Z320 Posted November 28, 2020 Report Share Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) Hi here, shure some of you know about my electric power steering project from 2 years ago. I've been told it was too complicated for mates without lathe and skills and so I gave some thoughts on it how it is possible to reduce the effort. Indeed I've got some ideas but it still will be no "I have two left hands" project. Main issue is: NO steering lock and using parts fof the old steering column (and my lovely hacksaw ). Looking foreward the christmas holiday I ordered another Renault Clio 2 unit and other bits and pieces. 2 days later 5 minutes later Ready to start! Ciao, Marco Edited November 28, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted November 28, 2020 Report Share Posted November 28, 2020 Ready to watch and learn! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Stagpowered Posted November 28, 2020 Report Share Posted November 28, 2020 Also looking forward to this. No steering lock on my TR250 anyway Neil Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted November 28, 2020 Report Share Posted November 28, 2020 Good luck with keeping the column strait, I know others who have tried and failed keeping the crush factor. But good luck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted November 28, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2020 OK, stripping the unit is already finished, next is to connect the outer steering shaft (3/4" = 19 mm) with the splined outgoing shaft of the unit (16.5 mm x 36 teeth). This Toyo Seiko Mitsubishi unit is very popular at the USA to add on buggies and all stuff of....what ever, so this is why you can buy this connector ready to bolt, "coupler" is the key word for a Google search. The 3/4" end (mouth) is always called for welding, I would never weld anything on a steerung shaft. So I recommend to use Loctite 270 or 638 and a 6 mm roll pin. Because I can make them my own I will do this, sketch and photos will follow. Ciao, Marco Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 3, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) Hi, this are my dimensions of the connector - if you want to make it your own, length and outside diameter you can vary. And this is how they look like, one end splined, one smooth Next I make of tube going through the bulkhead (and the flange), original is about 1 1/4 x 1/20" aluminium tube, I use steel, 145 mm long. You have to decide what bearing YOU want to use: if you use a TR-standard nylon or uprated POM steering column bush use a 32 x 1,0 mm steel tube, in this case you can also use the end cap and the original clamp to fix it on the bulkhead, I want to use a stronger needle bearing, the "suitable" I found is d=32x20 mm, so I use a 35 x 1,5 mm tube, with this diameter I have to make a suitable end cap (POM) and new clamp to fix it. Decide your own which way you go, but I cannot recommend to use a piece of the original soft aluminium tube. Ciao, Marco Edited December 3, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Geko Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 Watching Marco's porn always draws a smile on my face and reminds me of the sculpture German vs. British engineering throning on my desk. Note that UNF thread is stripped and I do have to wipe the rust once in a while, goes without saying Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 4, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 (edited) Hi Stef, nice sculpture, every day on your desk and in your view?!?! What is the story about, please? Ciao, Marco Edited December 4, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 5, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2020 (edited) Hi, with the tube ready its time to make the flange from a 3 - 5 mm sheet of steel. 3 mm is solid enough as long as you don't want to countersunk the screws - and I by accident I have some of them in my workshop. To countersunk 4 - 5 mm is needed because of the M8 countesunk head. Dimensions are like this. Inside diameter 35 mm or 32 mm according to the tube you use, holes diameter 8 mm in 66.20 mm distance, the outer shampe doesn't matter, you can make it simply squared or any other design you like. Ciao, Marco Edited December 5, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 15, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 15, 2020 Hi there, this is not christmas holiday now, so this a very slow project at this time... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 21, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2020 (edited) Hi, preparations are ready to start and to do some experiments, but first I want to check one thing to avoid any disappointment: From the one I made I know the Renault Clio 2 unit fits LHD TRs, but I'm not 100% shure about RHD TRs....I guess the answer is YES - but perphaps it is NO. I will tell you after having a closer look the next days, but perhaps someone of you already knows? Ciao, Marco Edited December 22, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 23, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2020 (edited) Hi, the amp meter was wrong connected so I had the put the cloves box out - a win-win-situation. My TR4A is a LHD but this is probably the position of the steering column on RHD TRs. As I assumed there is no chance to fit the unit with the electric motor turned to the left side. But it fits turned to the right side, not horizontal but about 30° turned clockwise. For this the bonnet release knob has to move but on the other hand the torque strap is very easy to fix from below on the bulkhead. What you have to know is, finally you can only put the unit in the car with the dashboard out because you can not stick it through anymore. Is there anybody out there who wants to go this way? Ciao, Marco Edited December 24, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jah Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, Z320 said: Hi Marco Please carry on we are watching. Bonnet pull is on the left on a r/h drive car Regards John Edited December 24, 2020 by jah Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 8 hours ago, jah said: Bonnet pull is on the left on a r/h drive car Only on a TR5 or 6 its on the right on TR4/4a Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) OK, this is what we need later several times, Loctite 638, this is to glue bearings in bearing seats in the case when the sseat is too wide, a gap is needed therefore. Who ever glued soemething not suitable together and tried to divide the parts again after some minutes knows how @§?