Look them in the eyes

[Peter Cobbold]

I have no problems with doctors opting to work entirely in the private sector, providing they repay the cost of their training the public had paid for, plus the cost of training a replacement. They do not. Private health insurance likewise parasitises the NHS, employing staff  trained at significant cost to the public purse. Most doctors I know are committed believers in the NHS and regard private colleagues with some disdain. The tricky area is indeed "moonlighting" (the 7/11ths contract)  and that is going to be brought into sharp focus as the NHS addresses the back-log mountain and waiting lists.

[SuzanneH]

7 hours ago, barkerwilliams said:

Isn't there something strange about a system that allows a surgeon to manage his patients lists and waiting times yet offer quick service for private work?

It is obvious that if there was no waiting list then there would be no private work, therefore the waiting list would have to be invented.

I'm not saying anyone is corrupt, just that the system is flawed and offers opportunities for the undesirable business practices 

Alan

It is the Theatre time that causes the waiting list not just the surgeon. 
at Mount Vernon where my op will take place they do ophthalmic ops on Thursdays and Orthopedics on Tuesdays.

I had two ophthalmic ops during lockdown in Jul and Nov 2020.

My Consultant Surgeon for my hip is also the orthopaedic Trauma Consultant Surgeon. There are other hip Surgeons but I chose to stay with Mr Somashekar.

I know that opthalmic ops are taking place at the moment but not orthopaedic operations.

Edited March 16, 2021 by SuzanneH

[Motorsport Mickey]

31 minutes ago, SuzanneH said:

It is the Theatre time that causes the waiting list not just the surgeon. 
at Mount Vernon where my op will take place they do ophthalmic ops on Thursdays and Orthopedics on Tuesdays.

I had two ophthalmic ops during lockdown in May and Nov 2020.

My Consultant Surgeon for my hip is also the orthopaedic Trauma Consultant Surgeon. There are other hip Surgeons but I chose to stay with Mr Somashekar.

I know that opthalmic ops are taking place at the moment but not orthopaedic operations.

That's what Gerry Robinson found 6 years ago Suzanne, Operating theatres left empty because consultants want a long weekend ? 

(4) Can Gerry Robinson Fix the NHS? - YouTube

I guess it's tough to change.

Mick Richards

[SuzanneH]

5 hours ago, Motorsport Mickey said:

That's what Gerry Robinson found 6 years ago Suzanne, Operating theatres left empty because consultants want a long weekend ? 

(4) Can Gerry Robinson Fix the NHS? - YouTube

I guess it's tough to change.

Mick Richards

Thanks for that Mick, tough to watch too when in total I have been waiting 3 years for this op and been given the runaround by our useless GPs (my son calls them secretary’s, the go between between the patient and the hospital).

I just hope that my Orthopaedic Surgeon is like the last one shown in the programme.

I will add that Covi 19 had made everything far more difficult for all the hospital staff, surgeons etc.

I was conscious for my two Ophthalmic ops and the camaraderie amongst ALL the people working in the theatre was  fantastic to listen to. Both operations were used for teaching students, one of whom in the first op was actually doing the operation .

All of the people who interacted with me before and during my operations were all shut in the theatre with me until the operation was over, that’s porters, nurses, students, surgeon student and consultant and Doris who introduced herself as the lady who rang me at home re Covid Test, and when and where to turn up. Doris also took over for part of the operation ( unblocking my tear duct) and the student surgeon was teaching her.

Edited March 16, 2021 by SuzanneH

[Misfit]

It’s funny I wasn’t aware at the time of my previous post, My GP wants me to have a procedure and has Subsequently organised it. 

While this was not discussed,   but it seems that private treatment is not a one way thing.

Returning home today, I’ve been given a date at a new Private hospital as a NHS Patient.  So they/I will be benefit using privately purchased equipment for NHS a procedure.
 

 

[stillp]

Back when my employer paid for BUPA membership, I had some diagnostic imaging done on my wrist at a private hospital. A couple of years later, I started having pain in the wrist again, and my GP wrote a referral letter. Among the choices the NHS offered me was the same private consultant at the same BUPA hospital. He could still access the imaging data, although that would not have been available to an NHS consultant. A few more yours passed, and my wife was having trouble with her thumb - the same consultant and hospital were among the choices offered by the NHS. She had surgery there and was treated like the private patients - private room, cup of tea, etc.

Pete

 

[PodOne]

Patients in general are not bothered by who/where they are treated as long as their pain is address asap which is understandable but they fail to see the true costs. The only problem is the private sector are generally only interested in routine work on fit and well individuals without the possibility of complications as they have no facility for critical or IC if required and would loose money. If it happens the patient is promptly transferred back to the NHS to pick up the pieces and bear the cost. Private NHS treatment is more expensive and takes resource away from the NHS, it denies training opportunities to juniors to undertake routine work where they learn their trade through repetition and have the full resources around should the worse happen. 

The fundamental problem is the NHS fails to efficiently use its estate capacity with a 9-5 mentality to undertake elective care such as orthopaedic procedures which its useful if you can then do a knee replacement before tea or fulfil your contracted hours in 4 days or less and have a day in the private sector. The consultant contract is at the root of the issue and human nature as it is makes the rewards for some too much of a temptation.

Waiting lists will always be a feature to a degree hence the 18 week pathways imposed by government which more or less guaranteed the private sector work as the NHS mangers see the private sector as an easier option than sorting hospital services out which would reduce there need and save between 40% of orthopaedic budgets which could be reinvested back into the hospital.There needs to be a change in mind set of how services are provided across the full week and across extended hours eg 6-2, 2-10 as a patient they won't be many who would be against this. Will it happen probably not as the NHS hasn't the balls to impose it and the consultants would resist despite the waiting list pressures. 

I'm not against the private sector but it should be just that-private for insurance and fee paying patients as there is always patients who think they are getting something special like their own room, carpet on the floor, rubber plant, a choice of sandwiches and surgeon which is the only real difference until it goes tits up!

Andy

[stillp]

In the early 90s my local NHS hospital had a private wing, which paid rent to the NHS trust (or whatever they were called then) and had chargeable use of the high-capital-cost resources. Nursing staff were rotated so they spent IIRC two weeks every six months in the private wing. I asked a nurse how she felt about that, and she told me it was wonderful, she had the opportunity to spend two weeks having enough time to really care for her patients. Apparently the hospital made a significant profit from the private wing, but that was shut down soon after the 1997 election.

Pete

ps While I'm on, does anyone know how to remove cured PU expanding foam from skin? I've just been asked by a friend who is a hospital doctor!

 

[Peter Cobbold]

acetone, scraping

I wore disposable gloves the next time

[stillp]

Thanks Peter. Acetone was my first suggestion, but it's not working, perhaps because the foam has completely cured. Apparently the patient threw a can onto a bonfire and it exploded!

Pete