sandandlime
-
Content Count
71 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Calendar
Posts posted by sandandlime
-
-
Hi Ash,
I don't know what caused the crank to break, we were only cruising gently for a couple of nights away, but I suspect that it was either just old age or dodgy machining from the last rebuild (perhaps square rather than rounded corners to the journals? I'll inspect when the broken one returns here).
The engine is being sorted by TR Enterprises so should be good for another few years. No high-performance mods just a good sensible touring engine.
Fortunately, our Alvis TA14 is still running very nicely so classic days out still on the calendar (although after all the rain and cold it's a tad too hot now in the daytime!).
-
Mine was a broken crank.
Mine was also a broken crank. So I suppose that does count as terminal damage.The sound if it comes though right is terminal damage sorry
Drove around 150 km back home afterwards - very, very gently. Still maintained around 30/40 psi oil pressure at 15-1800 rpm.
Decided to ship the car back to the UK rather than rebuild/machine here. Should, hopefully, be back towards the beginning of next month. TR saved but wallet still shaking!
-
Oak block installed between crank and block followed by the use of 3/4" drive socket and tommy bar. A quick smack with te palm of my hand and off it came!
Unfortunately, the timing chain and tensioner was still within serviceable limits :-(
So pretty much only left with bigger problems.
-
Thanks chaps! I'll give it a go (once I've done my other weekend chores of course).
Cheers,
Tony
-
I've been thinking about my nasty rattle and going through the likely culprits again. I'd almost committed myself to lifting the engine out for a complete strip down to find the source of the problem - that of course would almost inevitably lead to what I currently believe would be an unwarranted rebuild.
So before finally going thta far I'd like to check out the timing chain tensioner as Andrew suggested. I had a quick look at doing that yesterday evening and was quickly thwarted.
Given that the head is off how do you undo the crankshaft pulley nut? My thoughts are to either put a wooden block onto one of the piston crowns and clamp it down using the cylinder head bolts or to wedge the crank against the block from underneath with a pry bar. Neither method is very elegant.
Any suggestions for the best approach welcomed.
Thanks guys,
Tony
-
Hello, had my resident engineers listen and there is a very strong view it maybe timing, good luck, Andrew
Hi Andrew,
Unfortunately, I don't think it's the timing chain/tensioner - although it may also be an issue!
I didn't have the opportunity to get back onto it until today. After much prevarication I opted to drop the sump and see if anything obvious showed-up. Nothing apparent but there is small amount of 'gold glitter' in the oil on the bottom of the sump. Not much perhaps only 50 to 100 grains and very small at that. Can't feel them between my fingers and no larger than 0.25 mm diameter.
I removed the cap and bearing to No 1 cylinder and that was all intact without damage. Need longer arms than mine to lift he prison out of the top of the bore whilst pushing from the bottom so haven't checked it's little end bush yet. I did note a small amount of ridging on he crankshaft journal though so it's probably necessary to regrind the crank. Oil pressure has always been fine however.
Given the likelihood of crankshaft machining I decided to alter tack and go the engine out route. I've got the radiator, starter and alternator out but the rest will have to wait unil Saturday. At the moment I'm suspicious of little end issues.
Hey ho :-(
Tony
-
One thing that I noticed this afternoon was that No. 1 piston was not concentric in the bore with less clearance on the front of the engine. The others were noticably better aligned. Noi bore damage or marking.
Significant or coincidence? I'm not sure.
-
Hi Tony,sorry for Piggybacking your Thread but the 2 Problems seem the same.
Any Result from your Problem yet.
No need to apologise and I'm pleased that your problem has been identified so quickly.
I've removed the head but haven't seen anything awry at this stage, which doesn't bode so well.
Currently I'm debating with myself whether to drop the sump and look at bottom ends from there or if it would be better just to bite the bullet, get the engine out and strip it completely. To be frank I don't really want to that but neither do I want to be here again in a couple of months. On top of that, took the Alvis to a local car club run yesterday morning only to have the top hose start to spray under the bonnet. No great shakes other than the time taken to source a replacement, which I think that I've just managed to achieve.
