A pity fuel is so expensive

[modelbuilder]

Yes, a pity fuel is so expensive.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/TR6-V8-CORVETTE-327-...id=p3286.c0.m14

[PILKIE]

Has anyone converted their TR5/6 to LPG ????? Can it be done ?????

[88V8]

Has anyone converted their TR5/6 to LPG ????? Can it be done ?????

 

Well, if you didn't mind having no boot space, I expect it could be done with a carb car, although LPG is not kind to moving jet carbs such as SU or Stromberg.

However, the power loss is at least 15% afaik, and rises with revs.

 

Just grit your teeth and pay for the petrol, I'm afraid....

 

Ivor

[Ragtag]

Has anyone converted their TR5/6 to LPG ????? Can it be done ?????

 

Ah finally, my specialist subject

 

I haven't done a TR but I have successfully completed 8 installations, all on Land/Range Rovers, both carb'd and injection V8s.

 

Personally, I wouldn't attempt a PI as I would be concerned about damaging the expensive and tempremental components of the PI system whilst running on gas (this is due to my lack of knowledge of the PI system, I'm not saying it cant be done).

 

A carb car would be a piece of cake though as all the components are readily available. You would also need an unleaded head as you can't add "valvemaster" to gas.

 

Ivor is correct about the damage to carbs but this relates to SUs mainly. The LPG doesn't hurt them but they continue to operate normally when running on LPG and this causes the needle to rise and fall whilst not being lubricated by petrol so it wears out much faster. This can be overcome by a clip that holds the plunger up all the time you are running on gas. On my Bobtail, because I don't run on petrol at all, I have removed the needle and have a grub screw through the dashpot to hold the plunger up.

 

Ivor is wrong about the power loss...... in my experience, it doesn't exist. You do need a decent ignition system to get the best out of gas, however, which is why I run a dual point distributor on my Bobtail. LPG is generally about 115 octane so you can run quite high compression and loads of advance without pinking. All the cars I have done have run better on gas than petrol

 

So far as boot space is concerned, if you were going to make the change, the obvious thing to do would be to replace the petrol tank with a gas tank and just have a small custom petrol tank (another reason for not doing a PI).

 

The real question would be whether it was worth doing.

 

Assuming you already had a carbed U/L head engine, a kit would cost 4-6 hundred pounds depending on the size and spec of the tank. A dual point distributor would be a couple of hundred on top.

 

LPG is about half the price of unleaded. You do the maths

[88V8]

Ah finally, my specialist subject

 

On my Bobtail, because I don't run on petrol at all, I have removed the needle and have a grub screw through the dashpot to hold the plunger up.

So you can start from cold on gas - didn't know that. But with no needle you're completely tied to gas... if you can't find a gas station....

 

Ivor is wrong about the power loss...... in my experience, it doesn't exist. You do need a decent ignition system to get the best out of gas, however, which is why I run a dual point distributor on my Bobtail. LPG is generally about 115 octane so you can run quite high compression and loads of advance without pinking. All the cars I have done have run better on gas than petrol.

I've seen dyno results to the contrary in magazines, but that was a while ago, and the vehicles concerned were also running petrol so the ignition wasn't optimised for gas.

And do you think the Govt is really committed to gas and its fuel duty discount? Why aren't Govt cars running gas, considering the nearly zero 'greenhouse gas' emissions?

 

Assuming you already had a carbed U/L head engine, a kit would cost 4-6 hundred pounds depending on the size and spec of the tank. A dual point distributor would be a couple of hundred on top.

LPG is about half the price of unleaded. You do the maths

Moreover, altho LPG has a high octane rating, it has a lower calorific value, so you don't get the same mileage. 22mpg on petrol = about 20mpg on gas, I believe.

 

Mind you, there may be another option. In India, I'm told, they sell a special fuel made from a particular type of leaves. It's sold in various blends, the fuel stations look like this:

 

 

Ivor

[Ragtag]

So you can start from cold on gas - didn't know that. But with no needle you're completely tied to gas... if you can't find a gas station....

 

I've seen dyno results to the contrary in magazines, but that was a while ago, and the vehicles concerned were also running petrol so the ignition wasn't optimised for gas.

And do you think the Govt is really committed to gas and its fuel duty discount? Why aren't Govt cars running gas, considering the nearly zero 'greenhouse gas' emissions?

 

Moreover, altho LPG has a high octane rating, it has a lower calorific value, so you don't get the same mileage. 22mpg on petrol = about 20mpg on gas, I believe.

 

 

Ivor

 

Hi Ivor,

 

Yes, I have never had a problem starting on gas but it takes a few pulls in the winter. As a fall back I always carry a full can of Easystart although I can't remember ever having to use it. I suppose it depends on how cold you mean by cold but for example, I had little problem starting the car on Exmoor in early December after a night when I was cold wearing two sets of clothes and an Arctic sleeping bag!!! I think that professional installers advise people to start on petrol and then switch over because most people want to jump in, turn the key and go.

 

I should point out that I do carry the needles and I do have a small petrol tank if the worst comes to the worst (although on reflection, the petrol in the tank is about 6 years old so it probably wouldn't do much) but with 90 usable litre tank, I have never come close to running out but I do plan ahead. One upside of LPG when touring in France is that the Pumps are always away from the petrol pumps so on Motorways in particular, you sail past the queues for petrol and get straight onto your pump. Its the closest I'll ever get to 1st Class

 

As far as power is concerned, I think you have hit the nail on the head......its all about the ignition. My dual point dizzy and ignition amplifier and Magnacor leads give me a longer Dwell, more Advance and a fatter spark to overcome the weak flame front of LPG. I would also add that my experience is exclusively with 3.5 and 3.9 V8s in 4x4s so ultimate power has never really been an issue as I rarely exceed 3500 rpm and am more concerned with Torque. I suppose what I am trying to say is that I have not experienced an obvious loss of power.

 

Economy drop off is an issue but this is also largely "cured" by the set up and lets face it ...driving style makes a difference also. When I originally built the Bobtail I tested the economy and on the same route over a period of 3 or 4 weeks I averaged 16 mpg on petrol and 13 on gas. The changes to the ignition and inlet tract have only served to bring the gas up to 15/16. Counter intuitively, the two 3.9 conversions that I have done both returned better economy figures, nudging 20mpg on motorway mileage. I put this down to electronic ignition, the injection manifold design and a 5th gear. No science, just observation.

 

As far as the Government is concerned, who can tell. Their attitude to LPG has always been confused. If you can afford a brand new Range Rover, they give you a 75% grant to convert it to gas but if you have a 20 year old car, you have to pay the full cost yourself! As the Yanks say, "go figure". I think that politically, removing the Duty differential would be pounced on by the media as "anti Green so I suspect that it will survive but be gradually erroded over time. For me, the move to LPG was purely economic and fortunately my hardware has paid for itself, a number of times over already.

[littlejim]

I don't think Ivor's photo is a very good representation of an ephalant at all.

But noticed that Ragtag mentioned carrying a can of EasyStart with him. One of the local firms produce a similar product with the name 'Startyabastard', which guarantees more sales over here.

Edited July 5, 2008 by littlejim