Black Forest TR3A Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 When posting the cover of the Olyslager book (https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/78998-tr3-badged-tr3a/&tab=comments#comment-747779) I noticed that the TR3A on the cover photograph has a TSOA badge on his front bumper. Close examination shows, that this badge is quite unusual with an additional chromed part. The car is VYM 429, TS 38141, a Standart Motor Co. (London) demonstrator car (Piggott, Triumph By Name, p. 272). Because TS38141 is not far away from my TS40###L I bought an original Standart Triumph press department photograph of this car. On this picture one can see, that the badge is the usual TSOA badge in black/red (like in the color pic), but with an additional badge with - on the left - LONDON (?); the letters on the right are unreadible... Does anybody know this kind of badge? Cheers Christian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 I have this one, but no information about it. Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malcolm Tatton Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 The badge says 'LONDON SECTION' and appears to be an add on. Apparently made by J Fray Ltd of Birmingham, who are no longer about. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Charlie D Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 8 minutes ago, Malcolm Tatton said: J Fray Ltd of Birmingham, I think this company made badges for just about every car company in the UK in the 1960's and 70's (If not before.) Charlie. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james christie Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 (edited) I don’t believe this badge is uncommon. I recall seeing one for the first time on a scruffy TR3 in the snow in the High Wycombe station car park in the late sixties/early seventies. I have seen a few more since then Others, more knowledgeable than I, will tell you more of the origins of the TSOA james Edited December 13, 2021 by james christie Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dic Doretti Posted December 13, 2021 Report Share Posted December 13, 2021 J Fray of Birmingham made the original badges for the Swallow Doretti. Cheers Richard Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 A couple of pics of the later Blue/White version for reference Ade Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Forest TR3A Posted December 14, 2021 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 23 hours ago, Malcolm Tatton said: The badge says 'LONDON SECTION' and appears to be an add on. Apparently made by J Fray Ltd of Birmingham, who are no longer about. Hello Malcolm, thank you very much for this information! Yes, obviously it's an add on. As it fits on the TSOA badge perfectly I agree that it's probably made by Fray. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Forest TR3A Posted December 14, 2021 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 23 hours ago, Lebro said: I have this one, but no information about it. Bob Hello Bob, this is an early example, and the badge shown by Ade is a late one (well, an early late one). I have a collection of these TSOA badges (some are shown in the pic), and in my view the pic shows all the different types (casting and/or color) that existed. Main differences are: Smooth surface (early; end of 50ies and 60ies, perhaps 70ies) to rough surface (late 70ies and 80ies until now) MADE IN ENGLAND on foot: without: early, black/red (up to January 1959). Black/red badges (not repainted) are ALLWAYS without MADE IN ENGLAND (as far as I know). without: early, blue/white (from January 1959, only a short time); very rare! with: ALLWAYS blue/white, 60ies, perhaps 70ies; if it's white/blue: repainted. Rough surface, MADE IN ENGLAND on foot : Later, second series, produced by Fray. Allways white/blue (or unpainted). If black/red, red/black, blue/white: repainted. Codes on the back of the Badge, not on the back of the foot. I think it's not contemporary to the "real" TSOA. Badge 5 in the pic is a copy of the second Fray series: slightly bigger, back is totally different. I know only this one. If someone has any information, please let me know... So even if there's only the foot left, you can tell which casting the missing rest was Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Forest TR3A Posted December 14, 2021 Author Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 Just found this lot in ebay: https://www.ebay.com/itm/384480403381?hash=item5984d15fb5:g:vfYAAOSwKmphggnk If it's genuine and the three items (badge white/blue, handbook with white/blue, newsletter of October 1973 with blue/white) belong together, the second series was in use by 1973 and the sign of the TSOA was either blue/white or white/blue... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 (edited) When I worked for BMH we were required to rescue pressure die cast tooling that was deemed to be relevant or property of the marquess we controlled from Fray, when the business went into administration. I recall saving the tools that made that badge ( along with many others) from the scrap dealer. Where those tools are now or who has ownership of them I do not know. Edited December 14, 2021 by BlueTR3A-5EKT Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 (edited) The man at Fray said they shipped the badges chrome only. The paint colouring was done locally in USA. https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Joseph_Fray Edited December 14, 2021 by BlueTR3A-5EKT Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 Mine seems to be a mixture of red / black & blue / white ! Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 14, 2021 Report Share Posted December 14, 2021 17 minutes ago, Lebro said: Mine seems to be a mixture of red / black & blue / white ! Bob Your’s is off a TR23 Bob Ade Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ian Vincent Posted December 15, 2021 Report Share Posted December 15, 2021 Mine was chrome when I picked it up along with a bunch of other stuff on eBay. I painted it blue and white. Rgds Ian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 15, 2021 Report Share Posted December 15, 2021 (edited) I believe this to be an original early TSOA handbook for my 1955 TR2. It also contains all the cars service history, hand written in the back from 1955 onwards; including rotation of tyres, warranty work etc. I love the history of these cars. Thanks for starting this great post Christian Ade Edited December 24, 2021 by AJ2014 Text edit Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Black Forest TR3A Posted December 16, 2021 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2021 Hello Ade, nice papers! I have a TSOA handbook from the U.S.A., from 1960 or 1961. It gives very usefull informations! BTW: It states "TR-3A", like the Olyslager book. Perhaps interesting: It has hand written information of TS67242L: engine TS67426(?), EB 65462, Comm. 107298 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 17, 2021 Report Share Posted December 17, 2021 (edited) A great handbook Christian, thanks for sharing. Here’s a taster of the life of a brand new TR2 in 1955 in the hands of it’s first owner. The gearbox didn’t last very long lol !! Ade Edited December 24, 2021 by AJ2014 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 18, 2021 Report Share Posted December 18, 2021 17 hours ago, AJ2014 said: A great handbook Christian, thanks for sharing. Here’s a taster of the life of a brand new TR2 in 1955 in the hands of it’s first owner. The gearbox didn’t last very long lol !! Ade Some very interesting notes in the service book especially replacement gearbox very early on! Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 18, 2021 Report Share Posted December 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, stuart said: Some very interesting notes in the service book especially replacement gearbox very early on! Stuart. I thought you’d like that Stuart. There are pages and pages of it, bits failing and very regular servicing at approx 1000 mile intervals. I think this first owner must have been a boy racer haha! Ade Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 18, 2021 Report Share Posted December 18, 2021 Just now, AJ2014 said: I thought you’d like that Stuart. There are pages and pages of it, bits failing and very regular servicing at approx 1000 mile intervals. I think this first owner must have been a boy racer haha! Ade Engineering wasnt that good for the early cars hence why they changed so many things through the sidescreen car era. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted December 18, 2021 Report Share Posted December 18, 2021 Lots of work done under guarantee though. Which must have been reassuring. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 20, 2021 Report Share Posted December 20, 2021 Original ST guarantee Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DavidBee Posted December 23, 2021 Report Share Posted December 23, 2021 On 12/17/2021 at 7:18 PM, AJ2014 said: A great handbook Christian, thanks for sharing. Here’s a taster of the life of a brand new TR2 in 1955 in the hands of it’s first owner. The gearbox didn’t last very long lol !! Ade If you wish, Ade, I could upload all the pages into Bonanza (permanent resource) in TR Technical General. Then it becomes part of the TR Archive there. It seems very useful as a document. Kindest regards, David Brancaleone (aka DavidBee) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AJ2014 Posted December 23, 2021 Report Share Posted December 23, 2021 1 hour ago, DavidBee said: If you wish, Ade, I could upload all the pages into Bonanza (permanent resource) in TR Technical General. Then it becomes part of the TR Archive there. It seems very useful as a document. Kindest regards, David Brancaleone (aka DavidBee) No thank you David but thanks for asking. Regards Ade Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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