another numpty question

[pfenlon]

Do all TR250 cars have a hole cut out of the front valance, mine does, not so may have been renewed after a fender bender but it looks original in the photos.

[carld]

Do all TR250 cars have a hole cut out of the front valance, mine does, not so may have been renewed after a fender bender but it looks original in the photos.

 

Hi my 5 has the cut out in the valance, its to allow air to get to the oil cooler rad. Not standard but relatively common.

 

Cheers

 

Carl

[stuart]

Peter I cant remember if they were originally fitted on 250s but as a rule of thumb if its an original type panel the hole will have a slight swage inwards around the aperture. Repro ones are cut straight. Same applies to back panel bumper iron holes.

Stuart

[Alec Pringle]

Hi Peter,

 

I think what you're looking at is a special modification for the North American market . . . .

 

You know how everything is smarter, bigger, faster over there . . . and has a gun . . .

 

Here in the UK we accept that hedgehogs and suchlike are going to get flattened under the wheels. OK, a badger is pretty solid and might just throw your car across the road as it shuffles off this mortal coil. A deer you want to avoid, it's a heavy old lump if it comes over the screen and lands in your lap at speed, at best it makes steering difficult . . .

 

However, the good chaps at Canley were presumably concerned that a Stromberg-equipped 250 might not have the turn of speed necessary to cope with an All-American Hedgehog (or whatever). Especially if it was packing a shooting iron. So as a fail-safe they installed the all-purpose front valance escape hatch, with swaged edges to minimise injury, thereby giving a high-speed hog the opportunity to show off its prowess by executing a last-ditch dive through the hatch. Survival of the fittest and all that. Very possibly our gun-toting miniature mammalian hero then picks himself up off the deck, suitably oil-stained, and ungratefully shoots the offending driver in the back . . . or at least shoots out the rear tyres and then the fuel tank for the blow-up ending.

 

Or possibly not, you never know. There might just be a more mundane explanation ?

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

[stuart]

Hi Peter,

 

I think what you're looking at is a special modification for the North American market . . . .

 

You know how everything is smarter, bigger, faster over there . . . and has a gun . . .

 

Here in the UK we accept that hedgehogs and suchlike are going to get flattened under the wheels. OK, a badger is pretty solid and might just throw your car across the road as it shuffles off this mortal coil. A deer you want to avoid, it's a heavy old lump if it comes over the screen and lands in your lap at speed, at best it makes steering difficult . . .

 

However, the good chaps at Canley were presumably concerned that a Stromberg-equipped 250 might not have the turn of speed necessary to cope with an All-American Hedgehog (or whatever). Especially if it was packing a shooting iron. So as a fail-safe they installed the all-purpose front valance escape hatch, with swaged edges to minimise injury, thereby giving a high-speed hog the opportunity to show off its prowess by executing a last-ditch dive through the hatch. Survival of the fittest and all that. Very possibly our gun-toting miniature mammalian hero then picks himself up off the deck, suitably oil-stained, and ungratefully shoots the offending driver in the back . . . or at least shoots out the rear tyres and then the fuel tank for the blow-up ending.

 

Or possibly not, you never know. There might just be a more mundane explanation ?

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

Now thats what I call an imaginative answer! Nice one Alec.

Stuart.

[cp25616]

Now thats what I call an imaginative answer! Nice one Alec.

Stuart.

 

Have to agree...Alec's answer is very funny...nice one.

However on a more serious note all the TR250's and TR5's had this cut out in the lower front valence. Hope this helps.

[pfenlon]

Hello Alec,

 

your reply is imaginitive forward thinking and erudite, just between the two of us, is it this new £3 per bottled cider which is assisting your thinking.

 

If not, tell us Alec, we all want some!

 

I have also taken total offence at your cutting remarks regarding the speed of my TR250. (which I dont even have yet) So am not now speaking to you.

 

I have heard of a secret weapon though, from F1 super pilot Bancroft, that if I get a head from a Triumph 2500S saloon, it may make some difference.

 

So now we are on speaking terms again, where can I get one? AND is it true.

 

Thanks to all for the info who had not partaken of the alicser. can you look at 150278160695 on Ebay the valance looks original, or is it my rose tinted specs.

