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AtLast

Hardtop bracket size and thread size

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Hi again

The Moss catalogue show three parts for the rear brackets that fit the hardtop to the support bridges. Moss part numbers are 650193, 650194 and 650195 although the original manual only mentions two sizes with the side ones being longer. My top only has three brackets currently, all the same size one at the back and one each side although clearly there should be two others at the rear as the slots are there in the hardtop stiffener rail. As they are no longer available to purchase I'm going to make the two missing ones. Does anyone have dimensions?

Also could anyone help with the thread diameter for the flat top screw that secures them to the hardtop. I've purchased screws from Moss (SE604031) and they appear to be 1/4 UNC but at present I can get the old screws out to check. 

Thanks

P.S. If anyone has any brackets to sell that would be even better!

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The threads for the round slotted pan head screws are 1/4-28 (fine thread) just like the other zillion bolts on the TR3. They are 1/4 inch long and were installed with a star washer. I just bought a bunch of stainless screws for mine. You are correct that there are two sizes with the longer ones at the side. They look easy enough to make if you are missing a couple.

 

Stan

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Hi Stan erm yeah that's what I thought but  I've just got an original screw out and the new Moss screws only seem to turn twice in the original bracket before coming very tight... they have the same issue testing in a 1/4 UNF (fine thread) die. I think the screws maybe the courser UNC thread.... I'll try to fine out from Moss.

Do you have any dimensions for the longer brackets?

Thanks

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Some parts available on eBay at the moment from the same seller

 

if that’s of any use 

I know I should be buying them as I would love a hardtop .....

 

Triumph TR2-3a  Hard Top , Bridge piece and plate. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F223221575514

 

Triumph  TR2-3a,  Hard Top,  Tonneau Capping Plates x 2 Chrome. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F223221612686

 

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5 hours ago, AtLast said:

Hi Stan erm yeah that's what I thought but  I've just got an original screw out and the new Moss screws only seem to turn twice in the original bracket before coming very tight... they have the same issue testing in a 1/4 UNF (fine thread) die. I think the screws maybe the courser UNC thread.... I'll try to fine out from Moss.

Do you have any dimensions for the longer brackets?

Thanks

Archie, here's the approx dimensions. Hard to measure accurately as there is not a square corner but this is the general size.

 

ht-long-bracket.jpg

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Hi Archie,

ref  Moss (SE604031).  This would be a 1/4 UNF.   

 

UNC screws start with a 5  - eg   SE504031

 

Roger

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That's great Stan thank you for taking the time.

Cheers for the info Roger

Thanks Hamish yep I've got all those bits just these two missing brackets to make up.

 

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One other detail, the brackets are not 90 degrees. I initially thought one was bent but they are very beefy so unlikely to bend on their own and they are all greater than 90 degrees. The smaller ones around 95 degrees and the two larger ones are around 100 degrees.

Stan

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You must be watching over me... I've just bent my first to match up. Those dimensions you sent seem to match the three existing brackets I've got (which I assumed were the shorter ones) so I've left the new ones a tad longer on the part that slides into the hardtop and will see how it all lines up. Is there a noticeable difference with your three short and two longer brackets? I may end up shortening them all to match.

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My buddy and I are both doing our hardtops at the same time and the brackets are the same on both. Two larger brackets on the sides, three smaller brackets along the rear. The smaller brackets are smaller in both the height and the length but they are the same width and the holes are the same size.

 

long and short.jpg

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BTW I have not messed with the 1/4 inch threaded holes so they are as they came from the factory. My brackets had very elongated/enlarged mounting holes so on all but one bracket I welded up the holes and re-drilled them. When we trial fit in a few weeks I will see how things line up and I may be modifying them again.

Stan

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Cheers Stan that's really helpful mate. Yep looks like my "original" has three long brackets then so i suspect at sometime in the past the wrong part has been used. I'll shorten the new two to match your dimensions to start and take it from there - but looks like I'll have to trim three shorter again. Thanks again. Archie

Edited by AtLast

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FWIW When you come to fit the hardtop get all the bolts in loose first and then be careful with tightening the front outers on the screen as I have known them crack the top of the glass.

Stuart.

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Speaking of thread size.. I do not have any of the original screws that attach the cantrails or the front seal. As best as I can tell from other people projects the cantrails were attached with small slotted pan head screws and the front seal is attached with small slotted countersunk screws with a cup washer. Anyone know what size  screws these were and how long ?.

Stan

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Cantrails i believe are  pan headhead  slotted size 6.

Front I seal I used size 4 and corresponding cup washers.

Iain

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3 hours ago, iain said:

Cantrails i believe are  pan headhead  slotted size 6.

Front I seal I used size 4 and corresponding cup washers.

Iain

Thanks Iain. Do you think these are just wood screws ?.

 

Stan

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Anyone got a photo of how the brackets fit to the top of the windscreen?

All looks a bit delicate!

Tony

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9 hours ago, foster461 said:

Thanks Iain. Do you think these are just wood screws ?.

 

Stan

Stan I will try and obtain some specific pictures and dimensions from a HT I sold some months ago, that had never been apart. I don't believe they are wood screws, more like chrome self tappers for the seal and bright zinc panhead self tappers for the cant trails, thinking about this they may be size 4 as well

Will revert asap

 

Iain

Edited by iain

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3 hours ago, Tonyloz said:

Anyone got a photo of how the brackets fit to the top of the windscreen?

All looks a bit delicate!

Tony

I dont have a photo but this diagram suggests they just attach to the top edge of the windshield.

 

TR3 hardtop front bracket.JPG

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5 hours ago, Tonyloz said:

Anyone got a photo of how the brackets fit to the top of the windscreen?

All looks a bit delicate!

Tony

Hi here is a pic of mine... I've just offered up so far and about to drill the holes. Also the bit from the workshop manual. I had to resize the images a bit for the upload so let me know if you need larger originals. The arrow marks the lip of the windscreen which is clamped by the bracket and hardtop.

 

HT004.JPG

HT01.png

HT003..JPG

Edited by AtLast

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Stan the cantrail screws are Pan head self tappers. 1/4 head diameter. 1/2 screw length and 1/8 thread diameter.  I guess that means they are in old money a size 6

These are closest I can find at the moment https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/BZP_TappingScrew_SlotPan_No.4.html

https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/Datasheets/TappingScrew_SlotPan.pdf

 

Iain

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4 hours ago, iain said:

Stan the cantrail screws are Pan head self tappers. 1/4 head diameter. 1/2 screw length and 1/8 thread diameter.  I guess that means they are in old money a size 6

These are closest I can find at the moment https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/BZP_TappingScrew_SlotPan_No.4.html

https://www.westfieldfasteners.co.uk/Datasheets/TappingScrew_SlotPan.pdf

 

Iain

Thanks Iain, we have good fastener suppliers here and can usually get stuff in stainless so I'll go shopping for screws and finish washers.

Stan

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