Oil additive - filter blocked?

[MadMarx]

hi,

 

has anyone figured out that a oil additive like MOS2 can block the oil filter?

 

I have this incident at the moment.

 

Regards

Chris

[MikeF]

FWIW: I never heard of Moly or any an oil additive doing that, and I hope you have no lasting damage.

I have to ask why you want to use oil additive? the basis for the claims for oil additives is IMHO suspect. I also suspect that this is a subject taht has been aired before with strong opinions either way. If you have the time you might want to go here

http://www.carbibles.com/additives.html

its very long and mostly aimed at cars a little younger than ours, scroll down towards the end for the real meat!

 

Mike

[marvmul]

hi,

 

has anyone figured out that a oil additive like MOS2 can block the oil filter?

 

I have this incident at the moment.

 

Regards

Chris

Molykote is a well known brand of grease(in Belgium and other countries I suppose) : it contains MoS2 to improve the grease : friction reducing and other properties? Perhaps it's not suitable as an oil additive?

You mentioned engine damage in a former post : maybe the MoS2 can block an oil filter by agglutination with small metal particles or metal wear dust? Was the MoS2 a component of an oil additive or an engine oil?

I believe in graphite for engine oil (I use almost exclusively Marly graphyte oil for twenty years, full synthetic in my race car), but that's only a subjective appreciation and no better than any other opinion of additivesof course

[Richard Crawley]

Personally, I don't see the point of using anything other than a quality 20/50, which is what the engine was designed to run on. I also have no faith in the claims of any ‘wonder’ additive & particularly engine treatments which only gum the whole lot up, may give a temporary improvement but ultimately last less than a few thousand miles at which point, the symptoms will be 10 times worse!

[Bill Wirz]

Here is some good reading on motor oils.

 

http://www.boss302.com/oil.htm

 

 

Bill

[MadMarx]

Molykote is a well known brand of grease(in Belgium and other countries I suppose) : it contains MoS2 to improve the grease : friction reducing and other properties? Perhaps it's not suitable as an oil additive?

You mentioned engine damage in a former post : maybe the MoS2 can block an oil filter by agglutination with small metal particles or metal wear dust? Was the MoS2 a component of an oil additive or an engine oil?

I believe in graphite for engine oil (I use almost exclusively Marly graphyte oil for twenty years, full synthetic in my race car), but that's only a subjective appreciation and no better than any other opinion of additivesof course

 

This additive is from Liqui Moly and made for engine oil use.

At the seasons final last year I had to retire after 7 laps because of some noise from the engine. When I pulled the head I saw piston #2 hitting the head and the wristpin clips shaped rails into the sleeve.

 

After looking at the lower engine part I found all bearings very dry. The rod #2 turned color to blue.

 

The oilpump and drive looks perfect....but I have this molykote slime in my oilpan and the filter and the bearings.

 

Bad luck I would say....

[BrianC]

Here is some good reading on motor oils.

 

http://www.boss302.com/oil.htm

Bill

Very interesting. Until I had a quick look at this article, I was firmly of the same opinion as Richard in sticking to the quality 20W/50 oils which I have always used in TRs. However, when I have fully digested the article I suspect I may change my mind.

[MikeF]

"Very interesting. Until I had a quick look at this article, I was firmly of the same opinion as Richard in sticking to the quality 20W/50 oils which I have always used in TRs. However, when I have fully digested the article I suspect I may change my mind."

 

 

I just read this through, the author demonstrates some familiarity with oil and lubricants and may well have been in the industry a long time as he says, but I have to wonder what he was doing. IMHO it's just a very long repetitive ramble, with no real information or definite conclusions, but with some glaring errors on chemistry. For myself and with respect I will not be changing my ideas based on this article. I refer you back to the car bibles reference I gave earlier.

http://www.chris-longhurst.com/carbibles/i...tyre_bible.html

[marvmul]

You are very right, Mike. The autor made some very wrong statements, already at the start he is exposing his sheer ignorance :

 

