Early TR2 disc wheels

[2long]

The earliest 2s and Dorettis used a weaker disc wheel - I think “4J”.   These were prone to failure and very soon a different welding or rivet method was used.  I think my Doretti has the early wheels and I have a chance to pick up a set of TR4 disc wheels locally that are in good shape.  But I want to make sure TR4 wheels will fit and if mine are really the earliest version.  How can I tell if I have the weak wheels?

Cheers

Dan

[Lebro]

Difficult one.

TR's used 4" (inside rim measurement) up to & including 4A's.  TR5's had 4½" rims, & TR6's had 5½" rims.

The 4" ones used rivets to hold the rim to the center, 4½" & upward were spot welded.

I used to think the riveted ones were the weak ones, but it's not that simple, only "early" riveted ones were weak, later ones were ok.

Not sure how to tell the difference.    For what it's worth, you can fit up to 5½" rims on a sidescreen TR without problems, don't know if that also applies to a Dorretti.

Bob.

[Rodbr]

Hi Dan,

I think you'll find the visual identifying difference is in the wheel trim pins. I need to clarify this and will let you know definitively later today.

For what it's worth I think you can faff around and change the pins around, sure I've seeen this somewhere. 

Not sure if the Doretti wheel trims will fit the later wheels but the later TR4 wheels should fit as there is plenty of room for even a modest offset.

Go on, fit wires to the Doretti it suits the car perfectly, you know it makes sense. LMAO!

Rod

PS, here's a link to http://www.doretti.co.uk/gallery-6-1.htm enjoy as it highlights the wider wheels that can be fitted.

Edited August 22, 2020 by Rodbr

[RAHTR4]

Hi Dan,

According to Bill Piggott  “the weak steel wheel” is an unsubstantiated rumour.

 I quote ;

“there was no such thing as an early 'weak' TR2 wheel - this is part of TR myth. Rather these early cars were fitted with smaller Mayflower wheel nuts, which allowed the centres of the wheel to pull over the tightened nuts, which were too small”.

The problem was solved at car TS 1635 when the Mayflower nuts, 11/16” AF, were replaced with 7/8” AF nuts as used on the Vanguard.

So it seems best that you check your “nuts” before changing the wheels.

I would always favour the steel wheels as I think they look the best......!!!

Also, I have sent you some drawings of the various wheels to enable you to check the offset clearances, etc.

Regards, Richard

[roger murray-evans]

Dan,

This subject has been dealt with before.As far as I remember (being in the same boat

TR2 wise) I ascertained that the wheels to look for, to replace what were considered to be

compromised in strength terms, were later items that have the letter 'H' stamped on the

knave plate.The earlier items don't have this.

If you do a search on this forum for 'H stamped' you should come up with all the

gen you need to make a decision.

I got a half dozen 'H' rims, from Alec Pringle shortly before his demise, to replace my 1953

wheels. 

Good luck

Roger M-E

[BlueTR3A-5EKT]

The only safety change issue I recall seeing referred to in the factory service bulletins was the suggested replacement of front hubs on TR2 that had a grease nipple with items that did not.  Those with a grease nipple were deemed weak.  If I can find the copy I have of that bulletin I will post it here.

Peter W

PS Bulletin here see page 54  http://tr3a.info/PDFs/1954bul.pdf

Edited August 22, 2020 by BlueTR3A-5EKT

[2long]

Here is the original Doretti wheel (spare) as a visual sample of what I have, with a backside still in the original Doretti shade of “post box red” - which I will go back to one day!

 

Edited August 22, 2020 by 2long

[2long]

[RAHTR4]

17 hours ago, roger murray-evans said:

Dan,

This subject has been dealt with before.As far as I remember (being in the same boat

TR2 wise) I ascertained that the wheels to look for, to replace what were considered to be

compromised in strength terms, were later items that have the letter 'H' stamped on the

knave plate.The earlier items don't have this.

If you do a search on this forum for 'H stamped' you should come up with all the

gen you need to make a decision.

I got a half dozen 'H' rims, from Alec Pringle shortly before his demise, to replace my 1953

wheels. 

Good luck

Roger M-E

Hi Roger,

I am intrigued.......!!!!

Can you detail the differences of an “H” stamped steel wheel which makes it structurally stronger than the original steel wheels that were fitted on your car.

Regards, Richard

[roger murray-evans]

No Richard, it's a while ago and I accepted the perceived wisdom of replacing them, along with the

earlier front hubs, which also had a reputation for sudden failure.

As far as I can ascertain, they also may vary a little in the backspacing between the 2 versions.

Cheers

Roger M-E

Edited August 23, 2020 by roger murray-evans
used wrong name

[2long]

So here is a pic of my disc wheel mounted, which seems to bear out Richard’s comments.  Nuts are 11/16.  Guess that meansI have small nuts!  Anyone able to say that other than the early nuts, the construction of my wheel is just as good as the later ones?

Dan

 

 

Edited August 23, 2020 by 2long

[RAHTR4]

Hi Dan,

The construction of your wheels are exactly the same as the later wheels.

Regards, Richard 

[cvtrian]

Hi Dan
Other than using larger nuts, if you are still concerned about wheel integrity you could always run a weld round the riveted rear section - I am led to believe the competition/racing fraternity did this for safety reasons. 

The SDF investigated having these wheels reproduced as many may be more than 50 years old and of riveted construction. There are a number of these wheels in the marketplace, but in what condition? Later TR4/4A wheels were not riveted.

We approached AE Oscroft https://aeoscroft.co.uk/ who own Weller wheels, (and they make the reproduction TR6 wheel), however they deemed it to be significantly more complicated than a TR6 wheel with several pressing processes and non continuous welding assembly needed and they decided not to progress the project. There is a very slim chance another wheel manufacturer outside of the UK may consider making them but that may well be way into the future...........

Ian

 

Edited August 24, 2020 by cvtrian

[John Morrison]

From memory, some time ago, Bill Piggott wrote an article on all the different steel wheels for TR Action,

anybody remember?

John.

[Dic Doretti]

Hi Dan

            Some Dorettis have a right angle flange around the wheel arch which reduces the clearance, no problem at the back where there is plenty of clearance with the TR2 axle but the TR4 track on the front of Dorettis is more of a problem. Other Dorettis have a wired edge around wheel arch which improves the clearance, I put a wired edge on my flanged wings and used TR5 wheels.

          Cheers Richard