exhaust manifold

[tr250team]

hello,

 

i would like an exhaust manifold for my fast road tr5 but i don't now which one to take. I 've seen from moss 6-3-1 (PXTH 604) or a 6-2-1 (TT 1230S1) or 6-1 (TT 1740 X)???

Do you now over seller who have something else???

I'm searching something minimum 2-1/4 of diameter for the end...

If you 've got photos too, it 'llbe pleased !!!

 

Thanks a lot

charles

[dblenk]

hello,

 

i would like an exhaust manifold for my fast road tr5 but i don't now which one to take. I 've seen from moss 6-3-1 (PXTH 604) or a 6-2-1 (TT 1230S1) or 6-1 (TT 1740 X)???

Do you now over seller who have something else???

I'm searching something minimum 2-1/4 of diameter for the end...

If you 've got photos too, it 'llbe pleased !!!

 

Thanks a lot

charles

 

Hi charles

 

i was going to buy a pheonix manifold and system at malvern (pheonix didnt get there) this was a 6-3-1 then 1-2 and a twin sports exhaust however i am told a single pipe is best

Rimmers and TRGB stock them, Rimmers had a Feb sale with the full system including VAT for £375

obviously this is all SS

regards

 

David

[Red5]

Hi Charles

I have the Phoenix system (6-3-1 single pipe) on my car. I can't fault it. It gives good power and bottom end torque along with good economy too, it's quite noisy though.

 

What more could you wish for??

 

David

Edited July 26, 2007 by Red5

[rpurchon]

hello,

 

i would like an exhaust manifold for my fast road tr5 but i don't now which one to take. I 've seen from moss 6-3-1 (PXTH 604) or a 6-2-1 (TT 1230S1) or 6-1 (TT 1740 X)???

Do you now over seller who have something else???

I'm searching something minimum 2-1/4 of diameter for the end...

If you 've got photos too, it 'llbe pleased !!!

 

Thanks a lot

charles

i have just [last month ] bought a phoenix 631 exhaust manifold for my tr6 .

direct from phoenix free post and quite a bit cheaper than moss.

richard

[stephen cooper]

May I suggest a manifold with equal primaries and also proper pipe - pipe joins

 

http://www.jagclub.ru/triumph_tun.html

[Red 6]

I have a similar long primary manifold for sale, it was on one of my race cars and performed very well indeed.

 

If you are interested it will be v cheap but you have to see it and collect it from N London. I think i have the pipe that fits between the manifold and silencer as well.

 

Tom.

[IanR]

Hi Chaps,

After badgering Phoenix for some time they have finally come up with the goods. I wanted a single big bore (2 a5" dia or so ) to go from their 6-3-1 manifold to a rear TRANSVERSE box that looked remotely like the original. They now make this though I have one it will be a week or two before I can test it out.

 

If it sounds and performs as it should, then thid IS the system to get for a fast road car ...Note: wrap the manifold because there is a lot of underbonnet heat otherwise.

Cheers

[bonjovi]

I have a phonix six branch extraction manifold and a big bore exhaust on my 5

I bought it at malvern a few years ago and i think the manifold was around £220 and the rest about £70,

 

You will require a clamp at the fromt (stainless steel from a company called demon tweeks at about a fiver) you will also have to drill two holes in the bar at the rear to hang the rubber straps which you will have to find to suport the rear box.

 

warning though i dont know what the carbs look like but if you have a injection system the manifold gets in the way of the air intake ( the long tube with triumph writen on it )suporting bar.

so you may want to fit k+n filters but with my injection i decided to fit a revington throtle linkage later which was not cheap and there was no clearance to fit the k+n filters back on properly with out modifing some aspects of the linkage or perhaps spacing the air filters out a bit.

 

anyway that is my experience i cant say anything about performance because i put this on after i fully restored the car which i had not driven previously.but it sounds great and when you shut off the throtle burbles nicely.I turn heads and get lots of looks.

but it will last and if you did have injection the meetering unit would need a tweek

[rpurchon]

what is the problem with the 631 manifold,or is it the single bore ex that is the problem or combination of both.

richard

[dblenk]

Hmmmmmmmm

 

i was going to buy the pheonix unit and wrap it, but now reading all the comments i am not so sure

 

is there an answer to Charles's original question ?