I'll let you know what I find once I decide what to do!
Cheers,
Tony (in full prevarication mode)
-
Have a look at the exhaust manifold to head gaskets, ... my 4A sounded a bit like that when it sprang a leak, thought it was a valve or cam follower gone, very relieved to find the hole in the gasket as I began to take it to bits.
cheers Rob
Thanks for the tip Rob. I got the head off this evening but haven't looked at anything beyond the immediately obvious yet.
I'm off to a local classic car meet tomorrow morning but shoud be able to find a bit of time in the afternoon to probe a bit further.
bfn,
Tony
-
Did you do a compression check yet?
Cheers
Peter W
That was one of the first things we did. Plugs out and spun-up on the starter. More variable than I would like with 2 & 3 at 185 psi 1 & 4 at 165. Not sure why but the battery wasn't happy by the time we'd finished.
My earlier comment about the oil leak was just me being a t**t. It was splash over from the back of the rocker box where it had been running without a cover or with it just loosely in place.
-
Just generally poking around this afternoon looking at all the easy fixes. I haven't found anything. Bonnet and grill off for better access and coolant draining as I write.
One thing that I have seen though is that there is a fair amount of oil draining down around the engine/ gearbox joint. It's coming from somewhere higher up but exactly where I can't see yet. This leak was not there beforehand so may be significant. We'll see.
-
Tony
Roger has made a good point about the front pulley coming loose, so I'd try that first./quote]
Unfortunately, I have already removed the fan belt without making anything quieter but yes I'll have a look at things that are more readily accessible before getting the engine out.
I really don't want to go there as I'm already struggling to find time to to finish jobs already in progress. Had to change a headlamp unit on our C4 daily drive yesterday after the bulb came loose and melted the holder. Only required removing most of the front end. Couldn't believe that the headlamp actually provides support to the front wing! No wonder I prefer classics!
Tony
-
Thanks to all for the feedback and suggestions.
One of the rocker clearances was a tad on the large size, especially considering that they had been set in within the last 150 miles. So it may indicate a problem.
I think that what I'll do is to start by taking the head off to inspect the valves and pushrods and take it fom there. I have also considered just dropping the sump and disconnecting the con-rods from underneath but am not too sure about being able to get everything back properly from underneath - it all feels a lot easier with the block mounted on a stand.
First of all though I have to face up to the task of tidying and cleaning my workbench.
I'll report back how I get on.
Thanks again,
Tony
-
As Pete suggested I've made a short video of the engine running and the knocking is quite clear (she also sounds a bit tappety but that's just because the rocker cover is just loosely placed to reduce oil splash). The video is a bit wobbly but it's the sound that's important.
The offending sound is here
Any guesses?
I had already removed the fan belt to isolate the water pump and alternator but hadn't considered the pulley so will go and have a look at that one.
Yes Mick, there is a dent in the sump but I don't think that it's deep enough to cause the problem (I think that it has been there for some time). With the fan belt removed I was not inclined to run her up to temperature and restart to see if the note changes again but I did feel that the knock lessened when the throttle was blipped. I don't believe that there is any noticeable oil pressure drop, although it was difficult to be sure on my very gentle return journey when I nursed her the 80 miles back home at 40 to 45 mph. Now, From cold in the garage the pressure is over 80 at 1200 to 1500 rpm.
If there's anyway the knock can be addressed without too much work I'd be a very happy man. I've already spent quite a while sorting out various irritations and Ludo is now not too popular with my wife!
Thanks again,
Tony
-
Mine was a broken crank.
Gee! Thanks Ash. I've got that warm fuzzy feeling all over now!
-
Any chance of a video/sound recording of the offending noise Tony? Also it's sort of a consensus, and particularly if you're attending to both, that engine and gearbox out as one is the way to go.
Hi Pete,
Thanks for the quick reply.
