Which oil?

[tr6fan]

I intend to do a first service on my TR6 (since I bought it, not since 1973 - I hope ) Any recommendations on best grade of oil - is 20w30 OK?

TIA

Phil

[88V8]

Any recommendations on best grade of oil - is 20w30 OK?

 

Not sure there is a 20/30, but I wouldn't use it.

 

20/50 you need for these older engines, I always use Duckhams.

Even though the last can wasn't green.

 

Ivor

Edited August 5, 2008 by 88V8

[foster461]

I intend to do a first service on my TR6 (since I bought it, not since 1973 - I hope ) Any recommendations on best grade of oil - is 20w30 OK?

TIA

Phil

 

20-50 and read up on the whole zddp thing and hopefully someone can suggest a UK brand that still has sufficient quantities or a suitable additive as it is getting harder to find oil off the shelf that is suitable for these older engines.

 

Stan

[harrytr5]

I use 20/50 Valvoline racing oil as reccomended by my engine guru.About £22.00 for 5 litres.

Regards Harry TR5 Nutter.

P.S.It is mineral oil.

[ianv]

Have a look at Penrite HPR 30 - in my TR6 it produces a better hot oil pressure than other (20/50) oils that I have tried.

Cheers,

IanV

[tr6fan]

Thanks folks - I meant 20/50 as opposed to the 20/30 I seem to have invented!

[foster461]

I use 20/50 Valvoline racing oil as reccomended by my engine guru.About £22.00 for 5 litres.

Regards Harry TR5 Nutter.

P.S.It is mineral oil.

 

Cool. Thats what I use also, Valvoline 20-50 VR1 racing oil, just under $4 a quart here and the engine plus filter takes 6 US quarts.

 

Stan

[harrytr5]

Stan,

And I live close to Dunstable,England!!.

Regards Harry TR5 Nutter.

[67_gt6]

If you don't mind spending the dosh, I would go for Millers Classic Sport 20w50. It is a semi synthetic, and I would say I get an extra 10lbs hot oil pressure out of it at idle, which I assume is down to the synthetic part.

 

andy

[Stoker]

Hi Phil

 

Just to add my twopennorth I use Castrol Classic 20/50 which is available on line from promapac.co.uk

and is delivered direct from Castrol at reasonable cost and with no carriage charges

 

Regards

 

John

[Nibs]

keep to the recommendations use 20 - 50 oil i wouldn't use 20 - 30 oil

 

 

cheers

Nibs

[tr6fan]

keep to the recommendations use 20 - 50 oil i wouldn't use 20 - 30 oil

 

 

cheers

Nibs

Thanks all, I've used 20/50 and put on a spin-on oil filter too. I'm not sure 20/30 oil exists, Nibs!

Phil

[88V8]

I'm not sure 20/30 oil exists, Nibs!

 

You've spotted a gap in the market.

[Ragtag]

Even though the last can wasn't green.

 

I thought Duckhams cans were yellow and blue and white

 

Seriously though, does any one know anything bad about Halfrauds Classic 20/50. Its easily available, about £13 a gallon, comes in a retro style tin and the oil is......green!

[Ragtag]

Cool. Thats what I use also, Valvoline 20-50 VR1 racing oil, just under $4 a quart here and the engine plus filter takes 6 US quarts.

 

Bl**dy hell Stan that seems cheap. We must be being stiffed for tax on oil as well as petrol.

[RogerH]

Hi Chris,

I believe it is made by Comma. It appears to work OK - the money saved can go towards the next engine rebuild.

 

Roger

[tr6fan]

The oil change and spin-on filter conversion went fine. I decided to fit a new air filter, but I can't believe how tricky it seems to be. I removed the steady bars and took off the radiator shroud. Then I removed the nuts holding the filter to the radiator. It seems there is another nut and bolt still to be undone underneath the filter housing, but it is really inaccessible. Am I doing this right? Surely I shouldn't need to dismantle the front end of the car just to change the air filter!? There are also two openings at the bottom of the air filter housing with no pipes attached - should there be?

Any advice appreciated.

 

I'm going for a nice lie down...

[RobIsaacson]

Once you've had it apart enough times it becomes second nature!

 

 

I read a previous post on the 2 pipes from the filter housing; should feed across the car in front of the rad but mine hasn't got them either and it seems to work ok.

 

Rob

[Peter Vernon]

I thought Duckhams cans were yellow and blue and white

 

Seriously though, does any one know anything bad about Halfrauds Classic 20/50. Its easily available, about £13 a gallon, comes in a retro style tin and the oil is......green!