Quote : "At this point, the second type of lubrication takes over. The oil pump is forcing the moving oil in between the engine's internal components, creating what is called a 'Hydro-Dynamic Boundary Layer' " : the autor of the BOSS302 article thinks that the pressure, build by the oil pump, is preventing i.e. the crankpins from making contact with the main and big end bearing shells. Consider this : assuming that the oil pump makes a pressure of 3kg/cm2 and that the surface of a big end bearing is 10cm2 : then the force that the oilpump can put against the power of the combustion is a mere 30kgf. The power of the piston on the crankpin can be thousands of kgf : surely the bearing shells will be as flat as a sigarette paper after some seconds. The oil pump has only to deliver the oil to the bearings. The "dynamic" pressure is build by the movement of the two sufaces relatively to each other and the pressure is rising with the third power of the speed. When the speed is zero, bearing and pin can easily make contact, even if the oil pump is making pressure. (That's why rocker bushes and rockershaft wear out so quickly : the movement stops every time the valve is opening and closing : speed is zero momentarily, the oil layer can disappear and the components are making contact);

So Brian, you better take the advice of Richard or Mike (or even me ), instead of the author's.

[67_gt6]

If I had a blue printed engine I would follow his lead and use Mobil 1 10/30, however the fact is that 99% of us will have to use higher viscosity oils because of the greater tolerances in our engines.

[Bill Wirz]

If I had a blue printed engine I would follow his lead and use Mobil 1 10/30, however the fact is that 99% of us will have to use higher viscosity oils because of the greater tolerances in our engines.

 

67 gt6 is right, when considering oil weight, it’s not so much who made the motor, but what kind of bearing clearances and oil temperature you are running.

 

Bill

[MikeF]

Some interesting comments in this boss302 article, and some common sense. However, I'm not entirely convinced (as they say), and much of the thrust of the argument seems to me to owe more to PR than engineering science . . .

 

Excuse me if I'm sounding cynical, but once upon a time I worked in the automotive aftermarket business - the priorities were not quite the same as when I had worked in professional motorsport.

 

Bill is right, it's good reading and it's interesting - but it's not gospel, and it needs to be read as part of a wider study looking at a range of opinions.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

Well you guys seem to think he makes some sense so I read it through again properly, I even started to do a systematic analysis and .....but then I thought. Hangabout you're not at work, relax, you're just chatting on the Internet. So let'me jsut say yes there are one or two low level observations, but these are elementary perfectly obvious stuff : use Mobil F1 is not really a blinding insight. Mostly its a ramble of hearsay, personal anecdote and opinion masquerading as fact. Many statements he makes are just plain wrong.

Quote:

The additives that make up 'E.P.'(which stands for 'extreme pressure', natch!) are developed from zinc, copper, brass, and other chlorinated solvents. These are commonly referred to as the 'yellow metals'

Unquote

Actually this is not even wrong, it's just rubbish

I'm sorry to bang on like this but pseudo science is one of the things that rather gets to me, No offence intended.

 

Mike

[BrianC]

Having now had chance to read the whole article, and, with the benefit of input from the engineers, metallurgists and chemists of this illustrious forum, I conclude I have probably been doing the right thing (or at least not a bad thing) all these years after all.

 

i.e Use good old-fashioned 20W/50 and change oil and filter frequently. Thanks for the advice.

 

(Seems there are benefits to being a Luddite sometimes).

[North London Mike]

Phew! Lucky we have some people who know what they're doing

 

Stay with the 20/50 then.............change every year, which is possiblly four times more frequent than the recomendation anyway.

 

Should be OK

[MikeF]

Hi Mike,

 

And there was I, just trying to be reasonably polite about someone else's thoughts - however misguided.

Possibly the word we're both looking for is 'B*ll*cks' - or alternatively Mr Ratner's famous expression.

Cheers,

Alec

 

Perhaps I could have been a little less direct. Or just endorsed the examples following.

I am very aware of the experience and knowledge here, freely given, and feel the need to reciprocate if I can,

 

 

Mike

 

 

"QUOTE(67_gt6 @ Jun 15 2006, 05:46 AM)

 

If I had a blue printed engine I would follow his lead and use Mobil 1 10/30, however the fact is that 99% of us will have to use higher viscosity oils because of the greater tolerances in our engines.

 

67 gt6 is right, when considering oil weight, it’s not so much who made the motor, but what kind of bearing clearances and oil temperature you are running.

 

Bill"