Original TR3A engine bay layout

[Nobbysr]

Hi Folk

I'm trying to find some photos of what an original 3A engine looks like, in particular which items are painted and which are just left Zinc passivated  ... for example my bonnet Dzus brackets are painted which doesn't make sense... best to get right before it goes to paint 

any help gratefully received

Cheers

Steve

[stuart]

From a concours car a few years ago and yes the bonnet dzus brackets should be painted.

Stuart.

 

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by stuart

[Hamish]

Is that points off for being cleaner and shinier than ever produced by the factory ?

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

5 hours ago, stuart said:

From a concours car a few years ago and yes the bonnet dzus brackets should be painted.

Stuart.

 

 

Shame about the copper pipe work.  My friend just had a roll of copper pipe zinc plated to avoid that.

I thought the bonnet plunger was painted.

[Nobbysr]

Many Thanks Stuart   that's very helpful ..  interesting location  for the water bottle . My car has a glass Trico bottle   but its not the same as the electric  washer bottles supplied by  Moss,. The bottle is attached to the N/S inner wing 

All the best 

Steve

[stuart]

15 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

Shame about the copper pipe work.  My friend just had a roll of copper pipe zinc plated to avoid that.

I thought the bonnet plunger was painted.

Depends on how close to original original you want to be. TRF do steel pipe sets as per original though AFIK no one over here does. Paint on bonnet plunger lasts all of five minutes once its been used

Stuart.

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

8 hours ago, stuart said:

Depends on how close to original original you want to be. TRF do steel pipe sets as per original though AFIK no one over here does. Paint on bonnet plunger lasts all of five minutes once its been used

Stuart.

That was the reason my friend had a rolls of 3/16", 1/4" & 5/16"  tubing zinc plated, so he would have the right coloured pipe that he could use to make his own pipe sets with.  The plating was not what you would call cheap.  He crimped the ends of the tubing so they did not fill with plating solution/electrolyte.

I had my plunger assy powder coated in satin black and it all still looks quite good after 5 years.

 

Edited July 22, 2022 by BlueTR3A-5EKT

[Nobbysr]

Funnily enough i did get some pipes from the roadster factory and pre-bent they are an excellent . One thing I was wondering .. Was there captive nuts on the inside of the Master cylinder bracket, for the adjusting screws 

cheers

Steve

[stuart]

1 hour ago, Nobbysr said:

Funnily enough i did get some pipes from the roadster factory and pre-bent they are an excellent . One thing I was wondering .. Was there captive nuts on the inside of the Master cylinder bracket, for the adjusting screws 

cheers

Steve

Early ones did but deleted fairly early on in 3a

Stuart.

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

2 hours ago, Nobbysr said:

Funnily enough i did get some pipes from the roadster factory and pre-bent they are an excellent . One thing I was wondering .. Was there captive nuts on the inside of the Master cylinder bracket, for the adjusting screws 

cheers

Steve

...and those two are precisely the ones you want pre bent

Peter W

[Nobbysr]

2 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

...and those two are precisely the ones you want pre bent

Peter W

Bang on the Money there Peter and they were a perfect fit

[Nobbysr]

3 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

...and those two are precisely the ones you want pre bent

Peter W

 

4 hours ago, stuart said:

Early ones did but deleted fairly early on in 3a

Stuart.

thanks Stuart

[Black Forest TR3A]

On 7/21/2022 at 1:12 PM, Nobbysr said:

Hi Folk

I'm trying to find some photos of what an original 3A engine looks like, in particular which items are painted and which are just left Zinc passivated  ... for example my bonnet Dzus brackets are painted which doesn't make sense... best to get right before it goes to paint 

any help gratefully received

Cheers

Steve

Hi Steve,

originally painted was nearly everything that belonged to the body, because all the parts (wings, lift mechanism etc.) were painted with red/brown primer, then the parts were bolted together and after that painted in body colour. So all nuts and bolts (from the wings, tie member, blanking plate etc.) are in body colour.

As a rule: Every body part that was fitted at Mulliners was painted in body colour. Even the stay rod retaining rubber with its split pin was...

Especially the brass tag with EB... was painted in body colour while the commision brass tag WAS NOT (this was fitted at the Coventry Standart factory).

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

11 minutes ago, Black Forest TR3A said:

Hi Steve,

originally painted was nearly everything that belonged to the body, because all the parts (wings, lift mechanism etc.) were painted with red/brown primer, then the parts were bolted together and after that painted in body colour. So all nuts and bolts (from the wings, tie member, blanking plate etc.) are in body colour.

As a rule: Every body part that was fitted at Mulliners was painted in body colour. Even the stay rod retaining rubber with its split pin was...

Especially the brass tag with EB... was painted in body colour while the commision brass tag WAS NOT (this was fitted at the Coventry Standart factory).

Thanks for that information 

Peter W

[Nobbysr]

Interesting approach  Peter

Replacement items would have all have to  be painted if warranty work had to be carried out ..I do know that many  item were Zinc Passivated   which doesn't make sense if they were painted . as the passivation process improves the corrosion resistance and wasn't a good base for paint.. it also looked better  than plain zinc . I was lucky enough to do my toolmaking  apprenticeship with an automotive component  company which had Cadmium and Zinc Plating baths  but sadly discontinued Chrome and Silver 4 years before i joined. 

Did the dealerships have to repaint  wing bolts, Apron bolts etc when they carried out warranty work  or just leave them chipped ???... it would have been a nightmare  .. In the 80's i worked for Unipart which i think was when we first  met at C& B .. I visited many dealerships, amd most still had their works Triumph Churchill tool sets, many items never having been used . and most sold for Scrap in the late 80s and early 90's

I think  will I go unpainted bolts and fittings as it make repair/.maintenance a bit more practical 

cheers

Steve

[Ian Vincent]

Painting over zinc passivated surfaces shouldn’t be a problem, the zinc helps prolong the life of the paint coating. It’s painting on pure zinc (I.e. galvanising) that can be a problem.

Rgds Ian

[Black Forest TR3A]

Bill Piggott describes the Mulliners Paint Procedure (Piggott, TR for Triumph, 39).

There he mentions:

Front and rear wings are spaced out from the body prior to entry into paint shop to allow coverage on wings flanges and body surfaces.

So these bolts might have been blank. But this description is 1955...

So for the wing bolts: difficult to say. For the rest: painted in body colour...

BTW: Bolts for wings, apron etc. are allways LINREAD or CRANES, zinc plated (silver) on my car. But RHD/LHD blanking plate bolts were RUBERY OWEN.

[Nobbysr]

On 7/28/2022 at 7:09 AM, Ian Vincent said:

Painting over zinc passivated surfaces shouldn’t be a problem, the zinc helps prolong the life of the paint coating. It’s painting on pure zinc (I.e. galvanising) that can be a problem.

Rgds Ian

hi Ian   The passivator commonly used with Zinc fittings  helps resist corrosion as well as look nice, many  paints rely on etch properties  which are resisted by the passivator .. any fixings and clips we sold (my old company)to the car industry,  that were to be  painted, were never passivated as the finish wouldn't be seen . that's not to say you cant paint it, just an either or scenario... hopefully this makes sense

ll the best Steve