 

i would be doing this after the lakes tour

 

so i will see what the forum kicks up

 

thanks

 

david

[John L]

GT ee

What actually has to done the the metering unit, I have a 6 2 1 manifold with a straight thru 2 1/2" pipe and a single silencer at the rear with a cranked up pipe.

Is it just a matter of making sure the CO is correct, and altering accordingly? Will it need to richer or leaner?

Regards John

[John L]

GT ee

I have just double checked the manifold again and its a 6 3 1. but I have no idea who's make it is.

I would be interested to know whats necessary for the MU though.

It has also had a stage 2 unleaded fitted.

Regards John

[TRTOM2500]

If the head has been done remotely decently then I have a solution for this too.

 

The engine should deliver in excess of 180bhp in the configuration you describe.

 

You also have to be careful the pump is up to the fuel delivery. Lots of cars start to show signs of trouble over 4500rpm.

Hi GT,

I have heard nothing but good reports on your manifolds. Are you starting to re-manufacture them again? Be intersted to see results, before and after. (Standard system Vs performance system)...

 

Many thanks,

Thomas

[marvmul]

Hmmmmmmmm

 

i was going to buy the pheonix unit and wrap it, but now reading all the comments i am not so sure

 

is there an answer to Charles's original question ?

 

i would be doing this after the lakes tour

 

so i will see what the forum kicks up

 

thanks

 

david

I would say : buy that Phoenix system because no one can sell you an exhaust system and guarantee you that it will perform better than the Phoenix one on YOUR car without dyno testing. Without trying the exhaust and other components on an engine dyno, the best thing you can do is buy or copy a system that is known to work well in general on a six cyl TR engine and the Phoenix 6/3/1 is one of them.

[davehop]

Hi GT

 

Please keep us all posted on this one as I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting to find the perfect six cylinder manifold - be very interested to hear of your progress, or indeed if you start to manufacture again.

 

 

Best

 

 

Dave

[IanR]

GTee

Not sure who you are and of course I'm sure you know more than I.... but ...to say that the new exhaust box that phoenix have designed is just copying your design, when as far as I am aware, I am the first to receive thius so you cannot have the first idea of what its like makes me feel that there is a bit of sour grapes here. How can you pronounce on a design that you have not even seen ???

 

This is an atempt to deliver the power of the big bore single pipe system, well received by all, to a rear box that looks like the original without the twin pipe system in between. It is not a race system nor even the ultimate in road cars but for me, and I might add to lots of potential owners of TR250's in the US, a route to a better system than they have otherwise had. Also the posting above from Steven Cooper is good, but does not mention that you will probably need to dispense wth the underslung throttle mech which, some people with lots of cashwill not mind but actually the original mechanism only needs Phos-broz bushes for running and thrust and its as good as the overslung aftermod for about 1/10th of the price.

 

Cheers

[67_gt6]

GTee

Not sure who you are and of course I'm sure you know more than I.... but ...to say that the new exhaust box that phoenix have designed is just copying your design, when as far as I am aware, I am the first to receive thius so you cannot have the first idea of what its like makes me feel that there is a bit of sour grapes here. How can you pronounce on a design that you have not even seen ???

 

Ian, I presumed he was referring to the manifold.

 

cheers

 

Andy

[IanR]

Hi Andy,

 

Maybe GTee WAS referring to the manifold but he/she quoted me on MY comments re the exhaust box which I hope explains my reply. I dont doubt he or she knows a lot more abour this than I, but, to condemn something without seeing or having any knowledge of it, is in my book, tantamount to arrogance.!!!!

 

 

Regards

[stephen cooper]

Talk about opening a can of worms! IanR regards a half decent manifold and clearance not sure there is a need for the overslung kit we did this...

Edited July 28, 2007 by stephen cooper

[dblenk]

right so theres a book to be published, possibly a super duper manifold better than everything else

 

if i were not to buy a phoenix system, then where and when will these manifolds be going to market

 

i await the the results from Gt ee and ianR's new manifold and hopefully buy the right one

 

when fitted (to a std 125BHP i think 6 engine with triple dellortos) it will be put on a dyno but i dont want to fit the wrong thing as this research on the engine for my 6 will be transferred to my 5 during the rebuild

 

await with excitment, the results

 

regards

 

David

[dblenk]

The book's been out of print for 10+ years, so it's a big step to reprint it.

 

The last manifolds were made 10 years ago also IN FRANCE

 

You won't get any benefit from fitting an exhaust using the mild 18-58 cam from the CR engine, it needs AT LEAST the hotter CP profile or more to function properly.

