Kutscher Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 (edited) Hi, Now that my TR2 is almost ready with most off its original parts, there is only the Tool Kit i don't have. In the next month i will see or it is possible to get it complete. But there are some questions about to get the right tools in it. Has someone a original picture of a correct tool kit for the early TR2? At first the tool roll from jute with plastic coating, is it still somewhere to buy? Beginning with the adjustable spanner, in the book collectors originality Guide from Bill Piggott it says 7 inch brand TW part number 113228. In the TR2 part book first edition is says part number 109321? In the book triumph in detail page 62 you see a different type? Can tell me someone what is the correct one? Screwdriver in the book collectors originality Guide from Bill Pigott page 83 it says 7 inch long wooden (beech) one from different manufactures, the early TR2 one had a different appearance. I see two different types one on page 83 collectors original Guide from Bill Pigott, and one triumph in detail page 62. The one in the originality Guide is a shelley screwdriver. What is the correct one in a Early TR2? The book collectors originality Guide from Bill Pigott page 83 it says: The Enots greasing gun for the TR2 the Enots No 1, on later types Enots No 1D. I can only find Enots 1D, 1S and H etc. but not No 1. Is this type different than the 1D? Has someone maybe a picture of this grease gun? In different books you can see Tool Kits have more than the original tools, so these were not included original! i think In the TR2 part book first edition is says: 109316 Spanner open end 3/8 - 7/16 109317 Spanner open end 3/4 - 5/8 109318 Spanner open end 1/2 - 9/16 109319 Spanner tube 1/2 109320 Spanner sparking plug 109321Spanner adjustable 109322 Grips, slip joint 1398 Tommy Bar 108674 Screwdriver 59429 Grease Gun 60126 Gauge feeler Are the other tools options? Regards Robin Edited November 10, 2015 by Kutscher Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 John Warfield, former president of the Triumph Register of America, has studied, collected, and sold restored tool sets for early TRs for many years. He's member jdwtrxk on this forum and regularly has an ad for his TR2 through TR4 tool sets in the TRA newsletter. Send me a pm if you'd like his telephone number / email if purchasing a complete or partial tool set from the US is an option for you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geko Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 This one based in NZ, including pic of the grease gun Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EdwinTiben Posted November 10, 2015 Report Share Posted November 10, 2015 (edited) Hi Robin, I think they used more than 1 type of each tool, mostly what was available on the shelfs at that time.. In my search for an original early jack, i have found 4 different types which were used, i have 2 of them. the jute roll: http://www.moss-europe.co.uk/catalogsearch/result/?search_group=&q=tool+roll Heres more detailing of my toolroll. I can take detailed pictures if you like Here a picture of the 2 jacks i have Edited November 10, 2015 by EdwinTiben Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kutscher Posted November 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2015 (edited) Hi, Thanks Don, Stef and Edwin for the information about the Tool kits, i just contacted John for further information. This helps me further to put together a toolkit. Edited November 13, 2015 by Kutscher Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jdwtrxk Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi. Finally got on. The jack on the right in Robin's post is what is seen in TR2 toolkits. I haven't seen one of the larger ones like the one on the left. Don't mean it ain't so.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
2long Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 There is a unique bracket on the TR2 frames to accommodate the specially-shaped hook on the jack pictured on the right. Not sure the other fat hook would even fit the bracket. There is also limited room in the TR2 cockpit, which is why the shorter handle on the jack pictured on the right seems correct. But like Edwin says, maybe ST used other types on hand? Dan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EdwinTiben Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Hi. Finally got on. The jack on the right in Robin's post is what is seen in TR2 toolkits. I haven't seen one of the larger ones like the one on the left. Don't mean it ain't so.... The left one in the picture is identical to the same one as delivered by factory with the car of Colin Briscoe. If you look at the foot of the short jack in my picture and compare this with the one listed in the factory owners manual, you will see that the foot of one accepted as original differs from this drawing. Although the foot on the large jack is identical to this drawing: The jack from the TR2 of a friend looks almost identical to my short one and the one in the drawing above, but differs in details of the hook.. so that makes 4 versions Edited November 14, 2015 by EdwinTiben Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kutscher Posted November 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) In my discovery about the early car jacks i found the following. The larger jack in this post looks like an universal aftersales jack for the so called bumper application. But it is quite possible that they used it on the some later TR2 not as bumper application