Uprated front springs

[sforster]

I recently fitted a pair of uprated springs to a 3B I am restoring. Today I sat the engine on the chassis expecting the springs to give a bit and lift off the bump stops. No such luck. The springs are Triumph Tune Springs, Moss catalog TT4006 on page 47 of the catalog. Reading the info' it says use the alloy spacers, which I have. I would assume most of the weight is now on the chassis in the form of the engine and was suprised when the springs didn't give. Has anyone got previous experience with these springs, and any suggestions, is the catalog correct and the springs will give when everthing else is in situe or should I remove the spacers?

Simon.

[rudi]

Hi Simon,

 

First off all you must fit the aluminium spacers.

I have TT4006 on my TR3A 1960 in combination with spax shocks. My experience is they perform very well in today's traffic. They slightly raise the front of the car in comp. to standard springs and that is a good thing, so that you can take speed bumps without touch down of the front (at "normal" speed of course). Although slightly uprated to 390 Lbs, they are still comfy enough to drive. They work well and are well in balance with a standard rear set up so to give a slight tendency to oversteer at high speed. Revington's Rally springs do not need the alu spacers but they will only suit the owner that wants to take badly paved road at high speed (Rally). With these the car will only behave well balanced in combination with stiffer rear springs and uprated lever arm shocks.

So TT4006 is a good choise for the normal use.

 

Cheers, Rudi

[sforster]

Now I am confussed, I rang the supplier this morning and explained the situation. The answer they gave me was "the book is wrong remove the spacers, the springs are made for most of the TR range and you do not require spacers on the TR3"

I took their advice and removed the spacers, the car is now not sat on the bump stops and the springs sit straight not pushing outwards as they were before!

Before removing the spacers along with the engine on the chassis two of us stood on the chassis above the suspension area and still no movement in the springs so I can only presume the supplier is correct and the book is wrong?

Simon.

[rudi]

Simon, I don't know who you spoke to. Did you ring to Moss in the UK, and if so who did you speak to? Both the "old" catalogue as the latest one on page 47 claerly say that all the triumph tune springs are designed to be fitted with the aluminium spacers 107682.

I can tell you that my springs are 3 years on the car now WITH the spacers in place. Everything is fine. I have approx. 135 mm ground clearance from the bottom to the chassis as it should be. Without the spacers this should be much less. The upper part of the spring faces inboard and that is how it should be. Do you have the shock absorbers in place and what do you mean by "lift off the bump stops".

Regards, Rudi

[sforster]

Hi Rudi,

I totally agree with you about the instructions in the catalogue. Regarding the "lift off the bump stops" I referred to, I am describing the bump stops on the chassis which are positioned under the shock absorber mounting plate. Until I removed the aluminium spacers the shock absorber mounting plate was pressed tight against the bump stop, even with the weight of the engine and two men on the chassis.

I have checked the clearance from the bottom of the chassis near the front suspension, there is 160mm ground clearance, I would imagine by the time the body is back on etc this will reduce to 135mm approx. I bought the springs from a different supplier to Moss so I haven't spoken direct with Moss but the supplier I used twice now have said "remove the aluminium spacers." By the way the springs are stamped with TT4006 on them giving me no reason to question their authenticity

All I can say is without the spacers the suspension setup seems to work and does look correct. I.e. the spring sits straighter and doesn't bow outwards as it did with the spacers in place, and when I jump on the chassis there is now movement in the suspension.

Regards Simon.

[Mychael]

Some time ago now I ordered and fitted what was supposed to be matched front and rear spring sets from Moss. I cannot recall the part numbers now. Anyway I did not fit the alloy spacers in the front, I cannot recall seeing any instructions to do so, maybe I missed that. However as it stands(sits) at the moment my car is too low at the front and probably around normal ride hight at the rear.

 

We are now going to dis-assemble the front again to fit spacers to improve ride height.

 

Mychael

[rudi]

Hi, As written before acc. all documents I can find on a side screen car and TR4 the TT4006 springs should be fitted with the aluminium spacers. Mine are fitted with spacers and the ride height is 135 mm as it should be. FYI, The TT4006 springs are RED.

