roy53 Posted July 18, 2021 Report Share Posted July 18, 2021 Avery lucky escape. As a luverly weekend promised i got the 5 out saturday morning but strugled to start. When i reversed out of the garage there was a large pool of fluid on the floor. Checked and it was petrol . Got under the car and it was the failure of the pipe that connects the PRV to the metering unit.151229 in the moss book. Now my PRV has been moved from the chassis into the boot the pipe connecting the PRV to the original union was of the flexible type metal braided with a rubber outer. A victim of the new fuel type i assume. Had changed the low pressure pipes for the new spec inside the boot but didn't give that one a thought. So 105 psi spray Lucky i was at home i guess and very lucky not to have had a fire ball. I have had my 5 for 45 years so yes old spec pipe. PLEASE CHECK YOURS OUT. Roy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted July 18, 2021 Report Share Posted July 18, 2021 3 hours ago, roy53 said: Avery lucky escape. As a luverly weekend promised i got the 5 out saturday morning but strugled to start. When i reversed out of the garage there was a large pool of fluid on the floor. Checked and it was petrol . Got under the car and it was the failure of the pipe that connects the PRV to the metering unit.151229 in the moss book. Now my PRV has been moved from the chassis into the boot the pipe connecting the PRV to the original union was of the flexible type metal braided with a rubber outer. A victim of the new fuel type i assume. Had changed the low pressure pipes for the new spec inside the boot but didn't give that one a thought. So 105 psi spray Lucky i was at home i guess and very lucky not to have had a fire ball. I have had my 5 for 45 years so yes old spec pipe. PLEASE CHECK YOURS OUT. Roy This is not good and with E10 on its way something has to be done ASAP Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 19, 2021 Report Share Posted July 19, 2021 Hi Roy, can you share a picture of the failed hose? Are the plies dis-bonded (hope that’s the correct word) from each other? Was the hose ever replaced in your 45 years ownership? My old hoses were very hard, although they had not seen fresh petrol, let alone E5/10 (the car was de-commissioned many years before I bought it in 2015). Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
roy53 Posted July 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2021 Changed when I moved the PRV from chassis in the 80s Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter V W Posted July 22, 2021 Report Share Posted July 22, 2021 (edited) Roy, the failed part should be a pipe not a hose. Peter Edited July 22, 2021 by Peter V W Edit Quote Link to post Share on other sites
roy53 Posted July 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2021 6 hours ago, Peter V W said: Roy, the failed part should be a pipe not a hose. Peter I agree and have fitted the solid pipe. This is what was offered at the time. Fitting the new solid one was a pain with all the bends. Next to change the flexible pipe at the metering unit. But have been reading the posts on these in the TR6 section Roy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DenisMc Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 Hi Roy/All, Thanks for the warning Roy. I have checked the pipe on my TR5 going from the PRV forward to the short braided flexible pipe that connects to the MU. The main pipe appears to be copper or a copper based alloy and is in good condition. On another matter, I have a petrol smell in the boot pretty well all of the time and have checked all of the connections and the hoses without finding a leak. A previous owner did a lot of work on this, including replacing the tank filler neck hose and fuel level sender gasket. I am suspicious of the flexible pipe that goes from the Bosch fuel pump to the PRV. It doesn't feel very substantial and I wonder if ethanol is leaching through it. I found a replacement pipe on the Rimmer Bros website (TGK125Q3) but it looks identical to the one I have fitted. Has anybody got any thoughts or advice here? Thanks, Denis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 Hi Denis, The odour can escape through the rubber of the rubber hoses. How old are yours and have you got the best quality. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DenisMc Posted July 30, 2021 Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 Hi Roger, Thanks for your reply. The hoses look pretty new. They are black rubber and have a white concentric reinforcement running through them. I can't access the car right now to see if there is any writing on them but what would you recommend? The last but one owner did a lot of work to try to stop the petrol smell and he concluded that the odour was coming through the pipes. Thanks, Denis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 30, 2021 Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 Hi Denis, have a look at Stuart's post on here Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
roy53 Posted July 30, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 Hello Dennis i replaced all my non pressure hoses as per Stuarts recommendation. The pressured pipe from pump to PRV is from Revington as i have fitted their PRV conversion which moved it from the chassis [ near the exhaust ] to the boot as TR6. My issue was that a flexible pipe had been used, PRV to pipe connection on the chassis had failed. Hopefully this may have been where my fuel smells came from. Have been chasing these for years. What worries me is the flexible pipe connected to the metering unit which i know is over 50 years old so old spec. Where do i get a replacement for this to update spec. Roy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DenisMc Posted July 30, 2021 Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 Roger, Thanks for the link to Stuart's post. Does anyone know of a source for the R14 hose? I did a quick Google but not much came up. Thanks, Denis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
