monty Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 The workshop manual says that the clutch master cylinder cannot be removed without taking out the complete base bracket complete with both brake & clutch master cylinders! Anybody found or know of a way just the clutch cylinder can be removed without disturbing the brake master? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graeme Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 I changed mine on the 4A without disturbing the brakes, it is awkward to get the two securing bolts out, but is doable. Cheers Graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 Hi Monty, as Graeme states not too difficult. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tim hunt Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 +2 Monty, perfectly doable and the brake m/c can also be removed in isolation if required. Just goes to show that the WM is not infallible and you should not believe all you read there. Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 Thanks guys. Any special scanners needed? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 Hi Monty perhaps an MRI or a CAT but I would stick with a very small socket set. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mikeh Posted June 7, 2017 Report Share Posted June 7, 2017 Hi Monty, I did this job myself over the weekend and it can definitely be done without removing the brake master cylinder or the mounting bracket. However, as you've already realised, it's tricky finding the right socket combination to access the lower mounting bolt as it needs to clear the fluid reservoir but not clash with the bulkhead. In the end, I found that a 1/4" rachet drive with a 2" wobble bar, a 1/4" to 3/8" adapter, and a 3/8" drive 1/2" AF socket did the trick. The other thing I did, which might not be absolutely necessary, was to remove the pushrod first - there's a retaining clip under the rubber boot & this can be removed with fine-nose pliers. Hope this helps Regards Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tim hunt Posted June 8, 2017 Report Share Posted June 8, 2017 Now you mention it Mike that's exactly the same combination of ratchet, bar, socket and adaptor I now recall using for this job! Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 8, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2017 Hi Monty, I did this job myself over the weekend and it can definitely be done without removing the brake master cylinder or the mounting bracket. However, as you've already realised, it's tricky finding the right socket combination to access the lower mounting bolt as it needs to clear the fluid reservoir but not clash with the bulkhead. In the end, I found that a 1/4" rachet drive with a 2" wobble bar, a 1/4" to 3/8" adapter, and a 3/8" drive 1/2" AF socket did the trick. The other thing I did, which might not be absolutely necessary, was to remove the pushrod first - there's a retaining clip under the rubber boot & this can be removed with fine-nose pliers. Hope this helps Regards Many thanks Mike. We are now hoping it is just the slave cylinder. Waiting for parts to arrive & will replace next week. Fingers crossed we can leave the master alone. Cheers. Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 9, 2017 Report Share Posted June 9, 2017 It wont be the slave, that would just leak as there is only one way for the fluid to go and that is out. Master cylinder is the culprit. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graeme Posted June 10, 2017 Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 It wont be the slave, that would just leak as there is only one way for the fluid to go and that is out. Master cylinder is the culprit. Stuart. ^^^ Wot he said. Graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted June 10, 2017 Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 Thanks guys. Any special scanners needed? Beer goggles after is the best tip I can give Peter W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 It wont be the slave, that would just leak as there is only one way for the fluid to go and that is out. Master cylinder is the culprit. Stuart. It is rather odd as there is no leakage from the master when clutch pedal is depressed & held down but when the same thing is done the slave gradually loses 'pressure' & creeps back despite keeping the pedal down. We are starting the easiest thing first by replacing the slave next week & then the master? Thanks for your hint though Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 10, 2017 Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 (edited) It is rather odd as there is no leakage from the master when clutch pedal is depressed & held down but when the same thing is done the slave gradually loses 'pressure' & creeps back despite keeping the pedal down. We are starting the easiest thing first by replacing the slave next week & then the master? Thanks for your hint though Stuart. What you have described is exactly what points to master cylinder, no leak because the fluid is just circulating behind the seal on the right at the bottom of the picture but not leaking as its not passing the left hand one next to it http://www.moss-europe.co.uk/repair-kit-brake-master-cylinder-grk1027.html?assoc=114465 Stuart. Edited June 10, 2017 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 What you have described is exactly what points to master cylinder, no leak because the fluid is just circulating behind the seal on the right at the bottom of the picture but not leaking as its not passing the left hand one next to it http://www.moss-europe.co.uk/repair-kit-brake-master-cylinder-grk1027.html?assoc=114465 Stuart. Understood Stuart, buy complete new M C or just the repair kit? Myself & the workshop favour a new cylinder. Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 Understood Stuart, buy complete new M C or just the repair kit? Myself & the workshop favour a new cylinder. Cheers. P.S. Any advantage or need in buying the Revington M.C. adjustable push rod? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Robert Sackley Posted June 10, 2017 Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 Apologies for the late response. The clutch and brake master cylinders are easy to remove and replace. The awkward lower bolts can be accessed using a 1/2'' drive 1/2'' AF socket, a 3'' length of 1/2'' x 1/2'' steel bar, and an open ended 1/2'' AF spanner. Beg the piece of steel bar from your local friendly ironworker and keep it in your 'come in handy one day toolkit'. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 10, 2017 Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 (edited) Understood Stuart, buy complete new M C or just the repair kit? Myself & the workshop favour a new cylinder. Cheers. Go for a new one as fitting a kit often doesnt last long, but change the push rod from the old master cylinder to the new one as the repros are often a different length.Dont bother with adjustable pushrod on the master but I always run an adjustable pushrod and spring on the slave but you do need to know how to adjust them properly Stuart. Edited June 10, 2017 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 10, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2017 Go for a new one as fitting a kit often doesnt last long, but change the push rod from the old master cylinder to the new one as the repros are often a different length.Dont bother with adjustable pushrod on the master but I always run an adjustable pushrod and spring on the slave but you do need to know how to adjust them properly Stuart. Hi again Stuart. I thought a TR4 has an adjustable rod & Spring on the slave & it was the 4A that went to a non adjustable, hence the Revington kit? Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 11, 2017 Report Share Posted June 11, 2017 Hi again Stuart. I thought a TR4 has an adjustable rod & Spring on the slave & it was the 4A that went to a non adjustable, hence the Revington kit? Cheers. Correct it was deleted on a 4a, my comment was because I thought you were referring to an adjustable pushrod for the master cylinder. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 12, 2017 Hi Monty, I did this job myself over the weekend and it can definitely be done without removing the brake master cylinder or the mounting bracket. However, as you've already realised, it's tricky finding the right socket combination to access the lower mounting bolt as it needs to clear the fluid reservoir but not clash with the bulkhead. In the end, I found that a 1/4" rachet drive with a 2" wobble bar, a 1/4" to 3/8" adapter, and a 3/8" drive 1/2" AF socket did the trick. The other thing I did, which might not be absolutely necessary, was to remove the pushrod first - there's a retaining clip under the rubber boot & this can be removed with fine-nose pliers. Hope this helps Regards Mike Mike, did you replace the M/C with a new Moss/Rimmers/Revington M/C or did you manage to find any upgraded or better quality items? I have searched in vain to find stuff not made in Taiwan! Cheers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted June 12, 2017 Report Share Posted June 12, 2017 Monty, Based on experiences shared on this forum I had mine resleeved and refurbished by Past Parts. Cannot share experience good or bad yet because I have just installed them. The turnaround time was a couple of weeks (I am based in The Netherlands), But what I understand from others is the resleeved originals last longer than the cheaper repro's. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mikeh Posted June 12, 2017 Report Share Posted June 12, 2017 Hi Monty, To answer your question, after discussions with a couple of TR specialists, I purchased a new replacement from one of the usual suspects. I did look at getting the old unit resleeved (it wasn't a Girling original) but, interestingly, while Past Parts quoted me for the work, they themselves suggested using a new pattern part instead. In addition, given that the clutch hydraulics were last touched 20+ years ago, for good measure I replaced the slave cylinder and flexible hose at the same time. Regards Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 13, 2017 Report Share Posted June 13, 2017 Just replaced mine with a new TR Shop one. Old one was fine but starting to go porous in the body. New one is fine. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
monty Posted June 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2017 Just replaced mine with a new TR Shop one. Old one was fine but starting to go porous in the body. New one is fine. Stuart. Still a reproduction item presumably Stuart? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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