Louis Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Can anyone tell me the correct level to fill the radiator on my 3a. It seems if I keep the level to 1/2" to a 1" at the bottom of the filler neck, i don't lose any water after a good run. If I fill any higher than this for example 1" from the top of the rad filler, due to the expansion of hot water and after the engine has been switched off I allways lose a little through the overflow pipe... I know as I write this I'm probably answering my own question but no harm in asking... Cheers Louis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Your 1/2" to a 1" rule is perfect. Do check the radiator cap though: the correct pressure for this cap is 4psi. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 (edited) Louis, Menno is correct - the filler neck also acts as an expansion tank. Cheers Andrew Edited June 24, 2012 by Andrew Smith Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Louis Posted June 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Thanks Menno, Im slowly learning. Just waiting for some of the shows now so I can look at the different ways people fit their electric fans. I wish I didn't have to fit one but I would rather keep my eye on the road other than the temp gauge. Thanks again Louis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 (edited) Louis, This is how my 13" blower Kenlowe is mounted to my 58 3A 'TuRK': Cheers Andrew Edited June 24, 2012 by Andrew Smith Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Louis Posted June 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Cheers Andrew... Can I get away without removeing the front apron doing it this way. It's not that I'm lazy, im just nervous...! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Hi Louis, Yes you can, the first photo shows the apron off but that was removed to do other work - the Kenlowe sits nicely on the front lip of the inner apron which acts as a locating guide - Triumph thought of everything, and could even see into the future! Cheers Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MilesA Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 (edited) Hi Louis As a relatively new owner, I wholeheartedly agree about not watching the temp gauge! I am gradually working through all the mods' which owners on the forum have identified to keep the temperature down. Having this weekend finally fitted the missing air dam to block the gaps either side of the radiator and force air through the radiator, it has made a serious impact on lowering the running temperature (as I was repeatedly told it would). If you haven't got one - get one and install it! You simply need to remove the grill and the front bumper (by undoing the 2 nuts where it is attached through the body and the 2 bolts attaching the stays to the overriders, whilst the bumper rests on something to stop it dropping). You can secure the air dam on either side using the overrider stays to secure it to the wheel arch. Pretty sure you can fit a front mounted fan by doing this but Andrew will no doubt let you know whether that is so. Fan first then finish with the air dam I would have thought. Regards - Miles PS I only have an electric fan on the other side of the rad as the original fan was discarded when the car was rebuilt. On my post-air dam installation run on Saturday afternoon I hardly need to use the fan at all whereas usually it is on all the time. Forced air alone was (almost) enough to keep the temperature at 85. Edited June 24, 2012 by MilesA Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Louis Posted June 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Lol...Andrew was there any reason for the size of kenlowe you used, apart from the cooling power of the larger 13". i was only going for a 10". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Hi Louis, No, just bigger is better for performance in my view - by the way, yes fitting the cardboard rad duct is a must, but you don't need to remove the bumper just the two stay brackets which mount through the grille as these are mounting points for the duct. Cheers Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Louis Posted June 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Thanks Miles. i should have my rad shroud by the weekend. My running temp is great, its the temp at tickover or when hitting traffic for any length of time that worries me, but thanks to all you guys im sure i will get it sorted.! Regards Louis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 The duct is a 'must'. My car has the fan on the inside of the rad (a so called 'puller' fan). Not a Kenlowe, a Pacet. Make sure you wire it using a relay and try to install an override switch on the dash (You can see my car's on my signature pic: on the left side of the dashboard, next to a warning light that comes on every time the fan cuts in. Also, make sure that the timing is correct. TRs (too far) retarded ignition tend to get hot too. There's a lot of info on the forum about this subject. I'm sure you'll be able to read all about it before you start the job. Lots or do's and don'ts included! Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Elliott Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Here is how I mounted a 12" Kenlowe fan on my 1958 TR3A in 1991. It is high enough that I can still use the hand-crank. I only use it in heavy traffic and I turn it on/off with a manual switch under the dashboard. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Lots of ways to install the fan. Last weekend I saw a 3A with two L- shaped bars running from just behind the grill backwards and then upwards just in front of the rad. The fan was mounted between these two brackets. The onwer told me that he didn't trust himself pushing the plastic strips (that hold the fan in position) through the rad core without damaging the core. The fan was positioned pretty high, like Don's. Under the fan, also mounted on the L-shaped bracket was an oil cooler. And he had covered the oil cooler's core with a quality mesh (like a Bentley grill) to prevent stones damaging the oil cooler's core. Personally, I don't think that a TR needs an oil cooler when the car is used under normal driving conditions and second: by placing the oil cooler in front of the radiator, you will loose a part of the radiator's cooling capacity. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MilesA Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Thanks Miles. i should have my rad shroud by the weekend. My running temp is great, its the temp at tickover or when hitting traffic for any length of time that worries me, but thanks to all you guys im sure i will get it sorted.! Regards Louis Louis As the duct is cardboard, most recommend waterproofing it in some way. I applied several coats of PVA and then sprayed the front with several further coats of body colour paint. Miles Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I've never had or needed the ducting on my TR3As and only ever had cooling problems due to a burst hose, but cannot understand why it is easy to get good stainless steel ducts for TR4-6 but not for the sidescreen cars. I wonder how many others are running without the cardboard duct which disintegrated decades ago and never got replaced. Maybe there is no real demand - especially if the cooling system is in good order and regularly maintained. Must confess, I do have a plastic fan and a Pacet pusher fitted nowadays, but the electric fan rarely comes on except in very heavy traffic jams and it's loud enough to hear so I don't have a warning light. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richardtr3a Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 A simple improvement is to fit apressurised expansion bottle ,taking the hose from the overflow outlet to the new bottle. Fit a blanking cap to the radiator and a 4 lbs pressure cap to the bottle. Mine is mounted on the wing opposite the distributor.This gives a lot of extra water in the radiator and works very well. A pusher fan is best and mine is a Kenlowe mounted on the front of the radiator on brackets riveted to the radiator surround. I tried fixing through the radiator with long plastic bolts and made two holes in the waterway. Another repair job. Good luck all this works very well on my 3A Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 (edited) If anyone cares to PM me their eMail address I will send photo's of the aluminium duct I made. The only problem with the fibreboard ducts is the fact that they don't last long due to getting soggy in the rain and also that they allow the cooling air to be directed over, instead of through, the radiator. (Compare my modification with the air intake of the TR2). I also modified my cooling system to a closed circuit type. Plain cap on the rad. and a 7psi cap on the (Rover SD1) plastic expansion tank. (REMEMBER ~The higher the pressurised cap the higher the boiling point). Tom Edited June 25, 2012 by Fireman049 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
angelfj Posted July 1, 2012 Report Share Posted July 1, 2012 Louis As the duct is cardboard, most recommend waterproofing it in some way. I applied several coats of PVA and then sprayed the front with several further coats of body colour paint. Miles In the USA this cardboard shroud was offered free of charge as there was a service advice letter sent to dealers/owners. I have often wondered about the colour of these dealer-installed shrouds. Those installed by the factory were painted body colour. Surely the dealers didn't stock multiple coloured shrouds. Maybe they did??? During the restoration of Gray Lady, we painted our shroud with the same Silverstone Grey DuPont Chroma polyurethane used on the body. It amazed us how much paint was absorbed by the cardboard. It was quite heavy and almost bullet-proof after painting. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ashley James Posted July 1, 2012 Report Share Posted July 1, 2012 I've finally fitted the cardboard duct to my car, unfortunately before someone mentioned that it'll dissolve when it rains. I'm surprised at how effective it is, it makes a big difference and means that the fan comes on far less often. The gauge reads about 1/8" lower all the time. I'm guessing the original was made from vulcanised cardboard which is fairly impervious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Elliott Posted July 1, 2012 Report Share Posted July 1, 2012 (edited) The TR2 and TR3 came with an air director built into the front valance - stamped from steel as part of the front valance. My 1958 TR3A was built on Feb. 14, 1958 and I took delivery of it in May, 1958. It had no cardboard air deflector. But it was about May or June that year, other TR3A owners (mostly in the USA where it can get very hot) discovered the problem. The dealers started to report back to Coventry about the overheating problem and they had to develop a retro-fit that didn't cost too much and could be easily fitted in a few minutes by a dealer who had a customer who complained. This was installed free of charge. But I still drove for over 80,000 with no air deflector. From new I overheated a lot. I had the head off at least 5 times in 80,000 miles because of the overheating. Each time I would have a tiny skim done to make it flat again and I always used new head gaskets. In 1990 as I was finishing my restoration, I bought an air deflector. It came with a black finish on each side, but since then (more than 109,000 miles and 23 years later), it is still the same one from 1990. I have sprayed it about 4-5 times during that interval and it is still doing it's job. Each time I sprayed it (both sides) it soaked in the paint like Frank describes - mostly where the heat causes splits in the paint and these splits (even though only about 10 to 20 % below the surface) can let rain get into the cardboard and this could lead to early deterioration. With the air deflector and the 12" Kenlowe fan, I have not had any more overheating and have never blown another head gasket in 23 years. Edited July 1, 2012 by Don Elliott Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Louis Posted July 1, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2012 Thanks for your input chaps... Got shroud at the weekend just need time to copy pattern, paint and fit.. Then on to my electric fan... I've been reading all the info on fans and wiring them into a positive earth set up. I hate with a passion messing with car electrics so its great to know you people are out there to help. Regard Louis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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