Regards,

Rudi

[Mychael]

Color I do remember. These springs are black.

 

Mychael

[sforster]

Hi again Rudi,

Yes the springs are red, I've put the aluminium spacers in a safe place just in case! Not yet convinced they won't be needed.

Simon

[rudi]

I quote Moss latest TR2-4A parts book on page 47:

"All Triumph Tune springs are designed to be used with the standard 2" alloy spring collar/spacer 107682. It may not be required for lightweight cars and is not required when fitting standard TR2/3/4 springs 210903".

 

All springs have a colour code (This is a line that is lengthwise on the springs). I do not know the diff. colours off the springs themselves but as said earlier my TT4006 are red (with a blue stripe)

TT4006 Colour code B - 390 Lbs (increased height for road/Rally)

TT4001 WB - 390 Lbs ( slightly lowered for fast road)

TT4201/4102/4207 are for competition purpose, rates from 320 Lbs to 450 Lbs, and all lowered vs. standard ride)

 

Regards, Rudi

[jean]

Some uprated springs are considerably shorter than standard springs and will need appropriate spacers. Imagine the car coming off the ground, without spacers, the springs will bang around as the full suspension extension will be greater than the spring length

Jean

[Mychael]

I remember when we sat the new coils alongside the originals there was a difference.

The new ones were shorter but were a heavier gauge wire. The guy fitting them suggested that the heavier wire might affect how much they settled and that it (might) all come out correct at then end.

 

Of course as we were to discover this was not the case.

 

Mychael

[unclepete]

Simon

Bit of a worry if the suspension didn't come off the bump stops with two of you standing on it?

Did you try bouncing it?

It's not a huge job to swop them over so you may as well leave them as they are untill the rest of it is back together and then see how it goes.

I would do as Rudi says and keep the spacers in.

 

I dream of a 135mm clearance, I have lowered road race springs up front which gives me about 80mm under the rad! so I take speed bumps very carefully!

 

Unc

[Guest sp53]

Simon

Bit of a worry if the suspension didn't come off the bump stops with two of you standing on it?

Did you try bouncing it?

It's not a huge job to swop them over so you may as well leave them as they are untill the rest of it is back together and then see how it goes.

I would do as Rudi says and keep the spacers in.

 

I dream of a 135mm clearance, I have lowered road race springs up front which gives me about 80mm under the rad! so I take speed bumps very carefully!

 

Unc

 

Hi Simon I am curious. How did you get the rebound bracket back in with all the pressure on it from the spring pushing down. Were you able to jack the A frame up enough to get the shock and rebound bracket in by adding more weight to the car?

Sp53

 

 

Hi Simon I am curious. How did you get the rebound bracket back in with all the pressure on it from the spring pushing down. Were you able to jack the A frame up enough to get the shock and rebound bracket in by adding more weight to the car?

Sp53

[sforster]

Hi sp53, is that your real name?

As to your question, there lies a story. I parked the car under a concrete beamed terrace at home, seen as the body was not on the chassis at the time I placed an acro prop from the chassis to a beam and jacked up the suspension, is there another way?

Simon.

[Guest sp53]

Hi sp53, is that your real name?

As to your question, there lies a story. I parked the car under a concrete beamed terrace at home, seen as the body was not on the chassis at the time I placed an acro prop from the chassis to a beam and jacked up the suspension, is there another way?

Simon.

Hello no my real name is George. Well that is just it. I am not sure there is a good way to set the preload with the engine out and the body off. Some people stack bricks on the frame and some use a garbage can with water. I am in the middle of doing a frame off myself and ran into the problem of getting the rubber return bracket back in. I now have decided to put the engine and transmission back in and see where that gets the weight. Personally I like a somewhat soft ride so I am using the old springs. In fact, I usually use less air in the tires just to soften things a bit. In addition, I find the shock installation to be tricky because the A frame wants to drop down below the length of the shock and that damages the shock by stretching it out.

sp53