I did think of recording the knock but thought that asking for it to be diagnosed was probably clutching at far too many straws. I am more than happy to give it a go though. It won't be until later this afternoon though as I got to take my lad into town and run a couple of errands.
My concern about having the gearbox attached was the overall length of the thing but at least I suppose that it will hang at the right angle on the hoist.
Thanks again,
Tony
-
Hi chaps,
Went down south for a post winter run a few weeks ago. En route, and after about 50 miles, an unpleasant knocking sound became very noticeable. Okay, so pulled over and stuck my head under the bonnet to see what it could be but couldn't identify the issue there and then. Strangely coincident was the fact that less than 10 miles before I'd smacked fairly hard into a rubber speed bump - Ludo's exhaust is very low and I should have crossed it square rather than two wheels on two wheels off. Because of this my first thoughts was that the issue must be related to the bump but given that the sound was very evident with the engine running but not moving I can't see what it could have been. Anyway, cutting a long story short, I got back home and put her up in the air for investigation.
That was around four weeks ago now (I still had various bits of over winter work to finish on our Alvis and didn't want I start Ludo until the Alvis was up and running). So had a proper look around underneath Ludo a couple of days ago and can't see anything amiss, just a bit of scraping on the bottom of the exhaust. Started her up again and the knocking was very much still present. Couldn't work out where it was coming from but ruled out timing chain, water pump and alternator. I'm a bit suspicious about cam followers but am just guessing really. One thing that I did notice was that the sound wasn't too bad initially but having stopped the engine and restarted it whilst still hot the knocking was noticeably worse. So, I think that there's little choice but to take the engine out and strip it down to find the source of the problem.
Given, that I also have a couple of irritating oil leaks from the overdrive unit which I'd like to deal with is it better to remove the engine with the gearbox/overdrive unit attached or should I go for engine first gearbox second?
Any thoughts very welcome - particularly those that solve the knocking noise with the engine in place!
TIA,
Tony
-
AFIK it should be dished down to sit in the body of the PCV.
Well that's the way that it is now.
To my, admittedly not very good eyes, the WSM shows it the other way up with a dished cap. I tried to think what would happen to the diaphragm as it became pressurised but failed to sort it out when my brain became too full of cotton wool. Either way, it's better now so I'll probably leave it as it is.
Tony
-
Just to close this thread, I am pleased to say that I think that I might have finally got her sorted.
I was a bit preoccupied last week and didn't get chance to adjust anything until Friday afternoon. At this time, and after an early trip around the Angoulême circuit before it was fully closed off, it was apparent that the building of revs was still an issue. By 8:00 pm I still hadn't got anywhere but decided to finish for the day as I was beginning to lose it.
Saturday, after a few adjustments and a short test drive showing mild improvement I had an idea. Three adjustments seem to have finally got me on the right track:
The long throttle linkage was adjusted to provide greater length and more elongation on the bulkhead return spring
The timing was retarded a couple of degrees
The jets were set back to 40 thou below the bridge, as suggested many times by Ash and others.
After our 350 km run on Sunday, involving quite a lot of low speed, low gear work and a couple of blasts along the motorway at 80 mph I can report that she performed admirably. An inspection of the plugs on our return suggested that all in all things are pretty much as they should be.
Thanks to all again for all the pointers and generally useful advice.
Tony
I forgot. There was one more thing I did which was to invert the diaphragm on the PCV. I'm not sure which way up it should be. The WSM shows a dished cap and the diaphragm shaped to fit. Mine has a flat cover plate, so should the diaphragm be dish up or down?
-
Thanks for the suggestions Neil, Stuart, Graeme. That gives me something to get stuck into. I've spent most tie just exploring fr air leaks but without finding anything definitive either way.
All I need to do now is to shrink my hands (maybe remove an excess of fingers?) so that I can access all these places! Attachment of the bulkhead spring seems better suited to someone with an exta joint in their wrist.
Tony
-
The cam or cr should make no difference, you have weak springs or you have air getting in
Or even both both, Neil!
