Nigel 628 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 This Sunday is the first event this year for WKE and me, with the newly rebuilt TRE engine, gearbox and back axle. Hopefully it will be much improved from last year. No historic class in this one, the Sunseeker this weekend is the first 2011 HRCR Championship rally but it's pricey and a long way from Cheshire, whilst Swynnerton is just down the road and a much cheaper entry fee for a first 'shakedown' tryout. So we will be up against the moderns but I'll try not to let the TR side down! http://www.eromc.co.uk/oak%20leaf.htm Car 44. No spectators as it's military property, I'm afraid, but anyone in the area who wants to watch a TR4 trying to keep up with modern rally cars can sign in as a marshal of course. Let you know how we get on. Hopefully it will still be in one piece for the Tour of Cheshire the following Saturday! Nigel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tr4Tony Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Good luck Nigel - I dont get Beastie back until the 4th so not on the radar, but you will love Swynnerton .... we have been in there for the full business on the Rally of the Tests with both 3VC and BST82B and its one of my favourite venues because of the challenging changes of surface ....go easy on the rough! Less to hit hard than Caerwent but there are squaddies in there with tanks and stuff, so watch out. See you in Cheshire for the 'Tour' .... Tony Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dazzer Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Good luck Nigel... See you on the Tour of Cheshire. Show those modern upstarts what your super preped TR4 with a master at the wheel can do! Cheers Darren Quote Link to post Share on other sites
lesmcguffog Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Good luck show those moderns how to do it. See you next weekend for your second local event. Les Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nigel 628 Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Thanks, guys. We'll do our best. Swynnerton seems to be a favourite venue for a lot of people, including my co-driver Tim, who did this event last year so knows his way round: just as well as there's no pace notes allowed. He mentioned the surface changes too, and the amount of tyre-piercing munitions lying in the grass if you should go off! I've also been told they use those big round straw bales for narrow chicanes to slow the cars on the long straights and they don't move if you hit them - caution there, then! Luckily these sixties sports cars are pretty slim... Nigel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dazzer Posted February 26, 2011 Report Share Posted February 26, 2011 I reversed into one of those rolled straw bales on one of the North Yorkshire Classic tests and I can confirm they do not move! My excuse is I didnt see it! I can feel a trip to the opticians coming on. Cheers Darren Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nigel 628 Posted March 15, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2011 I know it's bit late, but I was holding the report back until we had a full post mortem on the TR. Swynnerton was a great place despite the weather, it rained on and off most of the day but not hard enough to stop us enjoying the event. It was certainly a bit slippery at times! The course featured several double lappers and some triple lappers, giving good stage lengths of up to nine miles. The new engine in the TR4 is a revelation compared with last year, and the gearing is now much better as well. Co-drver Tim declared it's a different car to the one we had last year! However after a good start it began to drop off in performance a bit and although we were keeping a lot of the moderns at bay and even catching some, it definately started to feel off song and we were caught by some of the more powerful cars. The brakes were not what they should be either, even for an historic spec car, and we were losing out to the moderns braking for the many straw bale chicanes so I'll be looking at a solution for that too, especially as we are still planning to be doing the Jim Clark at the end of May! You may remember my thread about master cylinder sizes last year, it's time to sort them out. On the penultimate stage the cockpit started to fill with white smoke to the extent that we were looking for marshals with extinguishers, but it didn't get any worse and there was no sign of a smoke trail behind - or flames! - so we continued. At service it was evident that it was all coming from the crankcase breather so a broken ring was suspected... well, I hate not finishing so we set off on the final stage with a gentle right foot and made it to the end. The guy behind in an Anglia hadn't caught us all day (hardly an historic...not with a Toyota 16v twin cam in it anyway!... but he did catch and pass us on the last stage and told us that although he realised there was something wrong with the TR he saw no smoke trail. Oh well, we got a finish at 35th and the TR was still running fairly strongly despite the problem. I hadn't expected to be competitive against modern rally cars with an historic spec TR4 of course, it was just a local event so ideal for a test run. The next day a compression test showed no.4 cylinder well down, but a friend who had been spectating told me it had been pinking loudly too. I couldn't hear it wearing a helmet! After a strip-down showed a broken ring as suspected, it also transpired that the ignition was way too far advanced at over 40 degrees btdc which was a mystery as the car had been set up on a rolling road with no problems: eventually it was discovered that the disi clamp was allowing it to turn a little at a time, but only when using high revs. It had a single-bolt clamp instead of the normal TR4 2-bolt one and was not gripping tightly enough at nearly 6000 rpm. At least it explained the broken ring so it's unlikely to happen again; TRE