Hi Torque Starter

[Richardtr3a]

I have a new modern starter on my 3A and have a problem. At first I thought that the battery was low but after an overnight charge, the solenoid clicks once and then nothing at all. The sun is out here in Sussex and the starter will be out before lunch.

Is there any repair/service that i can do ?

Thanks  Richard & B

[RogerH]

Hi Richard,

What make is the SM and how old.

are you powering it via the original solenoid?

If so is this delivering all the volts to the motor.?

Are ALL the connections clean  - battery +/-,   power cable to solenoid,   the connections on the starter motor. Te negative cables on the bulkhead and chassis/engine.

Can you hold the starter motor in a vice and power it from a battery.  This should show if it is working or not.

Inside the SM is another starter solenoid. It looks like a round copper disc (mine did) and can get quite burnt. I believe they are replaceable.

 

Roger

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

You can get at the starters own solenoid and contact disc from under the car.  No need to take the starter off   Unless you have some ridiculous exhaust manifold that restricts access  

disconnect battery!

  Take the plate off (couple of screws) remove the contact disc and clean it  and the contact tabs with wet and dry.  Spray with contact cleaner.

  Refit.   

This has worked for me on two peoples starters recently.   Just corroded contacts.

Peter W

 

image of which screws to undo below

 

 

 

Edited February 28, 2021 by BlueTR3A-5EKT

[Lebro]

Before doing any of that I would do a few more basic checks. turn on the headlights, operate the starter - do the headlights stay on or go dim ?

if the latter, then check battery connections.  if they seem OK, then if you have a volt meter, connect it to the battery  DIRECTLY & repeat. if the volts drop considerably, Then the battery is the problem.

If on the 1st test the headlights stay bright, then next check is wiring to the solenoid, again a voltmeter required to measure volts between chassis, & the starting terminal (small one) on the starter motor. if that goes to 12V (or thereabouts) then problem is in the starter.

Even if the contact disc is not right, you should still get a "click" from it.

Bob.

[Mick Forey]

Having read the article in TR Action, I would also check your earth strap and connections. Do the simple test Mike Jennings's recommended to measure if you have any earthing issues and if so, where.

Mick

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

1 hour ago, Lebro said:

Before doing any of that I would do a few more basic checks. turn on the headlights, operate the starter - do the headlights stay on or go dim ?

if the latter, then check battery connections.  if they seem OK, then if you have a volt meter, connect it to the battery  DIRECTLY & repeat. if the volts drop considerably, Then the battery is the problem.

If on the 1st test the headlights stay bright, then next check is wiring to the solenoid, again a voltmeter required to measure volts between chassis, & the starting terminal (small one) on the starter motor. if that goes to 12V (or thereabouts) then problem is in the starter.

Even if the contact disc is not right, you should still get a "click" from it.

Bob.

Good point.

I had made the assumption that Richard had been starting his TR and driving it in and out of the garage.

[ianc]

The solenoid can fail, either completely or - more annoyingly - partially.  In the latter case, it may click but fail to close its internal contact, which means that if would fail to deliver power to the starter motor.  I came across just such a case about 10 years ago on a TR4A belonging to a widow living in the same village.  With a new solenoid, all was restored to working order.

BTW, if the solenoid's contact is worn out, pushing its knob (assuming yours has a knob!), may still fail to establish a decent contact.

Ian Cornish

[2long]

I had a similar issue and it was solved after cleaning connections and following Peter W’s advice. The three Phillips head screws holding the access plate are shown on this photo:

cheers

Dan

 

[valvebounce]

I have one of those starters fitted and I have found that the solenoid does stick sometimes, especially if it's been left for a long time. Do you see your ammeter shoot up when you turn the key?

A few taps on the outside with a hammer has always got mine going. I've never had to take it off (probably should!).

[Richardtr3a]

Thanks for all the advice.

I have cleaned all contacts and the solenoid in the starter was making a click. I ran a jump start cable from the battery direct to the engine as a new earth and the click was louder but still no action. The earthing article in TRaction, 327,  advised to use zinc plated bolts for the earthing strap.  Mine are all stainless steel.  Is there a problem with s/s.? My existing earth runs from the chassis 2 bolt fixing plate on the bracing 45 degree strut by the front suspension to the coil fixing on the side of the engine. Would the earthing be improved if I added a second lead from the body to the engine lifting loop on the side of the timing cover. I was thinking of a bolt through the inner wing below the horn and making sure that all paint is removed at the point of contact. So earthing straps x2.

This morning I packed up the starter  and sent it back to the suppliers who agreed to look and see what they could do. Wednesday should see an answer. 

Thanks for the pictures Peter and 2Long. They are very useful but I do not find it easy to lie under the car on a jack and finding the axle stands etc. is a problem. So in the end it is off the car and in the post to Letchworth. Two years ago there was a very helpful local welder Neil Rivet who had a workshop in Holmes Hill . He cut the corner off my gearbox tunnel and welded a plate with captive nuts so it could be attached and removed easily. Taking out the whole tunnel is always a long job and the new access panel works very well. Access to the bolts is easy and the starter can be slipped down beside the exhaust and on to the ground.

Thanks Richard & B

[Ralph Whitaker]

8 hours ago, Richardtr3a said:

Thanks for all the advice.

I have cleaned all contacts and the solenoid in the starter was making a click. I ran a jump start cable from the battery direct to the engine as a new earth and the click was louder but still no action. The earthing article in TRaction, 327,  advised to use zinc plated bolts for the earthing strap.  Mine are all stainless steel.  Is there a problem with s/s.? My existing earth runs from the chassis 2 bolt fixing plate on the bracing 45 degree strut by the front suspension to the coil fixing on the side of the engine. Would the earthing be improved if I added a second lead from the body to the engine lifting loop on the side of the timing cover. I was thinking of a bolt through the inner wing below the horn and making sure that all paint is removed at the point of contact. So earthing straps x2.

This morning I packed up the starter  and sent it back to the suppliers who agreed to look and see what they could do. Wednesday should see an answer. 

Thanks for the pictures Peter and 2Long. They are very useful but I do not find it easy to lie under the car on a jack and finding the axle stands etc. is a problem. So in the end it is off the car and in the post to Letchworth. Two years ago there was a very helpful local welder Neil Rivet who had a workshop in Holmes Hill . He cut the corner off my gearbox tunnel and welded a plate with captive nuts so it could be attached and removed easily. Taking out the whole tunnel is always a long job and the new access panel works very well. Access to the bolts is easy and the starter can be slipped down beside the exhaust and on to the ground.

Thanks Richard & B

I think you have kind of answered your own question there Richard. It sounds like there is a suspect earth if the "click" improved by running the jump lead straight from the battery. I am not sure your mounting position for the earth lead is in the best place on that body mounting bolt, it might not be earthing to the body but only to the chassis through the bolt, and even if making contact with the reinforcing plate, that might not be making contact with the body. I prefer to run a length of battery cable from a gearbox bellhousing bolt directly to the battery earthing point on the body.

Ralph.

[Hamish]

11 minutes ago, Ralph Whitaker said:

 I prefer to run a length of battery cable from a gearbox bellhousing bolt directly to the battery earthing point on the body.

Ralph.

I have the same as Ralph. 
I have the front left earth stap from engine to chassis side of engine mount. But was looking a bit old when I fitted my uprated engine mounts ( a devil to get to) so fitted a long strap as Ralph describes.  As a belt and braces tho not due to an issue. It has the battery earth and this new one on the same body bolt. So it’s becoming my common earth.