RogerH Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Can somebody explain. You can fly around the world for 18Hrs + with somebody next to each shoulder But!!!!!! you can't sit next to somebody for 5 minutes on a bus In each case wearing a mask. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james christie Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Maybe the guy who thought up the scheme was still thinking as of forty years ago and persuaded that planes carry a better class of customer than the buses. Everybody knows that the better classes don’t get Covid james Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 My take is there's lots more passengers in buses (and metro )than in aircraft, so the risk of spreading the virus to the general population from flights is comparatively low. Epidemiologists like big numbers, they dont worry about risks to us as individuals. Thats left to us to suss out. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stillp Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Airlines have a lot more political clout than bus companies. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mick Forey Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Contact tracing is very easy if you fly - they know everything about you. Hop on a bus - they know nothing. Mick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james christie Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 I’m avoiding planes at the moment, with their closed ventilation system ( can anyone tell me I’m wrong?) I consider them excellent virus incubators/transmitters james Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Hi James, it would appear that you (and I) are wrong. It used to be the way that the cabin air was recycled with only a few % of new air added as and when. With the much more modern aircraft a great deal of the air is dumped and new air introduced continuously. This is according to my son who flies Airbus 321 etc. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james christie Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 My education learned me that oxygen gets thinner as you go up, where does a plane get its fresh supplies at 5000m and more james Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Hi James, where there is atmosphere, no matter how thin, there is oxygen. Aircraft engines really do pump vast quantities of air through them - most of it is not burnt but sent around the outside from the big fans. The engine itself needs a great deal of oxygen laden air. There is enough left over to pump into the cabin. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TorontoTim Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 Hi All, I've been putting off my quarterly UK visit to see my aging parents since I last saw them in February, but am just starting to think about whether the risks are acceptable. I read yesterday that the chance of catching COVID on a 2 hour flight, in a plane full of seats/rows of three people all wearing masks is ~4,300:1 and if the middle seats are all empty, it's about 7500:1. Ok, the flight from Toronto to Heathrow is a little more than 2 hours (7 there; 8 back) but perhaps I have been too cautious...?? More research to be done before I book a ticket... Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 The future of airtravel may be screwed by vaccines. If different nations used different vaccines, and 100 or so are in the pipeline, then the virus will evolve different ways around. So SARS-CoV-2 begets SARS CoV-3.......4....5.....6....7....driven by different vaccinations And antibodies we might have made ourselves against..2 may be useless against 3 ....4....5. The global village and mass air travel will be a thing of the past. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted August 24, 2020 Report Share Posted August 24, 2020 14 minutes ago, TorontoTim said: Hi All, I've been putting off my quarterly UK visit to see my aging parents since I last saw them in February, but am just starting to think about whether the risks are acceptable. I read yesterday that the chance of catching COVID on a 2 hour flight, in a plane full of seats/rows of three people all wearing masks is ~4,300:1 and if the middle seats are all empty, it's about 7500:1. Ok, the flight from Toronto to Heathrow is a little more than 2 hours (7 there; 8 back) but perhaps I have been too cautious...?? More research to be done before I book a ticket... Tim Tim, The virus will take off soon as winter approaches, like flu. Delay too long and next April-May will be the next window. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
little jim Posted August 25, 2020 Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 One of my pilot friends was one of the Canadian Airlines pilots who went on strike when the airline wanted to change the cockpit air supply from 50/50 fresh/recycled, to the passenger cabin 40/60 ratio. The cabin fresh air is bled off the compressor on one of the engines, so the move was to reduce fuel consumption on that engine (the bleed reduces power). That was to save some dough for the airline. Would think that even on the more modern planes the same balance of cost versus air quality has to be worked out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 (edited) Hi LJ, with the modern High By-Pass engines there is a lot of air whizzing through the system. The small fuel cost will easily out weigh the very bad 'Press' that airlines were getting a couple of years back due to the bad air quality. Roger Have read here - Air Con Edited August 25, 2020 by RogerH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
little jim Posted August 25, 2020 Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 True Roger. But any air bleed will alter thrust/efficiency, and some admino will be tempted alter the costs at some stage, as in the past. Academic item for airlines at the present time eh!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Misfit Posted August 25, 2020 Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 16 hours ago, Mick Forey said: Contact tracing is very easy if you fly - they know everything about you. Hop on a bus - they know nothing. Mick I was reading that on current Commercial Passenger airplane air Is provided above the passenger, it is then drawn out from beneath your feet and passes through special filters before being recycled. Whether that’s has been the case for a while I don’t know, it’s just something I read. As Mick said its easier to track and trace those flying which probably was taken into account when determining the process and answers the original question as neither is applicable on a bus. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 43 minutes ago, Misfit said: I was reading that on current Commercial Passenger airplane air Is provided above the passenger, it is then drawn out from beneath your feet and passes through special filters before being recycled. Whether that’s has been the case for a while I don’t know, it’s just something I read. Hi Derek, that has been the case since the 50's. In above your head, out at floor level into the cargo area and then a % dumped out to atmosphere. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mick Forey Posted August 25, 2020 Report Share Posted August 25, 2020 The Boeing 787 does not use air bleed from the engine compressors but a separate electric air compressor for cabin air. This completely eliminates any possibility of air contaminated with engine oil which was a bit of a problem with some engines years ago. I understand it is still a mix of filtered recycled and fresh air. Mick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Moltu Posted August 27, 2020 Report Share Posted August 27, 2020 You could always open the window Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PaulAnderson Posted August 29, 2020 Report Share Posted August 29, 2020 This link https://www.msn.com/en-gb/travel/news/how-clean-is-the-air-on-planes/ar-BB18sBsr?ocid=msedgdhp discusses the HEPA filters on some modern planes Paul Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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