simonjrwinter Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 I wonder if someone could give me some advice about my clutch… last week when I drove the car several times and on Wednesday went to an evening cars and coffee bash. When I came to go home, I pushed the clutch down but it didn’t seem to disengage so I couldn’t get it into gear, any gear. I turned the car off, put it into first and although the car did move slightly forward (clutch was depresses) it then disengaged and acted completely as normal all the way home. I’ve driven it since then and it’s been fine. However, today I stopped and turned the car off to take a phone call. When I started again, same thing happened, couldn’t get it into gear with the engine running. Turned it off, engaged gear, started…small lurch then disengagement. my HD clutch release bearing has been “whirring” for a while now, could it be anything to do with that? Cross shaft has two bushes at each end and is pinned, gearbox rebuilt by Pete Cox about 10 years ago, all seems fine, bled the clutch today before I went out as the fluid was old, everything worked as it should when I set out for the drive…. can this be symptomatic of release bearing failure? any advice greatly appreciated simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Dowel bolts fitted? Clutch fitted dry? Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Hi Stuart. ‘box is fitted to a Rover V8 with the Stag adaptor plate so two possible misalignment issues…..no, from what I remember (and it’s been a good few years since I had the gearbox out) I don’t recall any alignment dowels. It’s always nagged at me that it may be out of alignment. Guess I’d better get a dial gauge on it when the box is out…. simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elclem1 Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Overdrive box? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 (edited) Indeed it is…. Edited July 11, 2023 by simonjrwinter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 5 minutes ago, simonjrwinter said: Hi Stuart. ‘box is fitted to a Rover V8 with the Stag adaptor plate so two possible misalignment issues…..no, from what I remember (and it’s been a good few years since I had the gearbox out) I don’t recall any alignment dowels. It’s always nagged at me that it may be out of alignment. Guess I’d better get a dial gauge on it when the box is out…. simon I dont know if the Stag fitment uses dowels though as its pretty much the same box I would have thought it does. The dry clutch I was referring to was when the nose extension of the box hasnt been lubed before fitment into the clutch this can end up with the plate sticking on the splines and causing jumpy disengagement. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
elclem1 Posted July 11, 2023 Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 Sticky overdrive. so not coming out of overdrive properly.? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2023 No, overdrive seems to work perfectly Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tim D. Posted July 12, 2023 Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 20 hours ago, simonjrwinter said: Hi Stuart. ‘box is fitted to a Rover V8 with the Stag adaptor plate so two possible misalignment issues…..no, from what I remember (and it’s been a good few years since I had the gearbox out) I don’t recall any alignment dowels. It’s always nagged at me that it may be out of alignment. Guess I’d better get a dial gauge on it when the box is out…. simon I've got the same RV8 to triumph gearbox in my stag. Did an engine and gearbox replacement over the winter and at least in my case the adapter did not use dowel bolts. It has welded studs that engage with the bell housing. I was kinda worried about this but I have now done more than 1000 miles without issues. Maybe luck. Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 I think I’ve worked it out…I seem to have a leak from the rear crank seal. I’m pretty sure oil is on the flywheel and is causing the disc to “stick”. ’box out whatever… Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mike C Posted July 12, 2023 Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 Oil on the flywheel generally causes the clutch disc to slip. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2023 We’ll see once the ‘box is off…. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 19, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2023 Not driven the car as I was going to take it to my daughters barn to do the work. Got in it today, clutch pedal won’t go down at all, I’m very confused now. Somethings properly stuck! simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keith1948 Posted July 19, 2023 Report Share Posted July 19, 2023 Hi Simon I would start by making sure that the master and slave cylinders and pedal are all working ok before hauling out the gearbox. If clutch pedal won't move at all it could be hydraulics. Other thing that springs to mind is the taper pin on the release fork may have broken or the pivot pins on the release fork that operate the movement of the release bearing carrier may have excessive wear or be broken. Keith Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John L Posted July 19, 2023 Report Share Posted July 19, 2023 Oil from the rear crank seal will not usually get onto the clutch plate, unless the seal has completely come out, its flung off the back of the flywheel. If you have oil on the plate its far more likely that its from the seal on the front of the gearbox, or from the release bearing. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 19, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2023 Got back in the car, still no pedal…put it into 1st gear and turned it over (took me by surprise as it actually started and crept forward. Turned off, tried again still no clutch. Turned off again, tried clutch….working perfectly! whatever it is, I don’t think I’m going to get to the bottom of it until the gearbox is removed, hopefully this Sunday…..will post my findings…and probably questions simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted July 19, 2023 Report Share Posted July 19, 2023 Hi Simon Don't forget to take some pictures it will be good to see what the issue is. Just a thought and something I did when I was sorting my own car as the gear change was difficult after a full rebuild. Turned out in my case to be air in the system it was surprising how big an effect it had on the slave travel. As Keith also suggests why not try taking a video of the clutch slave/rod movement just to confirm all is well there in terms of are you getting consistent travel of 15-18mm?. Might save you a lot of work. Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted July 21, 2023 Report Share Posted July 21, 2023 On 7/19/2023 at 3:03 PM, simonjrwinter said: Not driven the car as I was going to take it to my daughters barn to do the work. Got in it today, clutch pedal won’t go down at all, I’m very confused now. Somethings properly stuck! simon Years ago I had the return spring the master cylinder completely break up and it played those sort of tricks on me. As already stated I would check the operation of the clutch pedal mechanism A new master cylinder sorted that problem out. Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
matt george Posted July 24, 2023 Report Share Posted July 24, 2023 On 7/21/2023 at 1:25 PM, astontr6 said: Years ago I had the return spring the master cylinder completely break up and it played those sort of tricks on me. As already stated I would check the operation of the clutch pedal mechanism A new master cylinder sorted that problem out. Bruce. I had the same problem on my 2500 saloon. Gearbox out, only to find the fork retaining pin was fine. Turned out to be the spring within the master breaking up, damaging the seal. New master cylinder fixed it. Matt Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted July 29, 2023 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2023 On 7/11/2023 at 1:25 PM, stuart said: I dont know if the Stag fitment uses dowels though as its pretty much the same box I would have thought it does. The dry clutch I was referring to was when the nose extension of the box hasnt been lubed before fitment into the clutch this can end up with the plate sticking on the splines and causing jumpy disengagement. Stuart. Well, got the gearbox out today and the clutch looked EXACTLY like the one stuart posted. No oil leak from the rear main seal (although plenty of them from elsewhere!) the release bearing seemed a little dry but otherwise pretty noise free and smooth so I tried to pack a bit more grease in there. Cleaned everything up, put a small amount of copper slip on the splines, put it back together and it seems to be fine (not driven it yet) as an aside, I did see there’s a weep from the slave cylinder (and some small corrosion in the bore) so that will be replaced. thanks for all the input. I’ll let you know how it drives simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted July 29, 2023 Report Share Posted July 29, 2023 Hi Simon Hope you have sorted the issue but part of me still thinks the slave might have had a part to play with the issue. Out of interest why the spring attached to the fork lever? I thought that arrangement was for the TR4 set up but I might be wrong. It would be interesting to see if the problem is resolved before replacing the slave. Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 30, 2023 Report Share Posted July 30, 2023 16 hours ago, simonjrwinter said: Well, got the gearbox out today and the clutch looked EXACTLY like the one stuart posted. No oil leak from the rear main seal (although plenty of them from elsewhere!) the release bearing seemed a little dry but otherwise pretty noise free and smooth so I tried to pack a bit more grease in there. Cleaned everything up, put a small amount of copper slip on the splines, put it back together and it seems to be fine (not driven it yet) as an aside, I did see there’s a weep from the slave cylinder (and some small corrosion in the bore) so that will be replaced. thanks for all the input. I’ll let you know how it drives simon It does also look like there should be Dowel bolts judging by how slack the first bolt up from the slave sits in the hole. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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