 

 

My late father was a metallurgist converting halfway in his career to specialising in oils. He laughed at my effort with oils saying that the most important thing was clean oil.

 

The best oil of all is reclaimed oil if you can get it at the grade. The simple fact is oil is a mineral not a fluid. With reclaimed oil the platelets that make up the oil have been subjected to heat and pressure that "round off" the platelets making hem less angular causing less wear. Until fully synthetic oil was used, reclaimed oil was used by a number of racing teams.

 

I have used the Halfords 20/50 for about 8 or so years, no pressure or other problems. I just replace it every year (mileage less than 3,000 pa) to keep it clean.

[Guest ntc]

Another view copied from some fellow gt40 friends worth a read

Neil

 

Re: full synthetic or non synthetic

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Too much rumour, speculation and old wives tales I'm afraid.

 

It's not the type of oil, Synthetic, semi, mineral etc that causes leaks - It's the cold crank viscosity!

 

A 15w-50 synthetic is the same thickness as a 15w-50 mineral oil, they have to be to meet API viscosity parameters.

 

Don't get hung up with synthetics being too thin, they are as thick or thin as you want them to be.

 

I wouldn't recommend using a 0w or 5w oil in these old big block engines but there are great advantages to using a 10w-50 or 15w-50 fully synthetic over a petroleum based oil, they are put simply much better lubricants. Why?

 

Well, rather than coming from the ground and refined to remove the impurities of which not all can be removed, synthetic oils (pao/ester group IV/V ones at least) are not petroleum derived, they are designed and built in laboratories by chemists and because of this tailor made aspect the molecules are uniform.

 

The advantages this gives are as follows:

 

Stable Basestocks

 

Because of their uniform molecular structure, synthetic lubricants operate with less internal and external friction than petroleum oils which have the non-uniform molecular structure. The result is better heat control, and less heat means less stress to the lubricant.

 

Higher Percentage of Basestock

 

Synthetic oils contain a higher percentage of lubricant basestock than petroleum oils do.

This is because multi-viscosity oils need a great deal of pour point depressant and viscosity modifying additives in order to be sold as multi-viscosity oils.

Synthetic oils, require very little in the way of pour point depressants and viscosity

modifiers. Therefore, synthetic oils contain a higher percentage of basestock, which actually does most of the lubricating anyway. More basestock leads to longer motor oil life.

 

Additives Used Up More Slowly

 

Petroleum basestocks are much more prone to oxidation than synthetic oils, oxidation inhibitors are needed in greater supply and are used up very quickly. Synthetic oils do oxidize, but at a much slower rate therefore, oxidation inhibiting additives are used up much more slowly. Synthetic oils provide for better ring seal than petroleum oils do. This minimizes blow-by and reduces contamination by combustion by-products. As a result, corrosion inhibiting additives have less work to do and will last much longer than within a petroleum oil.

 

Excellent Heat Tolerance

 

Synthetics are simply more tolerant to extreme heat than petroleum oils are. When heat builds up within an engine, petroleum oils quickly begin to burn off. They volatize. In other words, the lighter molecules within petroleum oils turn to gas and what's left are the large petroleum oil molecules that are harder to pump. Synthetics are resistant to this burn-off. They will tolerate much higher engine temperatures.

 

Heat Reduction

 

One of the major factors affecting engine life is component wear and/or failure, which is often the result of high temperature operation. The uniformly smooth molecular structure of synthetic oils gives them a much lower coefficient of friction (they slip more easily over one another causing less friction) than petroleum oils.

Less friction, of course, means less heat in the system. And, since heat is a major contributor to engine component wear and failure, synthetic oils significantly reduce these two detrimental effects.

 

Greater Film Strength

 

Petroleum motor oils have very low film strength in comparison to synthetics. The film strength of a lubricant refers to it's ability to maintain a film of lubricant between two objects when extreme pressure and heat are applied.

Synthetic oils will typically have a film strength of 500% or more higher than petroleum oils of comparable viscosity. In fact, even though heavier weight oils typically have higher film strength than lighter weight oils, a 0w30 or 5w-40 weight synthetic oil will likely have higher film strength than a 15w40 or 20w50 petroleum oil.

Thus, even with a lighter weight oil, you can still maintain proper lubricity and reduce the chance of metal to metal contact when using a synthetic oil. Of course, that means that you can use oils that provide far better fuel efficiency and cold weather protection without sacrificing engine protection under high temperature, high load conditions. The result is that you can greatly reduce both cold temperature start-up wear and high temperature/high load engine wear using the same low viscosity oil.