sorted it all in double-quick time and she's healthy again. I couldn't have wished for better customer care. New bits (and clamp!) have got it running as it should again and we are looking forward to the next rally, the Get it Sideways Stages on April 9th. It's another open airfield single venue with chicanes which was great fun last year so I'm hoping for a good run if they have booked the same dry, sunny weather again. A very good historic entry this time: we've got some Healey 3000-shaped competition in the over 2-litre class! A selection of photos can be seen on page 4 at: http://www.photoreflect.com/store/ThumbPage.aspx?e=7922311&g=1PXZ002708 ; at least it started nice clean and shiny!! However I'd rather you didn't see the embarassing video at http://www.madvideo.co.uk/page138.htm so please don't look....after a bit of sun the roads dried out a bit, then a light sprinkle of drizzle turned them into a skating rink with cars going off all over the place!!! That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it. Nigel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted March 16, 2011 Report Share Posted March 16, 2011 (edited) I know it's bit late, but I was holding the report back until we had a full post mortem on the TR. Swynnerton was a great place despite the weather, it rained on and off most of the day but not hard enough to stop us enjoying the event. It was certainly a bit slippery at times! The course featured several double lappers and some triple lappers, giving good stage lengths of up to nine miles. The new engine in the TR4 is a revelation compared with last year, and the gearing is now much better as well. Co-drver Tim declared it's a different car to the one we had last year! However after a good start it began to drop off in performance a bit and although we were keeping a lot of the moderns at bay and even catching some, it definately started to feel off song and we were caught by some of the more powerful cars. The brakes were not what they should be either, even for an historic spec car, and we were losing out to the moderns braking for the many straw bale chicanes so I'll be looking at a solution for that too, especially as we are still planning to be doing the Jim Clark at the end of May! You may remember my thread about master cylinder sizes last year, it's time to sort them out. On the penultimate stage the cockpit started to fill with white smoke to the extent that we were looking for marshals with extinguishers, but it didn't get any worse and there was no sign of a smoke trail behind - or flames! - so we continued. At service it was evident that it was all coming from the crankcase breather so a broken ring was suspected... well, I hate not finishing so we set off on the final stage with a gentle right foot and made it to the end. The guy behind in an Anglia hadn't caught us all day (hardly an historic...not with a Toyota 16v twin cam in it anyway!... but he did catch and pass us on the last stage and told us that although he realised there was something wrong with the TR he saw no smoke trail. Oh well, we got a finish at 35th and the TR was still running fairly strongly despite the problem. I hadn't expected to be competitive against modern rally cars with an historic spec TR4 of course, it was just a local event so ideal for a test run. The next day a compression test showed no.4 cylinder well down, but a friend who had been spectating told me it had been pinking loudly too. I couldn't hear it wearing a helmet! After a strip-down showed a broken ring as suspected, it also transpired that the ignition was way too far advanced at over 40 degrees btdc which was a mystery as the car had been set up on a rolling road with no problems: eventually it was discovered that the disi clamp was allowing it to turn a little at a time, but only when using high revs. It had a single-bolt clamp instead of the normal TR4 2-bolt one and was not gripping tightly enough at nearly 6000 rpm. At least it explained the broken ring so it's unlikely to happen again; TRE sorted it all in double-quick time and she's healthy again. I couldn't have wished for better customer care. New bits (and clamp!) have got it running as it should again and we are looking forward to the next rally, the Get it Sideways Stages on April 9th. It's another open airfield single venue with chicanes which was great fun last year so I'm hoping for a good run if they have booked the same dry, sunny weather again. A very good historic entry this time: we've got some Healey 3000-shaped competition in the over 2-litre class! A selection of photos can be seen on page 4 at: http://www.photoreflect.com/store/ThumbPage.aspx?e=7922311&g=1PXZ002708 ; at least it started nice clean and shiny!! However I'd rather you didn't see the embarassing video at http://www.madvideo.co.uk/page138.htm so please don't look....after a bit of sun the roads dried out a bit, then a light sprinkle of drizzle turned them into a skating rink with cars going off all over the place!!! That's my excuse and I'm sticking to it. Nigel Nigel Prep is king they should have spotted that? top marks they sorted it however one expensive event with I guess not a happy result Edited March 16, 2011 by ntc Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nigel 628 Posted March 16, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2011 Ah, the wisdom of hindsight, Neil! The new engine did over 400 road miles and a dyno session at up to 5000 rpm, then another 200 miles at times up to 5500 rpm. It was only on the rally, when you really start to use the performance to the full and I was using up to 6000 rpm, that it happened, and only a bit at a time throughout the rally. The clamp remained tight otherwise and the disi couldn't be moved. A mystery really, and one we hadn't heard of before. Would you have expected that to happen? The disi was nearly new and I used the clamp it was supplied with for TR4 use (not from TR Enterprises I must point out). As it was, TRE just took the car back, put everything right without any quibble and it was delivered back to me within three days by Steve Hall personally - from 80 miles away. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend TR Enterprises to anyone and am quite happy to let them continue to look after my car. Bear in mind that my TR4 is an out-and-out special stage rally car with a heavily-modified engine being taken well beyond its original design limits; if was used merely as a fast road car it wouldn't have happened. I mentioned the lousy brakes; the dual circuit bias adjustable master cylinder setup was supplied as a TR4 item(again, not by TRE) with 0.625" diameter cylinders which proved to be unsuitable. The brakes felt like the pads were made from mahogany! After I tried all sorts of different solutions last year, TRE recommended and supplied smaller diameter 14mm AP Racing master cylinders which I fitted today and hey presto the brakes are back! Great! Now I'm really looking forward to the next rally!!!!! Think we'll give that Healey 3000 a run for his money? Nigel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted March 16, 2011 Report Share Posted March 16, 2011 The new engine did over 400 road miles and a dyno session at up to 5000 rpm, then another 200 miles at times up to 5500 rpm. It was only on the rally, when you really start to use the performance to the full and I was using up to 6000 rpm, that it happened, and only a bit at a time throughout the rally. The clamp remained tight otherwise and the disi couldn't be moved. A mystery really, and one we hadn't heard of before. Would you have expected that to happen? The disi was nearly new and I used the clamp it was supplied with for TR4 use (not from TR Enterprises I must point out). Now I'm really looking forward to the next rally!!!!! Think we'll give that Healey 3000 a run for his money? Nigel Now you see why Triumph used a two bolt clamp. Most early Tr`s were raced and rallied and built for it. You shouldnt have too much trouble with the Healeys if there are plenty of twisty bits Stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graycow Posted March 17, 2011 Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Am I missing something? I understand the possibility of the disi moving since I have had it happen myself. But I don't understand the reference to a two bolt clamp. Yes, there are two bolts attaching the clamp to the block, but only one actually applying the force and it is at this point that the slippage can occur. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted March 17, 2011 Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Ah, the wisdom of hindsight, Neil! The new engine did over 400 road miles and a dyno session at up to 5000 rpm, then another 200 miles at times up to 5500 rpm. It was only on the rally, when you really start to use the performance to the full and I was using up to 6000 rpm, that it happened, and only a bit at a time throughout the rally. The clamp remained tight otherwise and the disi couldn't be moved. A mystery really, and one we hadn't heard of before. Would you have expected that to happen? The disi was nearly new and I used the clamp it was supplied with for TR4 use (not from TR Enterprises I must point out). As it was, TRE just took the car back, put everything right without any quibble and it was delivered back to me within three days by Steve Hall personally - from 80 miles away. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend TR Enterprises to anyone and am quite happy to let them continue to look after my car. Bear in mind that my TR4 is an out-and-out special stage rally car with a heavily-modified engine being taken well beyond its original design limits; if was used merely as a fast road car it wouldn't have happened. I mentioned the lousy brakes; the dual circuit bias adjustable master cylinder setup was supplied as a TR4 item(again, not by TRE) with 0.625" diameter cylinders which proved to be unsuitable. The brakes felt like the pads were made from mahogany! After I tried all sorts of different solutions last year, TRE recommended and supplied smaller diameter 14mm AP Racing master cylinders which I fitted today and hey presto the brakes are back! Great! Now I'm really looking forward to the next rally!!!!! Think we'll give that Healey 3000 a run for his money? Nigel Nigel Indeed it is,however Steve knows his stuff and also your rr man should? the clamp could not have been flat and must have been over tightend? glad you are now sorted Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nigel 628 Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 (edited) I'm with Greycow. The bolt fixing the clamp to the block stops the clamp and disi from rotating or lifting out and one bolt can do this as well as two. There's very little force on them in that role, but considerable force from the disi on the clamp at high revs. After all, the same Lucas distributor is used on many other engines of the period with one bolt clamps using even more revs than my TR without problems. BMC A and B series engines for example, where both types of clamp are commonly used. I've had two bolt clamps distort as well as single bolt ones when I was rallying Minis long ago, but they still gripped the disi OK! Perhaps the clamp was of a poor quality, though supplied new with the Lucas distributor. It was just one of those things, it's sorted now. Stranger things have happened in motorsport! On to the next event. Speaking of which...... Nigel Edited March 18, 2011 by Nigel 628 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graycow Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I'd rather you didn't see the embarassing video at http://www.madvideo.co.uk/page138.htm so please don't look.... I'm impressed, you have somehow rigged my computer so that I can't look..... It won't display the video --- nice sounds however Graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.