TriumphV8 Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Hi Marco, the pressure forces dropped a little bit referring to the old but nice working clutch but not that much we expected. For a TR6 clutch it is easy to press but not more. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted June 11, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 (edited) You can see on my calculation sheet our piston's surface is 750 mm^2 large, what size is yours? With the original 0.75" master I do also not expect a surprise. My idea was always to use a 0.625", what I already do. I'm now already very pleased with that! Perhaps the story we all have been told is only the "Kings new clothes". Friend of mine is psychologist, he always calls this "kognitive dissonanz reduktion" Edited June 11, 2019 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TriumphV8 Posted June 11, 2019 Report Share Posted June 11, 2019 Never calculated, HOWE recommended a 0.75" so we kept what we had. The fun started after fitment. As you found out we will also fit the 0.625" master because we have more travel than needed. I think than all possible has been done in this area. We will also have to examine the pressure plates. The MF215 Sachs for Volvo can be obtained in two versions for different engines, one smaller, one bigger. Maybe a stock carb TR6 will work properly with the softer pressure plate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted June 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2019 Hi, I made a tool last week to determine the force I have to step on the clutch pedal. Today out on the raod with friend A and B we found this: 23 kg, my TR4A, Borg+Beck cluch, 0.625" master instead of 0,75", slave original 1" 21 kg, friend B's TR6, Sachs 3082 100 041 (Saab/Vauhall), 0.70" master instead of 0.75", slave original 1" 19 kg; friend A's TR6, Sachs 3082 100 041 (Saab/Vauhall), 0.75" master, "our" Sachs hydraulic release bearing. Friend A ordered a 0.70" master..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 1, 2019 Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 Hi Marco, a nice straight comparison. From your measurements it appears the new hydraulic clutch requires 2kg or 10 % less force, with a larger MC. And you can expect another 10-15% reduction with the 0.7 bore MC. That would result in a final 20-25%. Have you also measured a modern car for comparison? Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 (edited) Indeed a good idea that was not in my mind, but my BMW I3 has no gear box and my wife's car is an automatic. Have to ask neigbors..... Edited July 1, 2019 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 12.5 - 13.0 kg on a 2014 VW Polo TSI, petrol engine with about 100 hp Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JochemsTR Posted July 1, 2019 Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 Since the Sachs 041 clutch plate is used on a Saab 99 it would be very interesting to know the required pressure on that car. That would be an actual comparison. Jochem Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 Hi Jochem, is a Saab 99 the same as a Saab 900? I know someone with this such a car. Ciao, Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JochemsTR Posted July 1, 2019 Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 20 minutes ago, Z320 said: Hi Jochem, is a Saab 99 the same as a Saab 900? I know someone with this such a car. Saab 900 —> from 78 to 1990 Jochem Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 1, 2019 Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 I had a 99 Turbo when I was 24. No heavy clutch then:) Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2019 (edited) The VW Polo clutch is a ladies thing, like a toy, you will not like it. Pressing the pedal the first time I expected it is only 5 kg , indeed it is 12.5 - 13 kg. For me anything from 15 - 20 kg would be OK. Edited July 1, 2019 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2019 16 kg on my colleague's "new" FIAT Cinquecento, no problem at all for her Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 (edited) Hi, got this video from friend A, sorry for no sound, it is made with an inspection camera. His TR6 run about 1,000 km with the new hydraulic release clutch without problems. I'm so glad the release bearing is not wobbling (what I did not expect but could be the case). Ciao, Marco Edited July 3, 2019 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hi Marco, a nice video clip. It looks as though it functions beautifully. Are you happy that the bearing is rotating continually.? Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 3, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hi Roger, that's what it's made for, this can't be wrong. When I was allowed to drive the car last Saturday everything worked fine. Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 Hi Marco, Indeed bearings are built to rotate. God quality will spin forever. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 (edited) It should not spin until pedal applied .You need to be bang on when setting one up and know how to do it,there after very good but expensive. Edited July 3, 2019 by ntc Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JochemsTR Posted July 4, 2019 Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 7 hours ago, ntc said: It should not spin until pedal applied .You need to be bang on when setting one up and know how to do it,there after very good but expensive. These units are designed to spin! There is an internal spring pressing the bearing against the pressure plate. Jochem Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 4, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 4, 2019 This is the common design of clutch release bearings - already for decades. It seems to be better to have it always running instead of accelerate it every time you change the gear. The load of the internal spring is 10 - 12 kg (did I already post that?) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 8, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2019 Hi, the 0.70" master is in friends A's TR6, I expected the force to press the clutch pedal drops from 19 kg to about 16.0 - 16.5 kg. Yesterday he reported: "Made a first test drive, first impression: sensational!!! Pedal feels like falling down to the floor panel by itself, anyway the clutch works proper and is lovely to handle. WAF (woman acceptance factor) is definitely 100% (3 woman smileys), car drives like a VW Polo 1.0 l. For me it's so easy working that I have to get used to it". I think its 16 kg indeed the difference is sensational, we will determine the force when we meet next time. Ciao, Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2019 Work goes on slowly, but goes on... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Very nice Marco, I can see a couple of happy TR-ers. Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 (edited) Hi, I met the son of a friend of mine last weekend, his is 19 years old and is learing to be a car mechanic and car restorer for vintage and classic cars, most BMW 328. He told me he recently had to work on the clutch of a pre war Bugatti, which is very "special". Indeed, see here. Enjoy it Marco Edited July 23, 2019 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 23, 2019 Report Share Posted July 23, 2019 Hi Marco, I wish had a clutch pedal force like that. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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