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vented brake discs mystery


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The caliper spacers are easy to get hold of - Big Red flog them on EBay. In the day they were a common mod on Cortinas which used the same calipers.

There was a kit sold by a number of the suppliers a few years ago with the discks and spacers for the calipers. When the kit cam it was in an ECB box. However the kit is no longer being sold and I have struggled to find out what the original discs were. Tried ringing ECB who denied all knowledge! Presumably the kit didn't come with the same profit margin as a 4 pot conversion and died out.

On the assumption that my discs will wear out eventially I have spent many an hour going through brake disk catalogues to see which could be used. The best match I got were Corrado/Golf ones which I was going to get re-drilled and centred to fit but they have sat in my shed for the past few months.

 

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28 minutes ago, Andy Moltu said:

The caliper spacers are easy to get hold of - Big Red flog them on EBay.

Common spacers are 8mm.

Since disc width here is 24mm vs. 20mm vented Cortina disc, a 12mm spacer is needed. BiggRed does not carry those.

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On 10/25/2020 at 12:36 PM, Z320 said:

Hi Andreas,

with the Ford Sierra discs you need to make a distance shim?

Or is this not the case?

Yes, 2.5mm spacer and so still the centering of the hub can be used.

A simple shim cut out of a steel plate

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On 10/25/2020 at 12:28 PM, Waldi said:

Note in Jochems picture the EBC disks are 4 mm (!) thinner (20 vs 24 mm); It can only mean less cooling or less “meat”.

Waldi

I think they are made that thin that some steel wheels fit with that swap.

The wider the disc the more the caliper comes to outside.

So mine is 4mm more to outside, too much for steel wheels.

My brake interfears between steel wheel and caliper.

 

Anyway a friend had the EBC set and also did not clear the caliper but has wire wheels now.

The worst in my opinion are the dimples in the disc that make noise and show from outside that there is something special.

One original EBC set had the holes for the brake fluid not in perfect position for the caliper.

The canal gasket sits in the bore of the caliper making fluid drop out.

I had to make four new spacers.

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1 hour ago, TriumphV8 said:

Yes, 2.5mm spacer and so still the centering of the hub can be used.

A simple shim cut out of a steel plate

4 "washers" each disc or a spacer ring with 4 drills?

Edited by Z320
4, not 5
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14 hours ago, Z320 said:

4 "washers" each disc or a spacer ring with 4 drills?

987398743_VentedDisc01.thumb.jpg.d09c5c07b8061aaa1a26c89bc07d7dcb.jpg

Between the flange and the disc you see the shim.

It is a single plate right there shiny but meanwhile as rusty as the flange.

I made 10 of them, welded them together at the edges, put them in the lathe and made the inner bore. Than grinded of the edges to get the round corners, put them on the flange and marked the positions of the four holes and drilled them.

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Thank you to tell me! That looks like a "Bierdeckel"! :)

A square steel plate with 4 drills on the edges and a big one in the center!

Edited by Z320
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What specification bolts will you use to clamp the two halves of the caliper when the spacer is fitted?

Get it wrong and the bolt stretches/breaks under full panic brake pressure. 

How do I know?  I saw it happen on test at an original equipment brake caliper maker. Done to prove that some after-market widened calipers fitted with basic bolts were potentially dangerous.

Peter W

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2 minutes ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

What specification bolts will you use to clamp the two halves of the caliper when the spacer is fitted?

Get it wrong and the bolt stretches/breaks under full panic brake pressure. 

How do I know?  I saw it happen on test at an original equipment brake caliper maker. Done to prove that some after-market widened calipers fitted with basic bolts were potentially dangerous.

Peter W

My first EBC vented disc fitment had all the bolts and seals etc supplied. The torque spec for the bolts was 55 lbs.ft.

Two of the bolts extended like liquorice. I contacted them and they said 'just reduce the torque'  - my view is utter tosh.

Thankfully the original bolts were just long enough so they went back in with no issues.

 

Roger

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1 minute ago, RogerH said:

My first EBC vented disc fitment had all the bolts and seals etc supplied. The torque spec for the bolts was 55 lbs.ft.

Two of the bolts extended like liquorice. I contacted them and they said 'just reduce the torque'  - my view is utter tosh.

Thankfully the original bolts were just long enough so they went back in with no issues.

 

Roger

I rest my case. m'lord

Peter W

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Good point Peter and easily overlooked.
Do you know what spec they should be in “BSF language”? I’m aware 3 stripes on the head equals 8.8 for metric bolts.

I assume these would be 10.9 or even higher equivalent?

Thanks,

Waldi

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1 hour ago, Waldi said:

Good point Peter and easily overlooked.
Do you know what spec they should be in “BSF language”? I’m aware 3 stripes on the head equals 8.8 for metric bolts.

I assume these would be 10.9 or even higher equivalent?

Thanks,

Waldi

This chart maybe of use, it list imperial and metric fastener head marking.

https://eicac.co.uk/Bolt-Grades-And-Markings

Cheers

Peter W

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For all of you using a vented 24 mm Ford disc, please allow me to ask a question:

In my opinion our TRs are already not comfortable cars and I'm afraid of loosing comfort by the aditional - not suspended - weight of the disc.

Is there any realistic experience about that?  

Edited by Z320
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5 minutes ago, Z320 said:

For all of you using a vented 24 mm Ford disc, please allow me to ask a question:

In my opinion our TRs are already not comfortable cars and I'm afraid of loosing comfort by the aditional - not suspended - weight of the disc.

Is there any realistic experience about that?  

Drop your upsprung weight with Aluminium BR calipers?  Straight fit on a TR3 with standard discs

https://crosthwaiteandgardiner.com/girling-br-lh-brake-caliper-assembly-2

or  https://www.bighealey.co.uk/girling-br-caliper-aluminium-lh-jcbrk156

image.png.1f2e931547e7fd1f3f4ce50c03c53733.png

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I removed the original Grade5 bolts and used Grade8 bolts.

We have a very good supplier, Screwcorner, here in Germany.

The longer bolts to hold the brake pads are normal steel.

 

The spacers are made from steel for Harald and EN7075 or steel for me.

We have the EBC set as a template and cut them out of a flat bar.

We made the fluid pass individually not using the template

because we learned that the holes sometimes do not cover the canal gasket.

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I do not notice any difference when swapping to heavier discs.

Later I swapped from heavy wire wheels to Alloys with no difference.

 

Right now the V8 has really heavy wires in 7x16 with 215/55 and spanner with 3 ears.

That is also with the Bilstein setup far, far better than original and somewhat better than Spax.

It is far more important to have big valves in the shocks to open quickly on bumps not bringing

the whole car in motion and damp things down quickly.

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1 hour ago, JochemsTR said:

so Class 10.9 with 150.000 psi or Grade 8 with 150.000 psi is the correct bolt to use?

In some tuning sets you find normal Grade5 bolts in longer version.

I wanted to be on the save side that is why I took Grade8.

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7 hours ago, BlueTR3A-5EKT said:

Drop your upsprung weight with Aluminium BR calipers?  Straight fit on a TR3 with standard discs

https://crosthwaiteandgardiner.com/girling-br-lh-brake-caliper-assembly-2

or  https://www.bighealey.co.uk/girling-br-caliper-aluminium-lh-jcbrk156

image.png.1f2e931547e7fd1f3f4ce50c03c53733.png

Hi Peter,

that's very nice, but we have the TÜV here at Germany,

they will hang me up on their entrance and keep me hanging there until I fall down from the rope as a warning for all.

Ciao, Marco 

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