Bevan Imp Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 Hi All, New to forum......... Can anyone point me in the direction of a company that offers a fuel injection system for a tr4a. Many thanks Jonathan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted October 4, 2012 Report Share Posted October 4, 2012 I believe Revingtons can do that but its expensive and can I ask why? Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tomtr250 Posted October 5, 2012 Report Share Posted October 5, 2012 Bevan Imp? That brings back memories! Try Robert Forster in Nottingham, he has put injection on a 4 his number is 01159 638210 Good luck Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bevan Imp Posted December 7, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 Using a web on system on a car I am building........ For your memories...... http://i582.photobucket.com/albums/ss268/Bevan-imp/IMAG0386.jpg[/img Jonathan Bevan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted December 7, 2012 Report Share Posted December 7, 2012 Hi Jon, possibly Enginuity in Acton. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GiuliaReis Posted December 8, 2012 Report Share Posted December 8, 2012 (edited) @Jonathan, your image Can jou give us some more details? Edited December 8, 2012 by GiuliaReis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted December 8, 2012 Report Share Posted December 8, 2012 I remember happy days occasionally marshalling and watching the Bevan and Fraser Imps giving the Minis a good workout back in the '70s. A few of my work colleagues also rallied Imps which went against the general trend and certainly required a different driving style and considerable nerve. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bevan Imp Posted December 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 My granfather was George Bevan, to celebrate the 40 th anniversary of the championship wins my father an I built a final Bevan Imp. The car was sold this January to a chap in Scotland. I run a car restoration business which specialises in E-types, however a friend has commissioned us to build a TR4 which is now in the process of being built. The car is actually a US spec car with a Tr4a chassis etc although it has the solid rear axle. It really is lovely and has grabbed everyone's attention, I am trying to build a standard looking car which has performance upgrades. I will post a few pictures when from work. Jonathan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 (edited) Did you look at the Moss supercharger kit? That would seem to be bolt on performance without the electrickery. Moss Motors TR2-4A Supercharger Information Video - YouTube http://www.mossmotors.com/forum/forums/thread/24337.aspx My experience was Hogan's TR4 with a supercharger that was a bit limp until I worked out, made and fitted the correct sized supercharger pulley - It went like fury, till the supercharger seized due to no lubrication. NOTE - That was NOT a Moss supercharger. No doubt others with experience will comment. Cheers Peter W Edited December 9, 2012 by BlueTR3A-5EKT Quote Link to post Share on other sites
harrytr5 Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 Try Emerald EFI as he has a kit for TR2-7 (Dave Walker) phone no 01953 889110 his ECU is built like military top class kit. Nice company to deal with.He has converted many E- Types and is well known in their circles. I am just a satisfied customer. Regards HarryTR5 Nutter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saggy Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 I thought I read somewhere that chargers could only be fitted to left hand drive cars because the steering column got in the way on right hand drives?? (waiting to see how long it will be before being corrected!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 True for a 6 but it is do able on a 4. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted December 9, 2012 Report Share Posted December 9, 2012 True for a 6 but it is do able on a 4. Stuart. But Why? Weber it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) But Why? Weber it Oh Yes! Or even Dellorto it Stuart Edited December 10, 2012 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
North London Mike Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 True for a 6 but it is do able on a 4. Stuart. MMmm, Moss Europe list it for a 6 pot (250/ TR5 & 6) but don't list it for RHD UK market TR 2/3/4/4a ........so have to get it shipped via ebay Looking at the photo, looks as if the Air filter assembly would foul, so whats the mod Stuart ? (NB: Webers are £2000 cheaper ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Badfrog Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 No, no, forget Webers, Mikunize your ride: http://www.v-performance.com/products/air_fuel.html Badfrog Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 10, 2012 Report Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) Dont know Mike as I have never been down that route but there have been several sidescreen cars fitted with Judson superchargers over the years including one down here. Stuart. Picture of an Australian installation. and an Australian TR4 Edited December 10, 2012 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
North London Mike Posted December 11, 2012 Report Share Posted December 11, 2012 No, no, forget Webers, Mikunize your ride: http://www.v-performance.com/products/air_fuel.html Badfrog Wow...............confused now Anybody in the UK got them ?? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
