Stabilizer retrofit TR2

[Moliver]

Hi All,  

Just met a TR owner the other weekend who, was enthusiastically reporting about the stabilizer kit which he as attached to his TR3A. Significantly improves road performance of the car, he reported..

My TR is optical quite period but has enjoyed some beneficial modifications already (TR4A engine, steering, Kenlowe...).so I am always open to implement improving (but more or less invisible) features. Who has experience with the kit? Easy to install?

Any experience, input and advise welcome...

Cheers

Oliver

[harrytr5]

Perhaps he might allow you to drive his, then you will know, if both cars are the same spec apart from this mod.

Regards Harry

[Lebro]

It will limit how much the car rolls on corners, but also encourages understeer.  Fixed by fitting a rear one as well. (I did )

Bob.

[RobH]

What it will also do is reduce the ground clearance further. A standard trolley-jack won't go under it, you need one with a long low nose to reach the cross-member.  I suppose it does act as a sort of sump-guard though !

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

For my money the first item I would fit is Revington steering arms to reduce bump steer.   This is for cars with original steering box not one of the numerous after market rack kits, some that address the bmp steer and others that increase it…..

https://www.revingtontr.com/productimages/docs/00001701/is0050-tie-rod-levers-tr2-3b-issue-1.pdf

Second item is the bushed steering relay bar and idler assembly with bronze bushes.   Again Revington.  
 

I fitted a TR 6 front anti roll bar to my car some years ago and the surety on fast corners is reassuring.  That said I do have to ‘drive’ into corners   If I enter a corner without throttle applied the car feels as though it wants to fall over. ( oversteering?) A boot full of accelerator and the car levels out nicely.   Pumping the tyres up to 30 psi. (2 bar)  all round helps considerably.

[james christie]

I have to disagree with you RobH - I just went out to look at my 3A. I have Revington anti-sways/roll bars fore and aft. The front one is about 5mm above the radiator guard.

The clearance in the chassis area where you are supposed to lift with a jack remains (?) at 156mm

Whilst the result is not Lotus like, they seem to have substantially reduced roll and understeer

james

Edited September 13, 2021 by james christie

[RobH]

Disagree all you like James - I merely stated a fact for the one shown which I think is not a Revington one.  Mine came from Moss.  I can categorically state that what I said is true for that type, which I find to be an annoyance.   

Edited September 13, 2021 by RobH

[james christie]

RobHMy apologies for having got your back up (again)

I only relate my own experience

james

[RobH]

No James - my back is not up.  Sorry if the reply came across as that way, it's a limitation of the format I'm afraid.  

I do find it inconvenient that I cannot get a trolley jack under the front because the bar is in the way.  Neither can I easily get a jack to the chassis just behind the front wheel, because the wing is in the way - I usually have to resort to lifting the chassis a bit with a scissors jack to make access for the trolley jack.  Not ideal.

[Motorsport Mickey]

13 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

For my money the first item I would fit is Revington steering arms to reduce bump steer.   This is for cars with original steering box not one of the numerous after market rack kits, some that address the bump steer and others that increase it…..

https://www.revingtontr.com/productimages/docs/00001701/is0050-tie-rod-levers-tr2-3b-issue-1.pdf

Second item is the bushed steering relay bar and idler assembly with bronze bushes.   Again Revington.  
 

I fitted a TR 6 front anti roll bar to my car some years ago and the surety on fast corners is reassuring.  That said I do have to ‘drive’ into corners   If I enter a corner without throttle applied the car feels as though it wants to fall over. ( oversteering?) A boot full of accelerator and the car levels out nicely.   Pumping the tyres up to 30 psi. (2 bar)  all round helps considerably.

NOT oversteer...understeer or what happens when a front anti roll bar is fitted by itself... UNDERSTEER on steroids.

As you found, "a boot full of accelerator" balances the car. It does this by deforming the tyres on the rear axle (it wouldn't work on a front wheel drive vehicle) reducing their grip and increasing the steered wheels grip, steering you around the corner.

Look guys this is simple.

A car that from the manufacturer doesn't have a front anti roll bar will understeer, (manufacturers like that, the car doesn't enter the corner until the speed is scrubbed off enough for the tyres slip angle (not skid, the tyre carcass deforms loosing grip...hence understeering ) to reduce and represent the tyres footprint to the road...it's safe.

Driving a car without an anti roll bar and you enter a corner too fast, the car suspension at the front (independant) accepts the across car weight transfer from inside to outside of the corner loading the outside tyre carcass which deforms and looses grip...the car understeers whilst the speed is scrubbed off. When the loading of the footprint reduces the tyre regains grip and the car turns into the corner.

Favourite ways to counter ANY excess steering effect understeer OR oversteer,...pump up the tyres at the end which is showing the effect of...loosing grip. Go up in 2lb increments until you get the effect you want. Understeer...pump up the front, oversteer pump up the rear. The stiffer carcass of the tyre preserves the tyre footprint which returns grip to that end. 

Kas Kastner was an advocate of allowing the car to roll..."Flat ain't fast" was the Kastner viewpoint, and he adopted that process when Triumph won the Modified D section of the SCCA competing out of class using the new standard TR4a. "No anti roll bar fitted at the front...none was needed".

feb66 Kastner anti roll-highlight.pdf

 The front of the 4a was stiff enough, to balance the handling only a rear anti roll bar was needed, this increased across car rear stiffness deforming the tyre contact patch reducing the grip at the rear and neutralising the standard factory understeer.

You should always fit roll bars in pairs...front and rear, then by varing the stiffness you can balance the car, changing the stiffness alters the tyre carcass deformation and by that the grip. Couple this with reducing the factory "bump steer" (Triumph didn't do good handling...just cheap) and the handling will be transformed. I have a small article with photos (currently sent to over 140 members and counting, PM your e mail to me if you want a copy) showing easily and cheaply (about £1 in steel stock) how to measure and change the standard bump steer so that with your suitable suspension your car can be made to understeer or oversteer just by altering the toe in on the steering. Thus maximising the grip and controlability of cars driven on the limit, of course many will not want to take it here on road driven cars.

Not like this with Fangio drifting

Or even this

This winning race car that doesn't have ANY anti roll bars front or rear, just equalised front and rear roll centres and balanced spring rates.

Mick Richards

Edited September 14, 2021 by Motorsport Mickey

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

Off with the ARB then!

Hope my next reply will not be from a bush on the side of the M25 - M40 slip road……..

[John McCormack]

5 hours ago, RobH said:

Disagree all you like James - I merely stated a fact for the one shown which I think is not a Revington one.  Mine came from Moss.  I can categorically state that what I said is true for that type, which I find to be an annoyance.   

My recently fitted bar has had the same effect. PITA.