 

As for the motorsport ones being made now, they're going to be over a grand, (and not available until Autumn) so it's not within the reach of most people.

Even decent mild steel ones are around about HALF that figure........so it's all "between a rock and a hard place".

 

The price of material and labour in the UK and EU is fast making it uneconomic to do cheap conversions for older pushrod engines like I used to do years ago.

The majority of people who used to do hand made, have died, retired, or have simply disappeared.

 

There is a big skill shortage in the UK nowadays, and I don't have the time or energy for working with badly made stuff that doesn't work properly.

I would rather be doing V8 sports systems or proper inconel race designs.

They have to earn reasonable money, or there's no point in starting.

 

Sounds tough I know,

but would YOU work for nothing, especially after 25 years experience?

 

Hi GTee, was you book yellow called tuning manual by g.thomas ?

i have been offered a sort of 6-2-1 with the pipes swept all the way to the join at the bottom of the manifold, this is i think in mild steel, should i get this wrapped, if so will i get oil in it and will it catch fire, should i go for SS ?

 

i am playing with a CR TR6 however the guy i bought off said he fitted a 150 BHP block (not sure) it still has the 125 head and fitted with triple dellortos and a electric fan

 

i have ran std TRs for 25 years but this is my first entry into tuning and performance, i would like to get 180-200BHP without paying the racetoration prices as all i want is a fast club car

 

i thought i knew what i wanted but not so sure now

 

very interested in your comments

 

regards

 

david

[marvmul]

David, GT ee is indeed Gareth Thomas. He is not going to make anything that can be of interest for Triumph owners. He will not say anything either that will be usefull for a TR owner.

I recongnise his parlando when it appears in a forum without looking at the GT initials (GTevo, GT ee etcetera)

[dblenk]

Yes.

 

You will find it relatively easy to get that sort of power, and I have seen it easily achieved for under 1K, with total reliability, and almost completely standard components.

I think, that comes to the best value for money you will ever get in a traditional British open top sports car, and THAT after all is what it's all about.

 

right so i now know your name, Gareth

 

i have had TRs for years but been out of the scene a bit since the kids came so i did know who you were, can you point me in the right direction of this power for £1K ?

 

did you say you had a website, or do you do the mods yourself , therefore is it a case to come along get you to do it and watch and learn ?

 

regards

 

David

[Guest Wyn]

Hi GT_ee

 

180-200bhp for under £1k, please tell me how and you will make my day and many others I'm sure. I'm a total novice and just curious. Are you saying that the standard conrods will cope with that kind of power? I really do hope so.

 

I look forward with eagar anticipation to find out how this is done.

 

Thanks,

Wyn

[Andy Moltu]

Come on Guys this isn't the place to drag up old grievances.

 

I think the debate has raised a few issues:

 

Which of the currently available exhaust manifolds is the best?

There probably isn't a single answer as this does depend on other factors such like modifications to the head, CR, camshaft, filtration and the exhaust it's mated to.

However if one was so much better than the others why don't we all know about it by now? Surely shed loads would have sold in the 40 years since the 6 cylinder TRs were launched.

 

Why are tuning parts so expensive? How the manufacturers of items like exhaust manifolds justify the price they charge? The manufacturing surely can't be such as to justify a £1000 price tag? Is there that much more assembly work involved with one manifold compared to another. A bit more welding, a bit more complicated cutting & bending perhaps but how much are these assembly workers paid?

The design work certainly has a price tag but how many "man hours" go into it? What is the time frame to recoup the design costs?

Perhaps greed comes into it and the short short term mentality that afflicts Britain - sell a few at a high price rather than a lot at realistic price? Knocking up exhaust manifolds for TRs is not the same as designing the ultimate for an F1 car and the people doing so surely can't delude themselves into thinking they are in th David Beckham league in terms of income.

 

20 years ago when I first got my TR there were so many more companies in the TR game than now and you just wonder how many of those would have still been trading if they adopted the philosphy of "this is my job for the long term". More grease monkey than city trader!

 

Does anyone truly accept that the true cost of half a dozen manifolds could equate to the cost of a new car?

Just because an old tea cup sells for a furtune at an auction it doesn't mean that a new one, with a more refinements will fetch more than a few pence even if the designer has put a week, a month or even a year's design effort into it!

It does seem that mark ups in the classic car world are substantially more than in most trades.