I'm less sure than I was about air leaks occurng somewhere for no other reason than I'm running out of ideas.
I really like your suggestion wrt sprng arrangement Stuart. And yes, what you've shown is exactly what I have. It is, however, the lack of energy in the linkage that seems most perplexing but I'm not sure exactly how lively or otherwise it should be.
I'm hoping that I can get back onto Ludo Thursday/Friday; I seem to have become a full-time mechanic at the moment. Four pairs of brake shoes removed from our Alvis today and dispatched for relining. Next on the list is engine/gearbox mounts. Don't you just love being upside down with *r*p dropping in your eyes! I would put this to one side but my wife wants her back on the road in time for the impending arrival of relations frm Australia. Your wish is etc...
Thanks to all again. I'll be back!
Tony
-
Morning Alec,
I totally agree with what your comments and, in general, the way she is set-up is overall pretty good.
The rally is more 'touristique' than performance, which is fine for me. The only (and I hesitate to use that word as I know that another gremlin will raise its head at the most in opportune moment) issue is when the idle revs build to 1300 or so and I'm trying to get through a town centre without skittling too many bystanders.
We have thougt that the best way to set her up is on a rolling road again but, as far as im aware, there is a bit of a dearth of such things in these parts. Probably even more of a dearth of people who understand the subtleties of SU carbs. But I will keep looking.
In the meantime, it's back to ears and screwdrivers!
All the best,
Tony
-
Stuart is spot on and another symptom is having the jets lower than the 40 thou down they would have been originally. Wear on the butterfly spindles and in the holes lets more air through and you have to drop the jets slightly to compensate.
Well, as I said in my earlier thread the jets are most definitely lower than 40 thou. My tickover is also normally around 900/950, as suggested by TR4Tony who was responsible for her 'mild modifications'. As far as I'm aware, he never measured the jet height but had her set-up for max power on a rolling road, so I don't have a sensible benchmark figure to start from. Unlike Tony, I'm not looking for max power at 4500 - 5500 so the lower end of the range is more critical to me.
I have sprayed a couple of volatile aerosols onto the spindles but haven't observed any noticeable change, although I can't say that I've ever achieved a particularly steady idle speed. On the basis of ruling things in or out, I will repeat the process again next week just to be certain. Given that I'm committed to a rally of around 350 km next Sunday,I might just have to live with this 'feature' for a bit longer than I'd like.
Thanks again,
Tony
-
Well I've been looking in close detail this afternoon at what's going on. I can't say that I've got to the bottom of it but I may be onto something with the linkages (or it may just be a red herring?).
I removed the throttle pedal return spring and was surprised to find that it was much stronger than I had previously thought. However, the whole linkage assembly seems just very 'dead', and stodgy. It just doesn't pull back. Whilst the spring is pretty tough, it just doesn't seem man enough to balance the whole linkage assembly.
I wonder if its just a question of throttle linkage lengths? I've looked back through the forum to see what has been said before about throttle linkage lengths and haven't found anything specific, either in the forum or the WSM. For good or bad, I have tried extending the long control rod to extend the bulkhead spring and introduce a bit more tension but with not a great deal of success. (it also had the effect of dropping the height of the pedal considerably so is probably not the best approach.
So, does anyone have any tips for the correct linkage setup?
Hi Menno,
Good idea to try lifting the pedal. I'll give it a go and see what happens. Given that it's often pretty hot this far south, it might also be a good idea for me to buy/make a heat shield for the carbs so I'll look into that.
Thanks to all again.
Tony
Tick Over
in TR4/4A Forum
Posted
I struggled with this one. Chased it around for what seemed like ages trying to fix non-existent air leaks, adjust linkages, double-up on springs etc. I recently had a blinding flash of inspiration about the troublesome problem and concluded that it was caused by the distributor advance weights/springs. It did indeed seem to be the case. No long-term test though as my crankshaft broke and tickover became the least of the issues!
Worth a look.
Cheers,
Tony