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Tr4A door mirrors - Again!


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Hi Guys,

Have at last decides which door mirrors to fit and have gone with BULLET STYLE  GAM105's as sold by Moss and others, claimed suitable for the TR4/4A.

However having tried them  by holding them on the doors, I'm not sure how effective they will be, especially the passenger side? My problem is I do not have my seats ready to fit into the car to help establish the best position,  but would like to complete the doors/cards. 

Hopefully, someone out there has already fitted these Bullet style mirrors in a satisfactory position, and rather than me guess, can maybe give me dimensions for the two fixing holes in the doors.

Here's hoping

Rich

 

 

 

 

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For the passenger side, one needs a convex mirror. 

I started with a plain mirror there, but one sees very little.  I swapped to a convex mirror, but the curvature was so great that everything shrank to the extent that I was not able to judge how near/far vehicles were behind me.

Recently purchased a 92mm convex mirror (fits in a 100mm unit) with 1 in 1250 curve, which is probably fine for a motorbike, where the mirror is only an arm's length away - not sufficiently curved when on the other door of the TR.

I'm going to contact the vendor (ebay) to see whether I can obtain a 92mm mirror with a somewhat greater curvature.  If so, will post here.

Bullet mirror on driver's door is excellent and a great safety feature - as on modern cars - see photos (our esteemed Hon Pres in the 2nd). 

If you need dimensions for positioning, just let me know, but remember that ti depends where in the base the fixings are located.

Ian Cornish

Brian Culcheth 4VC at WCR40 - 1-1280.jpg

Historic Marathon Rally 31 May 2015-1280.jpg

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I had a look through the invoices received from Neil during the re-build in 1990-1993, and found that the two mirrors are GAM105.

These have fixings 2" apart on a base which is 3.75" long.  Note that the fixings are NOT 1" either side of the centre line of the base.

I took some measurements from my RH door (the LH will be the same), but it must be appreciated that everything is curved at the front edge of the door!

The foremost bolt is tucked up inside the leading edge of the door, so the bolt's head is visible when the door is opened fully.  Measuring from the leading edge of the door, that bolt is approx 68mm back.  I'm not going to remove the door covering, but the other bolt is inside the door and 2" (51mm) rearwards of that.

Looking at the mirror's foot, the leading edge of the casting is 30mm back from the leading edge of the door, and the top edge of the casting is 21mm down from the top of the door.

Bear in mind that my doors are both framed and skinned in alloy, so there might be differences with a steel door.

I have despatched an email about convex mirror with greater curvature to Phoenix, and will post when I receive news.

Ian Cornish

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Hi Rich

I replaced my bullet mirrors with Ital 467 mirrors from Vintage Supplies LTD, (vintage car parts) mainly because the chrome had failed badly on both mirrors, the passenger side however had been useless since fitted, before I through them away I took then apart and found that you would be able to redrill the bullet piece of the mirror and turn it in further to the driver, whether this would look quite correct on the car looking from the front would be personal choice..

                     Phil...

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My GAM105s, which have been in use since 1993, are still nice and shiny - no sign of chrome failure.

On the passenger side, it's not a matter of turning the casting, what is required is a convex mirror with suitable curvature.  On that side, over the years, I have had:

- a plain mirror (useless),

- a very convex mirror (shrank all following vehicles to the extent that I was unable to judge the distance at which they trailed me), 

- a "motorbike" convex mirror (better, but insufficient width of view).

I'm hoping that Phoenix may have a convex mirror more suited to the passenger side of a car.

Ian Cornish

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Hope this helps regarding position of mirrors.Passenger side is a mirror image.

I dont have a problem with them but use main central mirror and always check with a shoulder glance for a blind spot.

20200823_143721.jpg

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TR4TUNE - a couple of questions about your mirrors:

- is the mounting just a single bolt?

- how do you adjust the position of the mirror (is it by moving the bullet holder on the stalk)?

The base of the GAM105 is held by 2 bolts, horizontally 2" apart.  The mirror is adjusted by loosening the screw at the front (just visible in my shot with Brian) and moving the mirror holder up/down and side to side, as required. Once correctly positioned, the screw is tightened. There is a lot of adjustment available and with a friend to manipulate the screwdriver and the holder, adjustment is easy.

I agree 100% about use of all 3 mirrors and a quick glance behind, and having the window at least partly open helps because one can hear a vehicle on one's right.  I have a Dolomite interior mirror because it is wider and so gives a wider rear view - mine fitted onto the TR4's stalk.  These Dolomite mirrors can sometimes be found in autojumbles.