but on the unigue bracket on the TR2. My TR2 has comm. number TS1953 and so far as i can see the original frame (ID number 20Z). The unique bracket on the TR2, so far as i can see in the service manual first edition is T-shape, but on my frame TS1953 it is not? It is not T-shape but square, and it looks like it is not reshaped. I tested some time ago the larger jack from a friend and it fits in the bracket on my TR2. The lager jack will not fit in the early T-shaped bracket, but the early jack will fit in the later bracket. Edited November 14, 2015 by Kutscher Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EdwinTiben Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 robin, perhaps some time in its life the chassis has been replaced by a later style ? the car from colin briscoe is in the 900 series, so very early Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 40 years ago there was still a handful of one or two owner sidescreen cars around, and a few Standards too, some still boasting their original toolkits . . . . . and I do recall noting some considerable diversity of content amongst those toolkits. No doubt a result of Standard Triumph purchasing whatever was appropriate and available at the right price at the right time. If there were two alternative sources of jacks, it might well be that chassis were manufactured with fitment for one or other jack . . . . . but not for both. I would be most cautious of suggesting that one supposedly original item is authentic, and another supposedly original item is not . . . . . toolkits were comprised of proprietary mass production tools, as was the case with most vehicle manufacturers, and at most some tools might have been personalised with a stamped brand name, or even a sticker. Few vehicle manufacturers commissioned bespoke tools for the vehicle toolkit, as opposed to special tools for workshop useage. Cheers, Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EdwinTiben Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi Alec, Exactly my thoughts after seeing the differences in the tools. Good point about the changes to the chassis to fit the batch of jacks used at that time, seems logical! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jdwtrxk Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) The early TR2 toolkits are particularly tricky as the is very little information available regarding their content. Most of what we have comes from drawings and photographs offered by S-T that are not always consistent. Some of these drawings (the photograph that is often used in reference books and period TSOA booklets comes to mind) was likely a compilation of tools assembled for marketing purposes and does not necessarily dictate that those tools were precisely what a given toolkit would contain. The general list would remain pretty standard, but pattern could vary. Some of the tools in the photograph may be from contemporary S-T toolkits. SSP (Sheffield Steel Products) provided a lot of tools in the postwar era. Later, T. Williams provided a greater percentage. The axiom that they 'used whatever they had' has been overstated for years, most often by vendors wanting to sell what they had on hand - but it's not entirely inaccurate, particularly with these early kits. Later TR3 and TR3A/4 kits were pretty well locked down. In the 150-175 kits I've been able to deal with over the last twenty five years, variation has been minimal on these, mostly in details of the grease guns and tool rolls. TR2 is a different story entirely. There simply aren't enough 'documented' TR2 toolkits out there from which creditable conclusions can be drawn. There were some variants of the early jacks. I have seen two versions of 'feet' on the shorter ones. One has a 'cupped' foot like the one in the TR2 handbook and the other a flatter foot more like those on later Smiths' and B.T.C jacks. They are otherwise identical. Thus it seems reasonable that there were even greater variations in early jacks. There were issues with the TR2 jacks; one that I had was bent thirty degrees (likely from the car shifting when it was being used although the hook was undamaged). If the larger version is indeed 'legit' than it could have been an answer to this problem. The curious part is trying to determine if there was a cutoff between these two major variants, particularly if there isn't direct compatibility of the brackets. From what people are posting here it almost seems random. JW Edited November 14, 2015 by jdwtrxk Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted November 14, 2015 Report Share Posted November 14, 2015 UK car manufacturing in the 1950s, '60s and '70s was plagued by industrial relations problems. Toolkits and other accessories more often than not were proprietary items, sometimes personalised to a degree. Therefore it made sense to have more than one supplier of 'whatever' across the car model range, for example one manufacturer of jacks for TRs, another manufacturer of a similar product for Vanguards. At least then if one supplier ran into problems, there was a potential backup source. The UK was not short of component manufacturers, after all. I would have thought that the North American TR market represented the most important sector for quality control . . . . and the home market for saloons, for example, a considerably lower priority. Therefore it would seem reasonable to expect a greater degree of consistency in USA car toolkits than in UK delivered cars. Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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