iain Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 Graham JMH drove VHP529 in Nov 1958. He had just been crowned the first British F1 World Champion. The photo shows JMH starting his run in a demo at the Ken Wharton Memorial Driving Tests, organised by the Hagley and District Light Car Club. The event was evidently shown on one of the first ever BBC Grandstands and reported in Autosport, Nov 14, 1958 page 630-631. do you have contacts at the BBC archive? I cant get anywhere with them not being a researcher and all that! JMH opponent was Ken Rawlings driving Buttercup.( A special based on Standard Triumph parts that reputedly fired Sir John Black to start the TS20 project according to some). I had long suspected this photo was VHP529, the wheel trims being a very strong clue. About 2 years ago Mike Ellis was able to confirm this. A member of the HDLCC sent him a very poor photocopy of 3 photos all taken at the same event, one confirming the cars identity as VHP529. To complete the story JMH won, 35.6 sec vs Rawlings 41.0 Iain Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 Many thanks for that. I should have remembered .... Hon. Pres. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted November 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 I should have waited for the updated booook to come out ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted November 24, 2014 Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 I should have waited for the updated booook to come out ! It does make you think Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted November 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2014 N I'm a planner - thinking isnt easily done Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted November 27, 2014 Report Share Posted November 27, 2014 To those waiting to get hold of their copies of WORKS TRIUMPHS IN DETAIL, the publishers tell me they have been swamped by orders from the flyers in TRaction and elsewhere - and are working hard to clear the backlog. [That, incidentally, also explains why Amazon is stating 'Temporarily Out of Stock - they have cleared their original supply too !] From me, very many thanks for placing so many orders. From Herridge and Sons, please be patient for just a few days .... Hon. Pres. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ianc Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Worth waiting for Reading at coffee breaks, I have got to 1958 and am enjoying it very much. Plenty of quotes from those involved at the time, and details about the cars and what happened in the events. Ian Cornish Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted November 28, 2014 Report Share Posted November 28, 2014 Got mine - signed, Thanks Graham. Now put away for Christmas, when my wife will surprise me with it !! Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I doubted the tag 'Works' applied to this car, so asked Graham Robson for his thoughts, which follow. I think 'Works' in the case of this car can be taken to mean that it was manufactured on the production line at Standard Triumph, as were almost all TRs, with the exception of some TR7s. It should be noted that the TR4s prepared by the Works in the workshop run by Graham did NOT enter the 1962 Monte Carlo Rally. In fact, Graham was permitted by his boss, Harry Webster, to navigate for Peter Procter in a Works' Sunbeam Rapier in the 1962 Monte, and they came 4th overall. The first Rally entered by the Powder Blue Works' TR4s was the Tulip, in May 1962, when 3VC, 4VC and 5VC competed and 6VC was used as a recce car. Caveat emptor! Ian Cornish Graham says: Absolutely rubbish. This is an old legend, which has been proved false on several occasion, by me. 1) There was no Competitions Department in the October 1961/January 1962 period when that car would have to be prepared. The Richardson era ended in July 1961, at Radford, the Robson era began in February 1962, at Fletchamstead North. 2) In 'my period', we never, repeat never, prepared any private TR4s for motor sport. 3) Previous hot air published about this car was dispersed to show that the car was probably prepared at the Allesley Service Department at Allesley, where Ken Richardson's department had been based from 1956 to 1960. That is the only, repeat only, tenuous connection between Eddie Hodson's 1962 Monte car, and the 'works competition department'. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 would it be possible to tell me more about this car. Graham seems to know about it. who restored it. Did it do any other ralllies or races Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 (edited) All I also know is that it ended up on its roof on the 1962 Monte. The Autocar has a picture of the aftermath - p144, 26 Jan. 1962.. Eddie Hodson then does not appear to have used it seriously in other important events - he certainly did not figure in any major British events, or in 'local' Europeans like the Tulip or the French Alpine. Incidentally, since I was at the 'sharp end' at this time, I can confirm that the 'works' department never set eyes on the car in our workshops at Fletchamstead North, and neither (as I recall) did we ever field any queries about its preparation, etc. Hon. Pres. Edited December 14, 2014 by Graham Robson Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Thanks for this information. How can I get a copy of the photo you talk about. Does anyone know what happened to the car afterwards. His son claims he raced it at Oulton Park but I can't find any record of this. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Thanks for this information. How can I get a copy of the photo you talk about. Does anyone know what happened to the car afterwards. His son claims he raced it at Oulton Park but I can't find any record of this. Contact LAT (Autocar's photographic archive), ask to speak to Cathy Agar (who knows everything about this period), and spell out the page number and issue date. The picture was taken by an Autocar staff photographer, and the negative probably still exists in the LAT archive. Unhappily there will be a charge. LAT details (they are based in Teddington) are (a) in the 'flannel panel' of AUTOCAR, or ( AUTOSPORT for that matter, and I'm sure you can also find them via the Internet. Hon. Pres. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kiwifrog Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ianc Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Even though the Monte was held in winter time, the positioning of the rally plate strikes me as unfortunate or ill-considered. The Works' TR4s did not contest the Monte in 1962, as they were ony just coming off of the production line at Canley, but a year later, 5VC and three Vitesses were entered, and the registration number was applied to the forward end of the bonnet (plastic numbers) and the rally plate went were the usual number plate would go. 5VC did have a single spotlamp in the middle of the radiator grille and a further pair of spots mounted each side beneath the sidelamps. Ian Cornish Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 14, 2014 Report Share Posted December 14, 2014 Has anybody seen photos of this car after the Monte in 1962. It wasn't written off only tippped on its roof so it can't have just disapeared. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR4A1965 Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 (edited) Hi, I got mine for £37.50 signed. I did not have the promo code but asked them to send me a signed one anyway as I was a TR register member and it arrived all OK with no agro:-) Happy Christmas to you all. Paul. Edited December 18, 2014 by TR4A1965 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Boyd Posted December 18, 2014 Report Share Posted December 18, 2014 Well it's sold and new owner is happy Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
McMuttley Posted December 20, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 20, 2014 Lets hope he got at least 50% discount off the asking price !!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Boyd Posted December 20, 2014 Report Share Posted December 20, 2014 Not sold now..... Lol Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tr4Tony Posted December 22, 2014 Report Share Posted December 22, 2014 Oh dear .... Let's hope that the lawyers letters don't start to fly ... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 24, 2014 Report Share Posted December 24, 2014 was this car just a standard TR4 or was there something special about it. If Comps Dept was closed could a privater get a special car built for him. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted December 24, 2014 Report Share Posted December 24, 2014 was this car just a standard TR4 or was there something special about it. If Comps Dept was closed could a privater get a special car built for him. Yes, as I recall it was very much a standard, very-early-production, TR4. There was nothing very special about a 'works' TR3A, as is now well known - no light-alloy panels, no tuned-up engines, no homologation gizmos, for instance. Only careful preparation to standard condition, and the addition of extra lamps and (in this case) winter equipment. And in the case of this car, there was still no question of a 'works' TR4 at the time (late 1961 ....) even existing, and available to be replicated, so no-one at Allesley would know where to start. Hon. Pres. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TIL58 Posted December 24, 2014 Report Share Posted December 24, 2014 apparently the car was delivered to Hollingdrakes in Stockport. What I am trying to undertstand is what happened to this car after the Monti and was the car supplied with any special gearbox, diff etc on top of the 1991 engine. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Robson Posted December 25, 2014 Report Share Posted December 25, 2014 To repeat - there was no such thing as a special gearbox, or special diff at that time, nor had the 'works' TR3As ever used any such kit. This car, in other words, was essentially standard, no more than that. Hon. Pres. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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