Edited August 29, 2008 by pfenlon

[Alec Pringle]

Greetings Peter,

 

Happy birthday ? Hmmm, possibly, another year older, it's raining, it's been a wet summer, you've sold the 6 and the Europa, it could be all downhill from here on in . . . but things could get worse, and probably will

 

Cider ? No, m'dear, Beaujolais - and of a remarkable kind. Jaboulet-Vercherre 1982, which by any reasonable standard should have transmogrified into marinating vinegar a couple of decades ago. This one was lurking at the back of my late mother's wine cellar, presumably too terrified of her to deteriorate from its original state. Amazingly it proved still drinkable, albeit nothing to write home about, but all too clearly stimulated the creative flow. You'll be relieved to know that it was the last of its ilk . . . mind you, there is some ancient Chianti still to sample, possibly the stuff of Granny Takes A Trip.

 

That apart, the good Mr Bancroft is quite correct. There's no "may" about it, it will. The 2500S head is rather different to that of its sister 2500TC - despite much of what's been written, the power and torque curves of the S and TC variants (1975-77) were noticeably different. Why Triumph didn't make more at the time of the 2500S' superior capabilities escapes me, but then logic brains and enterprise, let alone common sense, weren't much in evidence at the time in BL. Well, come to that, not at any other time in BL either !

 

Unfortunately the 2500S wasn't produced in vast numbers, most of them have been scrapped, and the best way to find a head is probably to buy a complete scrapper, sorry restoration project, on ebay. They were actually damn good cars, probably the best assembled of any of the various big Triumph saloons, and surprisingly quick and agile - I had an almost new automatic 2500S at the same time as an older 2.5PI o/d, and the carburettored auto wasn't that much slower than the manual injected car. Power output of the S was probably only 10bhp less than the PI saloon or CR 6.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

[pfenlon]

Comprehensive as usual, thought you may know about the S, I shall look out for one.

 

Red wine is a favourite of mine but its the morning after that I find hard to accept so small quantities are all I can manage.

 

I also know sod all about wine, and my only experience is when on our very rare holidays, we are guided sometimes

 

to a local wine cellar where we are supposed to ooh and aargh about the undrinkable stuff that some people actually buy cases of, I think to impress the paupers around them, that cant stand the stuff.

 

Have you had a look at my 250 yet, remember new Ebay rules,

you must not print negative feedback, some poor

bugger could be offended!

[Alec Pringle]

Hi Peter,

 

Looked at ebay now . . . . glutton for punishment. You couldn't have found a 'dry state' car, then ? Can't say I know much about Maine, but I'd lay odds its wetter than Arizona ! Did you send them a carton of rolls of gaffer tape to hold it together in transit ?

 

Well, it is now the day after your birthday, Like I said it's all downhill now . . .

 

Chris Witor might have a decent head ?

 

And don't start me going on wine snobs . . . I spent 15 years in the better end of the wine trade

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

[stuart]

Looks ok Peter, funnily enough in a similar condition shellwise to the 5 Im doing. The only thing was the 5 had all that rot covered by shiny paint and underseal!!

Stuart.

[Bald Rick]

Hi Peter

 

Here is an article about the 219016 head (the one Alec referred to): 219016 head

 

I believe it has smaller exhaust valves than the TR250 head. I think they are the same size as the CR series TR6.

 

There is a lot of info about the cylinder head numbers on the "Technicalities" CD.

 

Here is a good site comparing TR6 cams: Camshafts

 

and a link to Chris Witor's price list! Witor

 

I bought a few bits from him including an uprated oil pump and a camshaft.

 

Hope this may be of some help.

 

Tony

[angelfj]

Do all TR250 cars have a hole cut out of the front valance, mine does, not so may have been renewed after a fender bender but it looks original in the photos.

 

Yes, both the TR250 and TR5 should have an opening in the lower valence. This was a modification since the TR4 and 4A did not have this feature. I have been told that one reason was to increase air flow through the optional oil cooler , which in fact is where mine is mounted. Here is a drawing of the valence from the official TR-250/5 parts manual.

[pfenlon]

Thanks Tony and Frank,

looks like mine was replaced with a standard unit.

 

and The info on heads was GOOD, cams well I would have to take advice I'm not that smart with that side of engine improvement, I have sent Mr Witter an E mail though, lets see what the man has and HOW much.

 

thanks again

 

Peter