perkins_gl Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 Hi All I have a new set of minilites to go on my TR6 and as you've probably all realised they don't quite fit at the front. They touch, tot he point were I can't turn them by hand, on full lock. I assume I'll need 6mm spacers which Moss do. Do I need them at the back as well? The back doesn't lock but if I only put them on the fron I'll be changing the car's front track by 12 mm. IS that important? Cheers George Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Crawley Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 (edited) George My advice is don’t fit spacers; they put extra strain on the stub axle, hub bearings, & wheel studs; Assuming the Minilites’ are KN’s, the wheel usually fouls on the outboard bolt ball joint fixing where the excess thread protrudes, sometimes the grease nipple but mostly at the extreme edges of the wishbone bracket. Remove the bolt & put it back in the other way around (i.e. so just the head is facing wheel rim), move the grease nipple or fit a straight one and you can alleviate fouling of the wishbone brackets by grinding a radius on the outer corners; from memory you need to remove around 6mm or so but this doesn’t weaken the brackets in any way as its right at the very end. This is a much better cure than spacers which I personally have never liked & would never fit! Also check that you have the lock stops correctly adjusted! Edited July 31, 2006 by Richard CRawley Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest harry dent Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 Change the lock stops from 20mm to 22mm and that should do the trick.I made mine but RevingtonTR has them in stock. Regards Harry. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Allan Jezzard Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 Hi All I have a new set of minilites to go on my TR6 and as you've probably all realised they don't quite fit at the front. They touch, tot he point were I can't turn them by hand, on full lock. I assume I'll need 6mm spacers which Moss do. Do I need them at the back as well? The back doesn't lock but if I only put them on the fron I'll be changing the car's front track by 12 mm. IS that important? Cheers George George I have posted on this subject previously. The KN (Mynator) wheels have an incorrect offset, i.e. the relationship between the hub and the rim. This results in the problems you mention and also on the rear if you happen to have certain relescopic damper conversions. The answer is not to fit spacers but to buy the slightly more expensive Compomotive wheels, still a minilite style, which in my opinion also look better. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Richard Crawley Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 The answer is not to fit spacers but to buy the slightly more expensive Compomotive wheels, still a minilite style, which in my opinion also look better. But it's a bit late if youve already bought em! Really, it's not much work to get KN's to clear at the front; I don't know what the answer is if they foul the tele conversion at the back, I didn't have a problem but I know some have! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Allan Jezzard Posted July 31, 2006 Report Share Posted July 31, 2006 But it's a bit late if youve already bought em! Really, it's not much work to get KN's to clear at the front; I don't know what the answer is if they foul the tele conversion at the back, I didn't have a problem but I know some have! Richard I don't think it is too late, these suppliers should not be selling these wheels without first explaining that the offset is incorrect and to make them fit you have to fit spacers or alter the steering stops. I had a discussion with a trader at the International who insisted that they were a straight replacement for TRs. He professed to have no knowledge of the offset problem until I demonstrated the difference in front of him. He was still more interested in making a sale than actually achieving customer satisfaction. If I was George, I would return them, as I actually did nearly two years ago! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
perkins_gl Posted August 1, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2006 I will have a look at Richard suggestion this weekend and see if I'm able to make some minor adjustments. If not it sounds to me like spacers on the front alone is an issue other than the extra strain? Have there been many failures due to spacers? Cheers George Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ron Posted August 1, 2006 Report Share Posted August 1, 2006 George I had the same problem despite assurances by the seller to the contrary, it is easily cured without spacers by a combination of what Harry Dent and Richard Crawley have posted, personally I would not use spacers, the front bearings and stub axle on the TR6 looks marginal as it is. Ron Quote Link to post Share on other sites
saffrontr Posted August 2, 2006 Report Share Posted August 2, 2006 George, If you are going to use spacers I suggest that you use the Revington spacers. The ones sold by MOSS are a universal spacer and unless you araldite them in place will give you out of balance problems. I found this out to my cost. The Revington 6mm spacers are machined to suit TR's and are sold principally for wire wheels which save having to fit short studs. I have used them on the front on my six for a number of years as the 6" Cosmic alloys that I did have fitted have a 4" backspace instead of the standard 3.5". The Cosmics fouled the top wishbones in reverse on full lock. I have now fitted ARE alloys and these also have a 4" backspace so the spacers are being used again. Incidentally I would have thought that a greater backspace would put less load on the hubs than standard wheels as the wheel is set inwards rather than outwards. Derek Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jean Posted August 5, 2006 Report Share Posted August 5, 2006 Very good thinking Derek. I use 5mm spacers on my 6 since 1975 without any adverse effect, but I drive my car in a rather civilized way Anyhow it makes no difference if the offset is produced by the wheel layout or by a spacer, on the other hand you will have to make sure that the wheel stud threads are fully covered, in other words if you use spacers it's wise to use longer wheelnuts. For my Woolfrace wheels I had original TR6 wheelnuts machined to match the wheels including the spacers. As far as I can judge the situation, wire wheels are bound to produce far more load on stub axles than any other wheel including spacers, as seen the construction, all the load is positioned at the outside end. Jean Quote Link to post Share on other sites
perkins_gl Posted August 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2006 Hi Jean/Derek Thanks for the information. I'm going to have a look next weekend as I'm not sure where this weekend went!! Spacers sounds a lot easier but if its a simple cure to grind and fit then I might try that. I'm glad to hear spacers aren't completely out of the question. Thanks George Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ron Posted August 6, 2006 Report Share Posted August 6, 2006 (edited) Sorry to disagree with Jean and Derek but it does matter whether the backspace is created by the wheel design or by spacers, if you use spacers the bending moment on the stub axle is increased by the thickness of the spacers, in it's simplest form using wheels of the same width think of the load on the stub as a simple lever, the spacer make the lever longer, greater inset isn't going to have a big effect reducing this bending moment. The risk of using spacers is obviously very low but the fact the problem can be resolved relatively easily without using spacers makes them unnecessary, wonder what the insurance company would say in the event of a failure?? Ron Edited August 6, 2006 by ron Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted August 7, 2006 Report Share Posted August 7, 2006 As soon as insurance considerations enter the equation, it's probably best not to fit anything other than standard wheels! In the event of a serious accident, there is a distinct possibility that (some) insurers would consider any undeclared steering/suspension mods as invalidating your policy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jean Posted August 7, 2006 Report Share Posted August 7, 2006 The spacer question has been raised by the German MOT authorities, the TUV. I bought KN wheels with spacers and LONG wheelnuts and these are certified by this authority to be used on TR's, and so should not lead to any discussion with insurance Even putting different needles in your SU's can be challenged by an insurance. In my opinion, in the mean time, no TR will be road legal if the insurance is starting to split hairs, anyhow in case of accident the reason for the accident has to be directly related to the modification. Unfortunately the insurance company is mostly pulling the strongest rope and it will probably require a legal procedure to get your right Further I'm more confident about the quality of my 36 years old stub axles than in those new re-made products, with the exception of uprated pieces from a reliable supplier The point is if at any time the axles turn green/blue etc... it means that excessive heat was applied and that the strength might be doubtfull Jean Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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