you need. I learnt all this from back in the seventies doing damaged repairable salvage when we couldnt afford to buy new panels. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mattyb Posted March 10, 2019 Report Share Posted March 10, 2019 https://www.revingtontr.com/product/814459shpc/name/second-hand-pc-bumper-iron-tr6 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2019 (edited) It took some time but I have moved the front end into its correct position all Barr a mm. Final positioning can be done when the body comes off. Both inner wings were quite out of shape and the more I studied it the more I spotted that needed adjustment. I unpicked the passenger side from the valance which released the tension from the front. Not much moved. Then started to shape the best inner wing (UK drivers side) to match the bonnet. I found the best way was to flex the inn wing and look what moved and deformed. Then reshape the metal to try and set the deflection. Once this was in the correct shape, the passenger side of the valance then set the target position for that wing. I was also carefully watching the two black sharpe lines getting closer and closer together. The pasenger inner wing really needed a beating. And after several hours it’s now pretty close. It will always be a re shaped panel but I can keep tickling it until I’m happy with the finish. Ive now layed the bonnet on put the outer wings on (not fixed) and checked the gaps. They are all set to about 6mm using blue plastic frame spacers and I am well please with the results. I’ll post pictures into an edit of this post tomorrow. Ive yet to weld the inner wing panels and valance together, they are clamped at the moment so I can reassess the position on a fresh day. Edited March 23, 2019 by InfinityJon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted March 17, 2019 Report Share Posted March 17, 2019 Very good result John. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 19, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2019 Well DVLA have rejected my application saying the car needs to finish its restoration before I can apply for a plate. Oh well, I’ll put that on pause for a bit and get on with the restoration. I was just hoping to get the admin part sorted ahead of schedule. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tr graham Posted March 20, 2019 Report Share Posted March 20, 2019 John thank you for posting details of your rejection by the DVLA although not good news for you , at least they are being consistent, with the guidelines they are asking clubs to follow. graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
InfinityJon Posted March 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2019 (edited) Could someone post me the same shot as the one below showing the correct wing to valance alignment please. Particularly interested in the pointbthe headlight circle joins the shape of the front valance. Should there be a gap between the headlight and the valance? And if so how much. As far as I can tell, either my front valance needs to go up of the wings need to sit lower on the inner wings. I suspect it’s a bit of both as the front end has been out of shape. BTW I can’t tell from the drivers side as the critical part of this wing is rusted away and is no more! Edited March 24, 2019 by InfinityJon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.