Ian Cornish

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Ian C, 

Yes just a single bolt, the chrome base is only about an inch diameter.Adjustment, as you say, by moving the unit on the stalk....friction interference between two semi circles.Don't know if the resistance can be altered as they stay where pointed, so far.

Afraid I dont know the make as I did not do the original build but I think they are a good addition, striking the right balance between form and function.

John S

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After many years of seeing nothing but sky or tarmac with my passenger bullet mirror, I went to the trouble of properly trying to set it up which I managed after a lot of tooing and froing. Now both mirrors have a clear view down the side of the car.  Their only drawback is in the area of mirror compared to other styles (which is smaller and limits view). However, with all three mirrors in use, much of the rear view is now covered.  I never thought they would be any good but am really happy now and they look epic. 
 

set them up properly and, like me, you will be happy. 
 

cheers

 

dave

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The type like mine can be found on Car builder solutions web site , ref MIALWP.

Available in polished, satin or black aluminium, single bolt fixing, price £25ish each.

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Came relatively late to this post. Don't fit bullet mirrors, they look good but are useless, cannot be adjusted easily, if at all, and difficult to reverse with. I removed mine and fitted standard square style mirrors in their place. Much more peace of mind.

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Sorry, salec, I disagree.  My GAM105 mirrors are easy to adjust - easiest if one has a helper to operate the screwdriver.

Being very compact and curvaceous (!), they are less vulnerable than the types which stick out on an arm.  

Only problem, which I described above, is finding a convex mirror with suitable curvature for the passenger side - I'm still waiting for a reply from Phoenix on that.

Ian Cornish

Edited by ianc
typo!
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1 hour ago, ianc said:

Sorry, salec, I disagree.  My GAM105 mirrors are easy to adjust - easiest if one has a helper to operate the screwdriver.

Being very compact and curvaceous (!), they are less vulnerable than the types which stick out on an arm.  

Only problem, which I described above, is finding a convex mirror with suitable curvature for the passenger side - I'm still waiting for a reply from Phoenix on that.

Ian Cornish

I agree with you Ian.  They are not as easy to adjust as the square mirrors however if time is spent adjusting them then they are fine. Once set up they shouldn’t go out of adjustment like the square mirrors. 

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I use the wing-mounted bullet mirror, drivers side only as it only had this when I bought it in 1994, only for the dead spot. Which is when a car is not visible in the central rear view mirror but is next to your car. 
In the first years I had the car I had it adjusted as is normal but found it did not add much to the central mirror. Now it is much better - looking over the shoulder before overtaking is not even necessary anymore (but I still do it).

   

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  • 2 months later...

Mr Sod and his Law dictated that my wing mirror has now worked loose, heaven knows how as I not been far recently.

I have attached a pic of how I managed to fix it which may help others in a similar position. The nut on the end of the mirror stalk, inside the door, had loosened slightly. It is very difficult to see the nut let alone tighten it up. After removing the door card, wind the window up, insert a light source204669623_20201104_1721042.thumb.jpg.e257ded5787c8800114fc5243794a903.jpg204669623_20201104_1721042.thumb.jpg.e257ded5787c8800114fc5243794a903.jpg in 1, peer through 3, insert small hand with spanner through 2, when spanner is on nut reach over the door and rotate the mirror until tightish then nip up with spanner. It is not possible to use a socket due to the mirror being attached on the curve of the door.

I have no idea how or if you can fit a mirror like this without the glass and winder mechanism being removed. Similarly if the nut had dropped off, to join the two mysterious washers in the door bottom, I would still be in the garage now.

Edited by TR4TUNE
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Today, I had a PM about door mirror, and have replied thus:

For the CAM105 unit, one needs a mirror with a diameter of 92 or 93mm.

D G Bull Glass Services (website wingmirrorsuk.co.uk) offer convex mirrors in both sizes for £6.99 plus postage. 

Curvature probably fine for a motorbike, but not as much as I would wish for a car, where the mirror is further from the driver.  However, better than a flat mirror.

I fitted a 92mm, but I am sure that a 93mm would fit.

This company offers an enormous variety of mirrors in different shapes, sizes and flat or convex.  Remember that the mirror inside the housing will be some millimetres smaller than the housing, so measure carefully!

Ian Cornish

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