fuel pump leak

[MC1234]

Hello,

I've recently noticed a smell of petrol in my TR6 (CR PI) and today found that a connection to my fuel pump was leaking. In the photo below you may just make out a fine jet of fuel which I've circled in yellow, coming from the top of the short black connecting hose.

I'm afraid I'm not familiar with the fuel pump as it's not something I've had to tackle before, but can I simply remove the short black connecting hose and replace it? Is there likely to be pressure in the pipe (obviously the fuel pump will be off)? 

From what I can understand the black cylinder is the pump and the silver cylinder is the filter so what's the blue cylinder? An in-line fuel filter?

It seems this car has had a history of leaking pumps in the past given the state of the paintwork around the pump but all was definitely dry down there quite recently.

Sorry for the basic questions - thanks for any help offered.

Matt

 

[Steve-B]

Matt,

The blue filter is your pre-pump filter. It has a strainer/filter which should be checked semi yearly. to check you need to crimp the hose from fuel tank.

The black canister is indeed your pump and the silver canister is your output filter. 

Were I you I’d try replacing the black rubber hose, and the reddish washers then put it back together  

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Steve-B

[Paul Hill]

Those metal clips on the joints are not standard and could be the cause. If you look at my joints they have the high tension clips, when the fuel hits that pipe it’s under high pressure.

[Andy Moltu]

The plastic pipe between the pump and the filter above it is meant to be an interference fit. If it loosens the clips probably won't seal it - the plastic isn't compliant enough to seal adequately unlike rubber.  

It probably needs replacing.

[Mike C]

I've  used jubilee clips on the HP side of the PI system for decades, but I use them in pairs with the heads staggered 180 degrees apart. I also use Gates Barricade hose exclusively.

Are you sure the bolt on the top banjo connection is tight?

[Steve-B]

On second thoughts, @MC1234given pressures there, you should source the proper banjo connection pipe OMNSHO. Local pipe shops should easily be able to make you one if you take the whole assembly in in a few minutes.

[Jonny TR6]

2 hours ago, Steve-B said:

On second thoughts, @MC1234given pressures there, you should source the proper banjo connection pipe OMNSHO. Local pipe shops should easily be able to make you one if you take the whole assembly in in a few minutes.

Take the old fittings and pipe off and see if you can fid a Pirtex local to you. Take it in and see if they have any nylon fuel hose. It's pressure rated massively over the original spec and can come braided as well. They will then swage it on for you at both ends. In my experience I'd be surprised if they charged more than a fiver, if anything at all.

Tell them it's for an old classic car and it'll brighten their day. They usually do stuff for JCBs etc.

 

[Jules TR6]

1 hour ago, Jonny TR6 said:

Take the old fittings and pipe off and see if you can fid a Pirtex local to you. Take it in and see if they have any nylon fuel hose. It's pressure rated massively over the original spec and can come braided as well. They will then swage it on for you at both ends. In my experience I'd be surprised if they charged more than a fiver, if anything at all.

Tell them it's for an old classic car and it'll brighten their day. They usually do stuff for JCBs etc.

 

Would good R9 hose and single eared hose clamps be ok for all the hoses around the pump?

[stuart]

1 hour ago, Jules TR6 said:

Would good R9 hose and single eared hose clamps be ok for all the hoses around the pump?

No not with that pressure.

Stuart.

[Jules TR6]

34 minutes ago, stuart said:

No not with that pressure.

Stuart.

...is that 'no' for the hoses or the clamps?

The hoses I'm using are CODAN R9 7bar hose (102psi), burst pressure 62bar (900psi).

[MC1234]

thanks for the comments and suggestions. TRGB are sending me some fuel pipe so this is hopefully a job for the weekend.

[astontr6]

On 10/3/2023 at 10:15 PM, Andy Moltu said:

The plastic pipe between the pump and the filter above it is meant to be an interference fit. If it loosens the clips probably won't seal it - the plastic isn't compliant enough to seal adequately unlike rubber.  

It probably needs replacing.

Jubilee clips should not be used in High pressure applications as you are asking for leaks. Those jubilee clips s/b swaged ferrules then you will have no leaks as per your stainless steel hose.

Bruce.

 

[RobH]

+1 

Small worm drive clips have a solid portion where the worm is, which doesn't conform to the changing radius as the clips are tightened.  That means the clamping force is not uniform.  You can sort of get away with it on a thick-walled rubber pipe at lowish pressure as the rubber will conform to the clip, but anything thinner or stiffer won't do that.   

[stuart]

17 hours ago, Jules TR6 said:

...is that 'no' for the hoses or the clamps?

The hoses I'm using are CODAN R9 7bar hose (102psi), burst pressure 62bar (900psi).

I use Gates Barracade R14 these days for safety. Your fuel system is running at 105psi so that hose your quoting wont do it.

Stuart.

[Steve-B]

2 hours ago, MC1234 said:

thanks for the comments and suggestions. TRGB are sending me some fuel pipe so this is hopefully a job for the weekend.

One hopes you're getting a Pirtex banjo replacement aren't you?

[Waldi]

A note about the rated maximum working pressure:
Especially for products like rubber hoses (pipes), the maximum allowable working pressure (MAWP) is largely depending on the temperature. The manufacturer normally lists the MAWP under optimum condition.
With 105 psi (and if the PRV is not set properly or gets stuck-closed, both cases are reported on here it will certainly not be ok) and say30-35 degr. C you are likely exceeding the allowable limits for SAE J30 - R9-spec hose.

Like Bruce above, I will not use jubilee clips for this service, only swaged (ferrule) connections.

Waldi