marvmul Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 (edited) Are calendar months/years more important or is it the number of heat cycles (races) that counts? Fresh tyres are performing better of course, but is it possible that after the 1st race week-end, track tyres are degrading further only very slowly? In that case,race tyres are almost as good after ten races than after one or two races? What about 'GRIP' and other tyre softeners : do they improve grip too, or make they only the tyre softer (after enough applications and time for absorption deep enough)? Edited April 16, 2007 by marvmul Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Mm, MSA Reg E 12.9.5 "Unless permitted under sporting regulations the use of chemical tyre softeners is not permitted." You'll have to ask the series you're in. TRR/TSSC doesn't mention them, so they are not permitted. Me, I think: A/ It's age. If you use a set of race tyres, they'll wear out before they get too old. If you don't use them, then three years. B/ How will anyone know you've used any softener? John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MadMarx Posted April 17, 2007 Report Share Posted April 17, 2007 The first heat cycle is the most important one. If the tire is getting too hot at the first cycle then they're loosing grip very quickly. My experience shows that I can do about 20 heat cycles on one set before they get bad. Other racers determined 15 cycles. Truth might be somewhere in between. Cheers Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
marvmul Posted April 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2007 I would only use a tyre softener to use my tyres longer. Is that cheating? I don't think so because the rules of our competition are permitting any tyre that has a street aprovel (E number or Dot number). And new tyres will always be better than older tyres on wich a softener is applied, so people with enough money have still an advantage. In some series, all competitors have to use the same tyre : in that case, using a softener is definitely cheating, but that's a completely different situation. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MadMarx Posted April 17, 2007 Report Share Posted April 17, 2007 I'm not a friend of "same tires for all". Motorsport is a mixture out of car technic and driving skills. These tire softener are good for 1-2 qualifying laps but won't last a race distance. Would wonder me if it could make out of a bad used tire a good one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dodgeram Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 If its any help at all, im heavily involved in bike road racing where tyres are the difference between upright and horizontal. Its certainly both factors that are important. Heat cycles without doubt degrade the tyres and i would tend to agree that 10 would be about max on a treaded race tyre. As regard to age, the rule of thumb for us is that when they are aged, the blue tinge on the surface is a good indicator that the rubber has had its prime time and only any good for practice, burn outs or the bin! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JRCWeedon Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 If it is any help I used "jungle juice" on some slicks on a Mallock sports racer a few years ago which was great for two speed hillclimbs but after that was worse than before. Sprints and hillclimbs tend not to put so much heat into the tyre but 30 heat cycles is reckoned to be the limit. Regards John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Spit50 Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 I agree that the first race or two is the best performance is found from tyres, However I have a pair of Yokohama A032s (medium compound) that were used for about 2 years on my Spitfire (light car that is good to tyres) and were retired when we changed to Yokohama A048s in 2005. After a couple of accidents that destroyed a couple of the new the 48s last year I pulled the 32s out of their year long retirement and refitted them. Despite being close to their wear strips I was still able to get close to my best Silverstone lap time in the October 06 Birket relay race, and have even started my cash strapped 07 season on them. So that equates to well over 3 years in age and over 50 heat cycles (20 races and 20 practices in 2 years plus some track days). So my experience is that as long as a moulded Yokohama has decent tread on it then they stay useable for a significant length of time. IMHO treaded tyres do need to have tread on them to allow the rubber to sqidge about enough to warm them up, so once the tread has worn to under 1mm then I'll bin them. Cheers Andy Vowell Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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