Richard Pope Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 (edited) I've started on a full body off restoration of a (currently LHD) 1973 TR6. The body is pretty good with the two major areas being the passenger's front floor and driver's A post inner panel from top to bottom. Otherwise all seems very good haveing benefited from a (very poor using galvanised sheets pop-rivited with filler!) restoration years ago. Sills and doors and most other sections sound. Door fit is 100% on passenger's side and only a slight deviation on driver's side so could be a slight chassis problem (chassis could be iffy in T shirt places). I thus hope to only be welding in parts of panels / bodywork, not major sections. I want to use a rollover jig and plan to brace the body internally across doors and into boot area the usual way via welding up an angle iron frame bolted to key fixings such as seat belt anchorage points. As rollover jigs seem to just bolt to the bumber fixings I do wonder if this fixing method is strong enough for the TR6. Has anyone any experience of this method? I may make up my own rollover jig via engine stands or buy a low cost universal jig. My main and obvious concern is to keep the shell rigid whilst on the jig and whilst welding in panels (plus all other preparation) as I do not want to introduce warped bodywork just because the jig is not strong enough. Further thought. Why do you not see secondhand jigs for sale from previous TR6 restorers? Edited November 9, 2018 by Richard Pope Clarity Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 (edited) Youve just answered your own question, they dont really work on a bare shell that well. If its a monocoque then its OK but the chassis which is the only sensible place to bolt the jig too gets in the way. People have tried it but personally I wouldnt. I brace the shell and then turn it upside down to do the floors and sills and then turn it back up repair the chassis carefully and then use the chassis as your jig to do the rest. Stuart. Edited November 9, 2018 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
had17462 Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 Richard what area are you based? Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ed_h Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 This body rotisserie has supports at key body mounting points to keep the body aligned. It is intended to emulate the frame while providing better access. http://bullfire.net/TR6/TR6-48/TR6-48.html Ed [/img] Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 7 hours ago, had17462 said: Richard what area are you based? Nick Horsham, West Sussex. FYI. Passionate about cars. Had my first when I was 12 and have built two Dax Rush se7ens. Now I've started a full body-off restoration of a TR6. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 Thanks for replies and yes, I probably have answered my own question. I was thinking that by building an internal frame it would strengthen the body enough to use a rollover jig but I think this may not be the best route. I had thought along the lines of the chassis above and the picture has pretty much convinced me it is the best way to go. It avoids the internal frame and gives me the (at least partial) rollover facility I want - although I will probably do a small X bracing job around the doors. I like it so Ed, may I copy your design, please? (Whilst I have a large garage I have three cars in it including the TR6 so when the body comes off space is a little tight to work on it and the chassis / running gear. Always fun when working with cars, eh? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 I'm using a rotisserie to do mine at present bolted to the bumper irons. I left the shell on the chassi as a jig and braced it as well while I did the floors, both inner/outer sills, B posts inner wings etc found it a real help getting at everything just take some time getting the centre of gravity right then it will turn with very little effort. I've now split the chassi off and have it back on the jig which give great access while I address the usual issues and have braced it with angle iron bolted through the drain holes at various points. I think its worth while and make the job much easier as I'm getting too old for laying on the ground! The only bits that are a bit awkward is the front/rear valances . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ed_h Posted November 9, 2018 Report Share Posted November 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Richard Pope said: I like it so Ed, may I copy your design, please? I'd be honoured, Richard. If you were a little closer, I'd bring it 'round. Ed Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 10, 2018 Report Share Posted November 10, 2018 15 hours ago, PodOne said: I'm getting too old for laying on the ground! Thats why I turn them upside down! Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 10, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2018 15 hours ago, PodOne said: I left the shell on the chassi as a jig ,,,,, . Yes, I thought of that but as I need to split from chassis anyway I was planning to initially leave chassis as a rolling setup whilst I tackle the body first, I quite like the idea of welding up a new and simple jig chassis as per Ed's. I do like the idea of putting the chassis in the spit to work on too. So basic and current plan is to make up jig, put body on it and work on it. Then strip rolling chassis and refurbish / re-build rolling chassis and finally get the body painted and put back (then of course all the trim). Easy eh? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 10, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2018 15 hours ago, ed_h said: I'd be honoured, Richard. If you were a little closer, I'd bring it 'round. Ed Ed, two questions ... 1. Approximately what is the measurement from the rotisarri centre line to a reference point which will probably include your chassis as it has weight? Gives me a start working out where my centre line needs to be. 2. You say your chassis is 3" x 1.25" channel steel but what is the thickness as it obviously cannot bend. Thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 10, 2018 Report Share Posted November 10, 2018 Once you have done the floors and sills, get the chassis repaired and then I would put the shell back on the chassis as thats what it has to fit to otherwise you will have all sort of problems getting the outer panels to fit. Get the chassis level on stands and then level the shell up to that with its mounting pads and then and only then fit do any other welding on the shell. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ed_h Posted November 10, 2018 Report Share Posted November 10, 2018 Richard-- Since the body isn't on the rotisserie now, I can only go by the pictures. It loos like the axis of the assembly was just above the lower air openings on the front valence. I had a series of holes on 1 inch centers to adjust the axis, so I could dial it in. The channel I used was salvage material, so I don't know what it's spec was, but it is very close to the pic attached. Regards Ed Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2018 20 hours ago, stuart said: Once you have done the floors...... Thanks Stuart but logistics plays a part here in a garage full of three cars or four when TR6 is split. I need to take off the body and can then either work on that or strip and refurbish the rolling chassis and engine. Either way I need the body up and on its side to give room in my garage so I need a rotissari to at least do that. My sills are actually perfect so there is only half the passenger's floor area and the inner engine bay / footwell part adjacent to the driver's A post as major areas. All the rest are pretty minor. Indeed all outer panels are fine with some minor rust in the upper front wing fixing channels. (car has only done 600 miles since 1988 when it was poorly restored (above post). 