Z320 Posted March 14, 2020 Report Share Posted March 14, 2020 (edited) Hi Keith, thank you to be with me, I use "ATE plastilube", that's clear, if you look very close you see it an 4 photos, the others are made "dry" in my workshop. The BMW leavers are out of the TR again and back on the BMW brake shoes to show the self adjusting mechanism. 1 is the push bar, a zinc coated, forked steel tube, no thread inside 2 a spring steel washer to reduce the friction to the toothed nut 3 a M6 threaded bar LH / RH, with forked end, and a toothed M6 nut LH / RH 4 a spring for the automatc mechanism (behind) Photo above is from the rear side: when the hydraulic cylinder pushes the brake shoes the push bar becomes slack and is pushed by the spring / littel tin item against the handbrake leaver, when the play is too big the tin item turns the RH threaded nut down, This reduces the play automaticly. On the other side of the car the tin item is on the other side of the brake, so the threaded bar and nut are LH. See here how it works, a short video on my YouTube channel This I have to transfer on the TR brake. I may fail with that..... Ciao, Marco Edited March 14, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted March 14, 2020 Report Share Posted March 14, 2020 I mentioned before that the Stag rear brake backplate is drilled 30 degrees further round to the TR. Would that partial rotation of the brake allow the adjustable BMW brake shoe push rod to fit next to the ‘flat’ of the TR rear hub unit? Rather than how it would currently fit, across the hub retaining nut. Cheers Peter W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 14, 2020 Report Share Posted March 14, 2020 hmmm, works and fits without the springs on the hub, to get it there with the springs on the hub it needs modifications Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keith1948 Posted March 14, 2020 Report Share Posted March 14, 2020 Hello Marco I seem to remember I had a BMW 3 series with the self adjusting mechanism and there was a hole so you could insert a screwdriver to back it off if needed so you could get the drum off. Can't remember though whether it was on the face of the drum or in the backplate - it was some years ago and I no longer have the workshop manual. Just thought it was worth mentioning before you fit it and can't get it off. Cheers Keith Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 (edited) Hi Keith, thank you for this advice, indeed I also remember this from different cars. It can drive you crazy if you don't know or if it don't work. But don't worry, I mainly use the TR manual adjuster, to keep the brake piston as deep as possible in the brake cylinder, the automatic adjuster finally only eliminates the last play. So I further can get off the drum as usual. Please don't hesitate the give me any advice that could be helpful. Ciao, Marco Edited March 15, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 12 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said: I mentioned before that the Stag rear brake backplate is drilled 30 degrees further round to the TR. Would that partial rotation of the brake allow the adjustable BMW brake shoe push rod to fit next to the ‘flat’ of the TR rear hub unit? Rather than how it would currently fit, across the hub retaining nut. Cheers Peter W Hi Peter, thank to remember me this, I hope it works in the TR position, with the first fit without springs it seems to fit. Ciao, Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bfg Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 Marco, just a little food for thought to snack on .. Utilising the handbrake cable re-route you've done., I wonder if the above, much simpler 2:1 lever, might present an alternative mechanism. In combination with the ratio inherent in the standard hand lever ..and the reduced friction of this configuration ..it might work.? Most likely the green pushrod would need a block (screwed onto the brake shoe) to prevent it kicking up but I think it might be workable if the advantage (combined ratios) is adequate. Adjustment would be in the Bowden cable and that may be done inside the car at the hand lever, or else via an inline screw adjuster (..same as used on motorcycle brake cables) at the hub. Anyway., just an idea.. Pete. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 (edited) Peeete! You are a genius - bad sadly I have to tell you - others have been faster for at least 50 years. Turn your construction 90° and pull the cable straight behind out of the brake drum. I owned a 1974 Mercedes Benz 300D with this "scissors"-concept for the "fixing brake" and I might remember Fiat and Alfa used it too. Don't be sad about that, please. Later some new photos. This is from the "Ate (German badge) brake manual", 370 pages Edited March 15, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bfg Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 I'm not sad Marko. If you had asked me 50 years ago.. I would have presented you with the idea then Their configuration improves the leverage and also works very in a confined space. But mine would be easier to make ..from where you are starting from By coincidence, I did first think of it turned 90 degrees (tucked under / behind your brake-cable tube), but decided it would be more difficult to explain / sketch (sort of like fig 13. doesn't make much sense without knowing the concept first), so I drew it this way around so it had clear context of the brake shoes. As and aside ; when I was still at school I sketched an idea for a (motorcycle) gearbox - which used two cones and a planetary friction-wheel running between them. My best friend at school told me it had already been done by DAF (variomatic) ! ..end of conversation. I felt stupid so stopped inventing things. I wonder what I might have invented if instead I had been encouraged.? I'd never heard of Ate. Apparently it is another one of those companies brimming with clever ideas that got was swallowed up by a larger group. Now owned by Continental ..who I also did not know did much more than tyres and other rubber parts like automotive belts. Thanks, Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bfg Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 by the way when you used the word " scissors" I thought you meant something like this . . . Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 15, 2020 Report Share Posted March 15, 2020 (edited) Hi Pete, I "invented" a very useful tool to make tiny screws shorter on the grinder bench, also I" invented" tap guides. Had them in use for many years with positiv response from friends. But finally I always had to realize they have already has been "invented". It is the time, need and circumstances that makes inventions, so some inventions are made by several persons. Some earlier, others later. Ciao, Marco Edited March 16, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted March 16, 2020 Report Share Posted March 16, 2020 Hi Marco, I am with you and your 'post inventive genius' I have invented so many things - just after someone else had the bright idea. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 16, 2020 Report Share Posted March 16, 2020 (edited) +1 Edited March 16, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 16, 2020 Report Share Posted March 16, 2020 (edited) This are the photos. The leaver I reduced for some millimeter without making it weaker, possible way on the end of the leaver is 36 mm now! Making the gap for the forked end on the trailing shoe made me no worries, just had to close the original drill for the spring with an 8 mm plug. The other side made me worry because the gap cannot be made very deep, so I made the gap on the push tube deeper (btw the tube shorter), also a little pit on the leaver to hold it better in its position. On top a nut with a shoulder, pressed in and clued in to assemble easier. On the other side the leaver is "fixed" with a 10 mm bush (with some play). Clued a nut on the pin not to lose the tiny tin item while fitting the brake shoes. Ready to go on the car, see the tiny tin item in the fork (!), but first put all in pieces again (edit: next a earlier photo without the clued nut from above). Standard fitting of the TR brake shoes, then slide the forked bolt in the trailing brake shoe, see the bolt that could be touched by the push bar (but does not) Slide the forked tube in and turn the toothed nut out for some millimeter, spring off again to get the leaver in. Bolt it tight with the bush, fix the adjuster spring and check, make shure the tiny tin item (!) is IN the fork as shown above. Back in pieces again, here the forked push tube could scratch on the bolt, but does not, anyway I made a little modification ready for the other side of the car - but sadly I forgot one item to put in, no problem, who sees what is missing, I mentioned that earlier. The fact all fits is "more luck than mind" (German saying), and perhaps the choice of parts for a 9" BMW drum brake Ciao, Marco Edited March 17, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted March 16, 2020 Report Share Posted March 16, 2020 Very nice Marco. oh yes, the little pin in the leaver. Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 16, 2020 Report Share Posted March 16, 2020 (edited) Hmmm, which little pin in the leaver? Have I forgotten two items? Edited March 17, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted March 17, 2020 Report Share Posted March 17, 2020 I thought there were three things missing Here to help - Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 17, 2020 Report Share Posted March 17, 2020 Roger, you make me shiver Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 (edited) OK, both brakes ready last evening but too late for a test drive, perhaps today. But at the garage from bolting the adaptors and wire wheels on the car it worked wonderful. And to hear click-click-click from the automatic adjusters was loevely. Next photos are my new braking shoes after my failed test drive some days ago with the new brake drums. That will work lovely after driving some miles - at least with the hydraulic brake. Ciao, Marco today: my wife's carpenter.. in this case she always tells me: "imagine a wheel on each corner - and you will have great fun" Edited March 21, 2020 by Z320 wifes - wife's Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 Bravo Peter W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 Excellent Marco, those lines appear to be bedding in nicely. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 On 4/25/2017 at 9:45 AM, Graham said: Strange because the listing in the string above is for Tony, possibly he makes/sells a couple of variants ? I know I had to wait for him to get new stock of the TR ones in On 5/7/2017 at 10:00 AM, KiwiTR6 said: Stan or Stuart Can you give more detail on how this is done? Checked the Buckeye Triumphs rear brake overhaul page and there doesn't appear to be any mention of this. If it's not too involved, I'll do it to my brakes next time they're apart. Gavin I also bought mine from Hart Engineering years ago, it was a massive improvement over the original operation. I have always been tempted to have another set manufactured but slightly longer in S/S as I have access to CNC machining, to see if that gives more improvement. Bruce Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 Time to start another project today Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, Z320 said: Time to start another project today Hi Marco, Did you drive her and test the hand brake? Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted March 21, 2020 Report Share Posted March 21, 2020 Hi Waldi, sadly not because of the Corona virus we are all kindly invited to stay at home, today it is raining all day and I don't want a wet car in the garage and a final quotation will be only possible when the new brake shoes are bedded in. But I will let you know. Stay safe, Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.