%!!@ good it glues. This gave me the idea to glue the 3 mm flange on the tube - don't worry, just as an experiment, I will stress this later until it brakes. You can connect them by welding, but this in not my favorite: too dusty, no nice surface, no need for this. And welding will bend the tube in any direction - who ever knows or can control this... So I connected the next one by soft soldering, for a tube in a hole this is more than solid enought. Just make the surfaces rough with a sand paper and use extra flux. You see: the tin-solder mainly went through (I have to level this later). After cleaning with the rough side of a sponge and some petrol it looks like this, left soldered, right glued. Which is your choice: to weld, to solder or to glue? Ciao, Marco Edited December 24, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Motorsport Mickey Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 34 minutes ago, Z320 said: OK, this is what we need later several times, Loctite 638, this is to glue bearings in bearing seats in the case when the sseat is too wide, a gap is needed therefore. Who ever glued soemething not suitable together and tried to divide the parts again after some minutes knows how @§?%!!@ good it glues. This gave me the idea to glue the 3 mm flange on the tube - don't worry, just as an experiment, I will stress this later until it brakes. You can connect them by welding, but this in not my favorite: too dusty, no nice surface, no need for this. And welding will bend the tube in any direction - who ever knows or can control this... So I connected the next one by soft soldering, for a tube in a hole this is more than solid enought. Just make the surfaces rough with a sand paper and use extra flux. You see: the tin-solder mainly went through (I have to level this later). After cleaning with the rough side of a sponge and some petrol it looks like this, left soldered, right glued. Which is your choice: to weld, to solder or to glue? Ciao, Marco " Loctite 638, Who ever glued something not suitable together and tried to divide the parts again after some minutes knows how @§?%!!@ good it glues. " "I'm afeared that to try and pull them apart will rend the fabric of the universe and the time space continuum". Mick Richards Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, Motorsport Mickey said: "I'm afeared that to try and pull them apart will rend the fabric of the universe and the time space continuum". Yeah I know, did I forget to mention this? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 No problems for us with hot spanners Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 Hi Marco I'm no expert with glues other than epoxy but I'm not sure I'd trust glue over the long term as it might deteriorate with time. Solder soft and likely to crack and fail sooner or later if stressed. Welding probably best if you can avoid distortion which I think you are worried about. Maybe you could you sleeve the tube with a thick non ferrous inner tube to maintain the internal diameter, shape and disperse heat then weld the outside in short runs to further keep the heat down? Otherwise silver solder or brazing might be stronger than normal solder but the heat required to braze might be a problem in itself. Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JochemsTR Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 When welding is not possible, which would be the preferred method, brazing is #2. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 Hi Andy and Jochem, welding is also possible but is more effort, I will show you. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jah Posted December 24, 2020 Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 13 hours ago, stuart said: Only on a TR5 or 6 its on the right on TR4/4a Stuart. Forgot to write TR6 John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 24, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2020 (edited) From EZ-Powersteering I read they "simply" cut the steering column in pieces and fix the electric unit in between. To do this the question is where to cut? My plan is to let the end out of the tube about 110 mm, this is the length until the "slot" ends. Next is to determine the length of the steering column inside the 145 mm long tube reaching in the coupling. This is about 115 mm. So the column reaches through the bulkhead 145 mm + 110 mm = about 255 mm - from the point when unit touches the mounting bracket, which is welded on the bulkhead. Sorry, no photo. This is the time to check if this is possible, because the 145 mm of the tube is only what I remember, I have nothing noticed about that doing my first unit. The exact length when the marked screw touches the bracket on LHD TRs is 137 mm (145 mm tube - 3 mm steel - 5 mm screw head) + 110 mm = 247 mm. The possible length I determined on my steering column is only 228 mm, so my construction (tube) currently is 247 - 228 = 19 mm to long. The tube must be at least 19 mm shorter, otherwise the lower steering column would not fit between the steering rack and upper steering column. Best is to make the tube 25 mm shorter, only 120 mm long, so see the new length on my sketch. This is what I have to make first before continue welding. It is a good idea to check this yourself on your own project / TR and better check one time more than one time less. Sorry me if this caused anyone not expected trouble. Ciao, Marco Edited December 25, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 25, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2020 here you find a post about the "steering column support bracket" this limits the position of the EPS unit in the direction to the bulkhead Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted December 30, 2020 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2020 (edited) On 12/24/2020 at 10:53 PM, Z320 said: Hi Andy and Jochem, welding is also possible but is more effort, I will show you. please be gentle about my english Edited December 30, 2020 by Z320 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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