41,000 in total. If I do the chassis / running gear / engine first, then I would have to sort out floor then put it on new chassi then sort out other panels the remove and shotblast, paint etc, then put back. I had planned to remove body and sort that all out including painting and store on rotissari whilst I then tackled the chassis / runnging gear / engine and put all back together. I do however agree that I cannot afford to have a warped body. With Ed's style of chassis and my pretty good body I do not think thigs will warp and it makes logistics easier. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2018 18 hours ago, ed_h said: Since the body ... Thanks Ed. Scrap metal near me seems hard to find and new is expensive but I'm looking. I've thought up a few mods to save weight and cost of new metal so will post when complete - a few months time, perhaps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 Just thought I would close posts for now with a few pics of the extent of the rot. Currently it does not seem a lot. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
foster461 Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 I wonder if the guy was an HVAC contractor. I especially liked the multi-media finish on the left rear inner fender - bondo, wire mesh and a galvanized steel plate. Stan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tim T Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 I made a very basic rotisserie with an timber A-frame at each end with scaffold poles linking the frames. The poles passed through 18mm plywood 'ribs' bolted at the rear to the fuel tank mounting points and to the engine side of the front bulkhead. The car tub was almost free of rust so pretty strong but was braced across the doors as usual. total cost was about £100. The result is very sturdy and allows me to rotate the car single handed. Seems to work for me! Cheers, Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted November 12, 2018 Report Share Posted November 12, 2018 8 hours ago, Richard Pope said: Just thought I would close posts for now with a few pics of the extent of the rot. Currently it does not seem a lot. I think once you start cutting into her there will be double the rot you can see. Those previous repairs are interesting! Any consolation mine was much worse than yours but after 12 months we are geting there. Best of luck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 On 11/12/2018 at 1:18 PM, foster461 said: I wonder if the guy was an HVAC contractor. I especially liked the multi-media finish on the left rear inner fender - bondo, wire mesh and a galvanized steel plate. Stan ... and pop rivets! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 Thanks guys for all your advice / suggestions. I like the scaffold pole idea but think I will still go for the ladder chassis similar to Ed's above. Today I got prices for this and using much thicker 76mm x 38mm x approx 6mm mild steel channel plus box section and angle iron amounts to £200 delivered and the guys say they will find some metal for the two pivots as well so all in all less than £250. Mind you I have some welding to do as well plus my 'free' times spent on it. I've also planned out a logistics exercise to do it all within my garage so I guess we are nearly on the way. I'll post more when I have more to show. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted November 13, 2018 Report Share Posted November 13, 2018 11 minutes ago, Richard Pope said: Thanks guys for all your advice / suggestions. I like the scaffold pole idea but think I will still go for the ladder chassis similar to Ed's above. Today I got prices for this and using much thicker 76mm x 38mm x approx 6mm mild steel channel plus box section and angle iron amounts to £200 delivered and the guys say they will find some metal for the two pivots as well so all in all less than £250. Mind you I have some welding to do as well plus my 'free' times spent on it. I've also planned out a logistics exercise to do it all within my garage so I guess we are nearly on the way. I'll post more when I have more to show. You might want to consider one of these https://www.rolloverjigs.com/product-category/jigs/ might work out cheaper and easier option given the cost of materials. It has handle the combined weight of the chassi and tub for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Pope Posted November 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted November 17, 2018 Thanks but actually that's where I started but realised the whole weight of the car was on the bumper mountings and with the chassis removed, the front valence is pretty weak. I've just shaved £50 off the cost of materials and so I think the Ed solution is best for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave McDonald Posted November 21, 2018 Report Share Posted November 21, 2018 On 11/12/2018 at 1:27 PM, Tim T said: I made a very basic rotisserie with an timber A-frame at each end with scaffold poles linking the frames. The poles passed through 18mm plywood 'ribs' bolted at the rear to the fuel tank mounting points and to the engine side of the front bulkhead. The car tub was almost free of rust so pretty strong but was braced across the doors as usual. total cost was about £100. The result is very sturdy and allows me to rotate the car single handed. Seems to work for me! Cheers, Tim Tim, Your car is a TR5 isn't it, so your scaffold tube can pass through the boot unobstructed to the rear pivot support. To do something similar for a TR6 would involve putting the tube through the rear valance. I'm about to start a restoration of my own TR5 so I'm interested in how you connected to the front bulkhead and through the front valance. Do you have any more photos please showing the front in more detail? I note that you have 2 tubes spliced together. Was that due to using available materials for economy or are there alignment problems to prevent one long tube passing straight through? Was the scaffold tube sufficiently robust to take the load without bending, or is that the reason for 2 tubes, to add strength? Dave McD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave McDonald Posted November 21, 2018 Report Share Posted November 21, 2018 On 11/17/2018 at 8:16 AM, Richard Pope said: but realised the whole weight of the car was on the bumper mountings and with the chassis removed, the front valence is pretty weak. Richard, That was my thought too and I had dismissed the idea of a rotisserie for that reason, but Tims' (check apostrophe position, reference a recent thread in Members' Chat area!!) solution has given me food for thought. Dave McD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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