Richard Pope Posted March 10, 2020 Report Share Posted March 10, 2020 1.) Did Triumph originally prime the bodies with red oxide paint? If no, then the person that did a poor restoration (using galvanised sheets, pop-rivets and lots of filler) went to an awful lot of trouble in putting it everywhere. 2.) Did Triumph originally (hand) brush a kind of black underseal all around the panel joins within the body tub and boot tub? If no, then the same person wanted to make really sure wet did not get in. As I'm doing a full body-off restore, I'm the one trying to get it all off but heat gun, scraper and then clean with petrol does get it off. If yes, then I'll have to put it all back but will use something else. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Fremont Posted March 10, 2020 Report Share Posted March 10, 2020 I can say " yes " to #2 because I found that in my '250s as far back as 1980, when no one was stripping these cars to repaint. As for #1, we still have some TR6s here in the 'States showing red primer on the underside of the floor pans, so at least for that model " yes " as well. Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ed_h Posted March 10, 2020 Report Share Posted March 10, 2020 (edited) 2. Yes. I found seam seal on most body joints. 1. Yes, at least on my '74. Edited March 10, 2020 by ed_h Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted March 11, 2020 Report Share Posted March 11, 2020 Definitely yes to both. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted March 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2020 Well thanks for this conclusive 'yes', then. Mine is an October 1973 USA car. Back to scraping off the underseal stuff, I suppose. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted March 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 OK, now removed all the old underseal type stuff liberally brushed over all body tub internal seams all under dash, footwells, floor, boot floor, etc. (FYI, I used a heat gun and spatular to remove most of it (easy); then bradall and small screwdriver to get into crevaces; then paper towling and petrol to remove just about all of it although there are still some of it that has seeped into the seam joins that I cannot get at. Some 15 hours work so not too bad IMHO for a restoration task.) I have not asked a paint spray shop yet but may well be sandblasting the whole area in due course and I guess if they do it they may well just immediately go ahead and spray it unless I go with a protective spray coating. If they are happy to spray without sandblasting then fine. What should I replace it with, if anything, as In this day and age, does one need this seam sealant? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DaveR Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 Yes, having bought a couple of new Triumphs. The problem with one of them was they left the undercoat off and the top coat just cracked and fell off. A 1967 13/60. Ended up with a Warranty re-spay. Nice car, went like a rocket. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 On 3/15/2020 at 11:42 AM, Richard Pope said: OK, now removed all the old underseal type stuff liberally brushed over all body tub internal seams all under dash, footwells, floor, boot floor, etc. (FYI, I used a heat gun and spatular to remove most of it (easy); then bradall and small screwdriver to get into crevaces; then paper towling and petrol to remove just about all of it although there are still some of it that has seeped into the seam joins that I cannot get at. Some 15 hours work so not too bad IMHO for a restoration task.) I have not asked a paint spray shop yet but may well be sandblasting the whole area in due course and I guess if they do it they may well just immediately go ahead and spray it unless I go with a protective spray coating. If they are happy to spray without sandblasting then fine. What should I replace it with, if anything, as In this day and age, does one need this seam sealant? I always seam seal all joints inside and out that way you never get water into the seams, Red primer first (Bondarust) then brushable seam sealer so you can work it into the seams properly then I always stonechip prime and paint the underside and prime and paint the top side. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 On 3/10/2020 at 6:45 PM, Richard Pope said: 1.) Did Triumph originally prime the bodies with red oxide paint? If no, then the person that did a poor restoration (using galvanised sheets, pop-rivets and lots of filler) went to an awful lot of trouble in putting it everywhere. 2.) Did Triumph originally (hand) brush a kind of black underseal all around the panel joins within the body tub and boot tub? If no, then the same person wanted to make really sure wet did not get in. As I'm doing a full body-off restore, I'm the one trying to get it all off but heat gun, scraper and then clean with petrol does get it off. If yes, then I'll have to put it all back but will use something else. 1) Yes to number 1 My 1973 TR6 PI owned from new has the whole of the body shell done in red oxide primer, but it was not very well done as the yellow top coat fell off in many places and had to be repainted in a number of areas! My car also has plenty of original black mastic around the body panel seams and some sort of black sound deadening material on certain panels i.e. floor panels. Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rod1883 Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Yes - our unrestored '74 Stag has both those attributes Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted April 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Thanks all. having taken all the rubberised sealer off everywhere it would seem the whole of my car was red oxided and then liberal use of the seam sealer. The top coat was on top of both. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeTR5 Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Just as an FYI ….the factory workshop manual has a diagram showing all the locations they applied seam sealer as well as the various types used. It might be a useful reference given how far you've come.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted April 7, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2020 I did not know that. Have looked trough the factory Repair Operation Manual but assume this is not the one as there appears nothing about it in there. Begs the question is there a link to download it? I have just searched for one but there are hundres of posts to look through. Mind you, I presume today's sealants are bettr than those the factory used Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mtrehy Posted April 7, 2020 Report Share Posted April 7, 2020 U-Pol Tigerseal is my favourite. Masking tape both sides of the seam. Thin line with the gun and smooth with wet finger. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted April 8, 2020 Report Share Posted April 8, 2020 12 hours ago, mtrehy said: U-Pol Tigerseal is my favourite. Masking tape both sides of the seam. Thin line with the gun and smooth with wet finger. I prefer a brush on as you can work it in better into the seams, this also helps further down the line when the seams move about as they will in any drop top car. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mtrehy Posted April 8, 2020 Report Share Posted April 8, 2020 Only time I use a brush is when trying to reproduce an original brushed finish on an original seam. You've got big problems if your body is distorting enough to tear through flexible pu seam sealer. But to each, their own! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted April 8, 2020 Report Share Posted April 8, 2020 46 minutes ago, mtrehy said: Only time I use a brush is when trying to reproduce an original brushed finish on an original seam. You've got big problems if your body is distorting enough to tear through flexible pu seam sealer. But to each, their own! Its not that its the fact that PU sits on the surface and doesnt actually penetrate far enough into the seam Though its your car your choice. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted April 8, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2020 Judging by the neatness above, my car was originally done by a 2" brush and on a Friday afternoon when the guy had been to the pub. It was all over the inner wheel arches and all under the dash to name but two areas. Thanks for help in this. I've got the idea of what to do. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted April 8, 2020 Report Share Posted April 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, Richard Pope said: Judging by the neatness above, my car was originally done by a 2" brush and on a Friday afternoon when the guy had been to the pub. It was all over the inner wheel arches and all under the dash to name but two areas. Thanks for help in this. I've got the idea of what to do. Thats standard OE Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TRbeginner Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 Morning all, I'm just about to apply seam sealer on the front bulkhead seams behind the dash following a complete strip out, heater refurb etc. Would be interested in recommendations for either gun applied sealer (Tigerseal....?) or brush applied, taking note of the pros/cons above. Also, showing my ignorance here, is the sealer applied on top of primer (Bondarust) or to the bare metal, then primed? Im guessing the former but wanted to check - sorry, probably a naive question. Thanks Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 On 3/10/2020 at 6:45 PM, Richard Pope said: 1.) Did Triumph originally prime the bodies with red oxide paint? If no, then the person that did a poor restoration (using galvanised sheets, pop-rivets and lots of filler) went to an awful lot of trouble in putting it everywhere. 2.) Did Triumph originally (hand) brush a kind of black underseal all around the panel joins within the body tub and boot tub? If no, then the same person wanted to make really sure wet did not get in. As I'm doing a full body-off restore, I'm the one trying to get it all off but heat gun, scraper and then clean with petrol does get it off. If yes, then I'll have to put it all back but will use something else. Yes to all your points, but on my car the yellow top coat did not stick very well to the red oxide in many areas and peeled off in a number of areas and had to be re-prepared and resprayed! The red oxide that BL was not as good as the red oxide that I used when the chassis diff mounts were repaired. I have since been told that the EU banned that type? Its a pity because there is no rust in that area even after 40+ years of exposure to the elements! Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, TRbeginner said: Morning all, I'm just about to apply seam sealer on the front bulkhead seams behind the dash following a complete strip out, heater refurb etc. Would be interested in recommendations for either gun applied sealer (Tigerseal....?) or brush applied, taking note of the pros/cons above. Also, showing my ignorance here, is the sealer applied on top of primer (Bondarust) or to the bare metal, then primed? Im guessing the former but wanted to check - sorry, probably a naive question. Thanks Dave Always red prime (Bondarust) first so you get it right into all the seams properly then seam seal before primer/paint. I use a good brushable sealer so you can get it right into the joints and use it everywhere inside and out. Tigerseal is not a proper sealer, you need something like this Seam sealer or like this More seam sealer Stuart. Edited September 1, 2020 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TRbeginner Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 18 minutes ago, stuart said: Always red prime (Bondarust) first so you get it right into all the seams properly then seam seal before primer/paint. I use a good brushable sealer so you can get it right into the joints and use it everywhere inside and out. Tigerseal is not a proper sealer, you need something like this Seam sealer or like this More seam sealer Stuart. Stuart, thanks, great clear advice. All the best, Dave. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saffrontr Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 Richard, the section on dust and water sealing is in the TR6 Workshop manual supplement. It gives details of the original sealants and adhesives used and locations where they were used. If you send me a pm I will send you a copy of that particular section that I scanned a few years back cheers Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted September 1, 2020 Report Share Posted September 1, 2020 3 hours ago, saffrontr said: Richard, the section on dust and water sealing is in the TR6 Workshop manual supplement. It gives details of the original sealants and adhesives used and locations where they were used. If you send me a pm I will send you a copy of that particular section that I scanned a few years back cheers Derek Unfortunately a lot of the original sealers are now NLS and TBH modern ones do a much better job especially when applied carefully by hand not by someone with a Time and Motion study guy breathing down his neck! Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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