John L Posted July 30, 2021 Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 Dont also rule out the drain plug in the fuel tank. its usually a fibre washer, difficult to get at from underneath, easier to take the tank out. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kenrow Posted July 30, 2021 Report Share Posted July 30, 2021 2 hours ago, DenisMc said: Roger, Thanks for the link to Stuart's post. Does anyone know of a source for the R14 hose? I did a quick Google but not much came up. Thanks, Denis Check out the TR 6 Forum, but it looks like there has been a rush on buying the hose... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Josh Posted August 4, 2021 Report Share Posted August 4, 2021 On 7/30/2021 at 6:45 PM, DenisMc said: Roger, Thanks for the link to Stuart's post. Does anyone know of a source for the R14 hose? I did a quick Google but not much came up. Thanks, Denis Denis, I would suggest using readily available R9 Vs R14. Both have a permeability rating of 15 g/m²/day, the key difference is that R9 is rated at 100PSI, whereas R14 is a lower pressure pipe, rated at 50PSI, not suited for injection usage. I have used R9 throughout my vehicle and petrol smells in the boot have.............. gone!!! Supplier who I used was Think Automotive in Ashford, Middlesex. I have no affiliation with them, but they know their hoses and fittings. Good luck Josh Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted August 4, 2021 Report Share Posted August 4, 2021 Consider Demon Tweeks https://www.demon-tweeks.com/uk/mocal-high-pressure-fuel-hose-611856/ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter V W Posted August 4, 2021 Report Share Posted August 4, 2021 Don’t forget about the end fittings for the hose, that is the problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted August 5, 2021 Report Share Posted August 5, 2021 15 hours ago, Josh said: Denis, I would suggest using readily available R9 Vs R14. Both have a permeability rating of 15 g/m²/day, the key difference is that R9 is rated at 100PSI, whereas R14 is a lower pressure pipe, rated at 50PSI, not suited for injection usage. Good luck Josh You can get R14 with suitable pressure range for PI. https://www.gates.com/gb/en/search.p.4219-000000-000003.v.4219-06038.html Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DenisMc Posted August 6, 2021 Report Share Posted August 6, 2021 Thank you all very much for your helpful suggestions. When I get the time I shall look at the current low pressure hoses to see if there is a specification marked on them. That will enable me to hopefully establish what specification the current hoses are. I shall also check the tank drain! Regards, Denis Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DenisMc Posted August 13, 2021 Report Share Posted August 13, 2021 (edited) Hi All, Regarding the smell of petrol in the boot I managed to have a look at my TR5 this afternoon. I took some photos of the fuel hoses, which are attached. The hose from the tank outlet to the Bosch fuel filter appears to be to SAE J30 R6. The front of the hose is embossed 2011 and 09, which is probably the date of manufacture, whilst if you look at the photo of the rear of the hose taken using a mirror it is marked SAE J30 R6. You have to read the backwards image I'm afraid, but it is possible! The other hose shown is from the PRV back to the top of the tank. The tank is a non standard stainless steel tank which has a connection for this on the top. In photo 1 you can see that is is supposedly suitable for Leaded and Unleaded petrol and in photo 2, 938 - 10 is marked. I suspect that this hose is not to R9 specification either. Therefore, going by the useful advice you have given me it would seem worth changing both hoses to the R9 specification to try to eliminate the petrol smell. Regards, Denis Edited August 14, 2021 by DenisMc Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aldpilot Posted August 13, 2021 Report Share Posted August 13, 2021 Peace of mind. Change to what Stuart has recommended. A few pounds to protect a valuable car makes sense to me, especially as it’s an easy thing to do. Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JohnC Posted August 14, 2021 Report Share Posted August 14, 2021 On the subject of fuel smell, I don't know if the TR5 has a similar problem to the TR6, but on the '6 any non-standard exhausts (e.g. "wheelbarrow) can cause petrol smells. May be caused by the flat tail on the '6, but worth thinking about if you have a sports exhaust. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted August 14, 2021 Report Share Posted August 14, 2021 20 hours ago, DenisMc said: Hi All, Regarding the smell of petrol in the boot I managed to have a look at my TR5 this afternoon. I took some photos of the fuel hoses, which are attached. The hose from the tank outlet to the Bosch fuel filter appears to be to SAE J30 R6. The front of the hose is embossed 2011 and 09, which is probably the date of manufacture, whilst if you look at the photo of the rear of the hose taken using a mirror it is marked SAE J30 R6. You have to read the backwards image I'm afraid, but it is possible! The other hose shown is from the PRV back to the top of the tank. The tank is a non standard stainless steel tank which has a connection for this on the top. In photo 1 you can see that is is supposedly suitable for Leaded and Unleaded petrol and in photo 2, 938 - 10 is marked. I suspect that this hose is not to R9 specification either. Therefore, going by the useful advice you have given me it would seem worth changing both hoses to the R9 specification to try to eliminate the petrol smell. Regards, Denis If your hose says: “Suitable for unleaded fuel”, I would replace it. The hose that became soft on my car had that also printed on the hose and was R6 spec. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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