 

Engine Deposit Reduction

 

Petroleum oils tend to leave sludge, varnish and deposits behind after thermal and oxidative break down. They're better than they used to be, but it still occurs.

Deposit build-up leads to a significant reduction in engine performance and engine life as well as increasing the number of costly repairs that are necessary. Since synthetic oils have far superior thermal and oxidative stability than petroleum oils, they leave engines virtually varnish, deposit and sludge-free.

 

Better Cold Temperature Fluidity

 

Synthetic oils and other lubricants do not contain paraffins or other waxes which dramatically thicken petroleum oils during cold weather. As a result, they tend to flow much better during cold temperature starts and begin lubricating an engine almost immediately. This leads to significant engine wear reduction, and, therefore, longer engine life and fewer costly repairs.

 

Improved fuel mileage and performance

 

Synthetic oils, because of their uniform molecular structure, are tremendous friction reducers. Less friction leads to increased fuel economy and improved engine performance.

Any energy released from the combustion process that would normally be lost to friction can now be transferred directly to the wheels, providing movement.

Vehicle acceleration becomes swifter and more powerful while using less fuel in the process.

In a petroleum oil, lighter molecules tend to boil off easily, leaving behind much heavier molecules which are difficult to pump. Certainly, the engine loses more energy pumping these heavy molecules than if it were pumping lighter ones.

Since synthetic oils have more uniform molecules, fewer of these molecules tend to boil off.

More importantly, when they do, the molecules which are left are of the same size and pumpability is not affected.

[Guest Wayne S]

We use the halfords 20/50 in the TR4 / 4 cyl TR7 and the V8 TR8.

 

Although I am guilty of 3,000 mile oil changes in regular use Ive never experienced any pressure problems and all the engines seem to like it.

 

Have used Penrite in the past, not sure what the extra money buys you.

 

Wayne

[Guest ntc]

Cool. Thats what I use also, Valvoline 20-50 VR1 racing oil, just under $4 a quart here and the engine plus filter takes 6 US quarts.

 

Stan

 

Interesting update at the end

http://www.macysgarage.com/myweb6/ZDDP.htm

 

Neil

[88V8]

Interesting update at the end

http://www.macysgarage.com/myweb6/ZDDP.htm

 

Thankyou.

That's jolly interesting.

So interesting I even printed it off.

I hardly dare to look at label on the three gallons of Duckhams Q20/50 in my garage...

[foster461]

Thankyou.

That's jolly interesting.

So interesting I even printed it off.

I hardly dare to look at label on the three gallons of Duckhams Q20/50 in my garage...

 

I always throw in a bottle of this at each oil change just for insurance.

 

http://www.zddplus.com/

 

Sold by Moss and others, around $8.00 for a bottle, one bottle each time you change the oil which for me in once a year.

 

Stan

[88V8]

I always throw in a bottle of this at each oil change just for insurance.

 

Thankyou. Another interesting article. It says here, inter alia: 'A film of zinc and phosphorus compounds provides a sacrificial wear surface protecting the base metal of the cam and lifter from wear. In the course of normal service, this conversion of ZDDP to zinc and phosphorus compounds depletes the ZDDP level in the oil. Studies show that depending on the specific engine and severity of duty, after 2000-4000 miles of operation, the level of ZDDP can drop below that considered adequate to provide wear protection to the cam and lifters. '

Now that's especially interesting - in the wrong way - to me because three years ago with the intention of improving the oil environment of my V8, I installed one of these 1micron bypass filters:

http://www.kleenoil.co.uk/index_files/Page3613.htm

 

It was heavily promoted in motoring mags at the time, they've been in business 30 years+ so I fitted one. The company was very helpfiul wth fitting advice and sent me free of charge several adaptors before we hit on the necessary.

It is claimed that because of the ultrafine filtration, oil change intervals can be extended to 30,000 miles or more, and I have to say that since then I followed their recommendations and abandoned my previous practice of 3,000 mile changes and have just changed the Kleenoil cartridge. Latterly though I have been concerned that the oil looks and smells, well, dirty I suppose is the word.

 

The above observation about the attrition of ZDDP is the final nail in the coffin of 'extended oil life', although for my interest I shall forward the article to Kleenoil and see what they say.

 

This week, oil change and byebye bypass filter.

 

The old ways are the best....

 

Ivor