North London Mike Posted December 11, 2012 Report Share Posted December 11, 2012 (edited) Dont know Mike as I have never been down that route but there have been several sidescreen cars fitted with Judson superchargers over the years including one down here. Stuart. Picture of an Australian installation And an Australian TR4 Stuart Just heard back from Moss Technical, you're right of course. The kit will fit RHD cars and they are amending the website (at time of going to press they hadn't tested so excluded, now have, all OK) Edited December 11, 2012 by North London Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted December 11, 2012 Report Share Posted December 11, 2012 (edited) Did you look at the Moss supercharger kit? That would seem to be bolt on performance without the electrickery. Moss Motors TR2-4A Supercharger Information Video - YouTube http://www.mossmotors.com/forum/forums/thread/24337.aspx My experience was Hogan's TR4 with a supercharger that was a bit limp until I worked out, made and fitted the correct sized supercharger pulley - It went like fury, till the supercharger seized due to no lubrication. NOTE - That was NOT a Moss supercharger. No doubt others with experience will comment. Cheers Peter W ================================================================================================================ Yes, supercharging is brilliant for road cars, but the MSA penalty killed supercharging for racing. Moss kits seem to be tuned for quite low max.boost, to run safe with normal CR heads. But lower the CR and spin theblower faster to 10psi and....yes, terrific. Edited December 11, 2012 by Peter Cobbold Quote Link to post Share on other sites
North London Mike Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 ================================================================================================================ Yes, supercharging is brilliant for road cars, but the MSA penalty killed supercharging for racing. Moss kits seem to be tuned for quite low max.boost, to run safe with normal CR heads. But lower the CR and spin theblower faster to 10psi and....yes, terrific. Peter You're obviously the 'go to' source for S/C conversions. Showing my ignorance here, why lower compression if higher boost, what's the relationship? I know some of the kits come with different pulley's which increase the boost Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 (edited) Mike asked: "why lower compression if higher boost, what's the relationship?" Mike, Nutshell summary. A supercharged engine has effectively a variable compresson ratio. The CR/boost relationship is ultimately dictated by fuel octane and onset of detonation. So if we have very high octane fuel ( eg methanol. ethanol) then a high geometricCR head can be used with high boost. Turbo Subarus in USA are running 30psi boost on E85 - and the knock sensors dont trigger!! But on UK's best petrol, 97-98RON, the onset of detonation will occur at much lower boosts, The boost/CR relationship cannot be predicted precisely as detonation is a complex flame behaviour. It depends upon fuel RON, combustion chamber shape, spark timing, mixture (never ever go lean!), turbulence, and especially the heating of the mixture produced by the blower, and etc. A very rough rule of thumb is that every 3 to 4 psi boost needs geometricCR to be lowered by 1 ratio. So if a TR head is safe normally aspirated on 97RON at geometricCR=10.5 then running 10 psi boost would need CR reduced to about 8. There are tricks to use a bit more boost such as retarding the spark under higher boosts, intercooling ( only with fuel injection) water injection, fuel dope. The detonation risk is highest at peak torque around 3000rpm and falls at higher rpm. So Moss' 6psi max boost at 5500rpm corresponds roughly to adding 1 CR ratio at peak torque, which would be tolerated on a 9.5 geometricCR head. I suspect a lot of the expense in the kit was effort spent on matching the boost to the head and in being certain that detonation is unlikely. Bad detonation can hole pistons in seconds. Supercharging for road use - brief burst of boost - allows pistons etc to cool down at cruise. For racing the heat build-up is much more challenging, and intercooling essential, as well as the best, coolest compressor. Thats why vintagents at VSCC use methanol fuel - its high RON and evaporative cooling eliminates detonation. cheers Peter Edited December 12, 2012 by Peter Cobbold Quote Link to post Share on other sites
North London Mike Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Peter Thanks for that (I think ) So, if the standard kit is 5-6 PSi boost on a standard head, and they claim 30-40% increase in power/ torque then we would need to reduce the CR by 1 to be able to run 10psi which your text indicates is the place to be. However, I assume the gain Vs boost graph isn't a linear progression, i.e. if 5 psi boost gives you 30% boost, 10psi won't give you 60% increase (or will it ?) So what is the likely gain vs the extra stresses on the engine and the head work involved in the CR reduction if we go to 10psi boost ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mike3md Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Mike, If you had the supercharger actuated via an electric clutch (as per your a/c in the Jag), for short bursts as Peter says "Supercharging for road use - brief burst of boost - allows pistons etc to cool down at cruise" no head work needed? I suspect that off boost the power will be well down though...... Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted December 12, 2012 Report Share Posted December 12, 2012 Mikes The extra power/torque over and above the atmospheric power curve will be roughly linear with boost. That's only very roughly, as blowers raise the temperature of the mixture more at higher boosts, which reduces the air density- meaning some of that 10psi is due to higher temperature not air. re Moss kit. Never having seen the spec on the kit I dont know exactly whats on offer. I'd be surprised if the kit info doesnt mention safe boost/CR range. The Eaton M62 blower they use will certainly be capable of flowing 10psi at 5500rpm. Declutching the blower is used on moderns to kill its horse power loss (maybe 1 to 2 hp) when the engine is at cruise, an economy measure. Detonation will hole a piston in very few seconds at wide open throttle so killing boost is best done by lifting off immediately its heard. Problem is, detonation can be inaudible at full chat with roof down...the first sign can be blue smoke pumping out the exhaust and catch tank. So tuning to ensure detonation is 'impossible' is safest. Start with low CR and work up? The TR6 low CR USA heads are ideal for that, but I guess TR4 had no really low CR heads? So shorter pistons? I know off two TR3s being supercharged in UK at present - perhaps they can advise. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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