Running In

[tomfpurves]

I am running in a rebuilt engine(new pistons liners rings rods big ends)Back in the day it was traditional to do 1000 miles before using full revs etc.A pal seems to think with better oils etc 500 miles is enough.I would be interested in views on this.

[Alec Pringle]

Presumably you're using a traditional proper running-in oil (SAE 30) to enable everything to bed in gently, in which case it's appropriate to change (with new filter) to a decent 20W/50 at 500 miles, and then gradually increase rpm limit - preferably over another 1000 to 1500 rather than 500 miles, if you're aiming for longevity that is . . . . . I'd then change again at a couple of thousand, 20W/50 with new filter.

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[tomfpurves]

Dear Alec

Very helpful.Thank you.

Tom

[Guest ntc]

Tom

Opposite side of the coin these engines do not need running in hard hat on

[Alec Pringle]

Triumph engines are surprisingly tough old beasts, and they will tolerate abuse . . . . . despite the times I've been told that "they don't need running in" I still regard that as mechanical abuse.

 

Just because an engine will tolerate a lack of running-in period, that doesn't mean that the lack of running-in is a benefit - time and again I have seen the result of pushing a rebuilt engine too quickly and too soon. It may indeed go well in the short term, unfortunately there tends not to be a long term . . . . . and I'd prefer to have longevity for my money, which in a TR implies at least 60K and preferably 100K+ miles.

 

Long ago when I was responsible for helping run-in race engines, some competitors used to sneer at the effort that went into the exercise . . . . . but if you want a race engine to last 500 miles, 1000kms, 12 Hours or even 24 Hours at a stretch, then it's worth the effort. Those who mocked generally weren't around to see us at the chequered flag, they'd packed up and gone home some time previously.

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[Guest ntc]

Alec

April 1st got ya

[Alec Pringle]

Neil,

 

that finished at 12 noon . . . . . . . you're a bit behind the times again . . . . .

 

Open mouth . . . . . swap feet . . . . . shoot other foot . . . .

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[Guest ntc]

Alec

Who wrote the rules chap? daft and stupid I am not good night and sober

Edited April 1, 2015 by ntc

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

I thought it was not required due to the superb and accurate machining techniques available today compared to those of the past.

That said I remain old school.

 

Pete w

[Motorsport Mickey]

"not required due to the superb and accurate machining techniques available today"

 

Correct Peter.

 

These days cars and truck share many items of the same technology. If you've spent the best part of £120,000 on a new truck and trailer you damn well demand that the truck starts earning from day 1. There's no part loads or bedding in of the engines allowed.

The liners are probably plateau honed and the OHV 4 Valve engines run on fly by wire electrical injection systems using Variable Turbocharging technology only a few years ago the preserve of Group B Rally cars, with the fuel injection systems running on 1600 or 1800 bar unit injector pressures.

 

If a customer complained that their new truck wasn't getting the 11 + mpg promised whilst lugging 44 tonnes across the continent you asked how many miles were on the clock and if less than 60K you'd send him away and tell him to get some miles in because the engine was too damn tight. In fact when the dealerships put on new demo artic units we'd give them to some "pet" transport firms to put at least 60,000 mile on them before we dare let them go out into the demonstration fleet (about 3 months or thereabouts). Otherwise the expected and in some cases GUARANTEED* MPG returns over the operators existing fleet could not be met.

 

*As you may expect there were shed loads of terms and conditions regarding audited existing fuel returns on the operators existing fleet and what they returned and even down to the demos specified low resistance Michelin tyres to be used. The returns were obviously achievable though, with numerous demos and sales made we only had one firm complain regarding mpg and that was sorted when our highly trained demo driver was loaned to them for two weeks and not only met the figures promised but got another 0.4 miles per gallon better than their existing fleet. (that meant over £3000 saving PER TRUCK every year on fuel to that operator, and we had to give our driver a wage increase because the operator wanted to "head hunt" him to full time train his 120 fleet drivers up to his standard ! ).

 

HOWEVER...we are not talking about todays superb modern machining and especially todays very high quality materials used. We still are using and building engines that were previously built by men in brown coats who smelt of "Holberns old rubbed" (I hope that's a tobacco !)and clacked Fishermens friends against their teeth as they hummed "Workers Playtime" to themselves grunting as they pulled head bolts down to 105 lb ft using beam type torque wrenches with a swing needle !

 

As Alec recounts the engine needs the 1000 miles of steady running to take the tops off the relatively rough finishing of many of the internal components, not forgetting a head retorque at 500 miles to ensure all is tickety boo ! New oil and filter is a small price to pay and as the engine is used don't forget to use the BMEP* area of the engine to ensure full piston ring expansion and scraping of the cylinder walls to complete the bedding in process. Incidentally, if your driving style doesn't occasionally encompass using the engine at full load in it's highest gear with full throttle throughout it's life then you won't be getting the best from the beast.

 

*Brake Mean Effective Pressure.

This is the rev range of the engine where the piston develops it's most compression upon it's downward power stroke. This is normally in the maximum torque area and if you have a motorway near you their uphill gradients are useful for this. Top gear uphill 3-400 revs below maximum torque and give it maximum throttle...to the floor and hold it. When you exceed max torque by a couple of hundred revs come off the throttle and brake the car down to below the torque band and do it again, and again. When you get to the next motorway island come off and return from whence you came (opposite carriageway is less exciting) carrying out the same exercise on the gradient again. It's been known for me to devote 1 1/2 hours doing this (on a rolling road it's easier you can load the car on the rollers and after 15-20 mins the jobs done) and I still give the daily driver an occasional workout (Ford S Max) although towing a 1700kg Caravan seems to keep that on it's toes. Try and develop a driving style where it's part of your practise to do it, pays dividends, especially when you read some of the moaning on the blogs covering sports cars where they suffer from glazing of the bores.

 

Mick Richards

Edited April 2, 2015 by Motorsport Mickey

[tomfpurves]

That is really very helpful thanks Tom