stuart Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 11 hours ago, Chris Seymour said: I had the opposite problem, my bonnet kept popping open. My bonnet latch was missing the safety hook so ordered a new one. When fitted the hook didn’t locate with the latch plate. Tried to bend it slightly to line up and it just fell to pieces, so back to having no safety hook. My popping bonnet turned out to be the poor quality of the pattern latch plate. The spring was so weak it wouldn’t return the mechanisms properly. Managed to get hold of an original one, cleaned it up and sprayed it.........perfect. Sometimes you do have to bend the hook section on the catch plate as well. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 21 hours ago, Waldi said: Hi Mike, to be honest I’m glad we do have them. Without these reproductions maintaining our cars, let alone a restoration, is impossible. It is the lack of quality control that is an often arising issue. But quality control comes at a price. An important part is to provide feedback to the suppliers, the TR Register PQI is a valuable tool for this. My individual issue is solved to my satisfaction, but I bet there are many poorly fabricated brackets on the shelves. Best regards, Waldi Hi Waldi! But there is another issue with the hook it is too easy bent the grade of steel needs to be changed as it appears to me that forming steel has been used for the hook which is very soft. It also appears to me that the repro ones do not have a washer underneath under the preening like the original. I looked at mine this morning and it has been well preened over! Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 Hi Bruce, yes, the hook is probably made from a low grade steel, and bends relatively easily. Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mike C Posted July 11, 2020 Report Share Posted July 11, 2020 2 hours ago, astontr6 said: Hi Waldi! But there is another issue with the hook it is too easy bent the grade of steel needs to be changed as it appears to me that forming steel has been used for the hook which is very soft. It also appears to me that the repro ones do not have a washer underneath under the preening like the original. I looked at mine this morning and it has been well preened over! Bruce. In the original the pin looks like it's been cold forged over the washer and the steel in the hook is strong enough to bend the backing plate if you move it. These subtle fabrication details were known to Triumph's original designers but are lost to the repro suppliers. It's minor details like these that force me to scour the countryside looking for original parts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 A small update from my issue (pin that worked loose from bracket on new item): The vendor had made a refund, and I did not have to ship the defective item. He was aware of the issue. Since I had nothing to loose and the same item from a different supplier had exactly the same issue AND I have my first MOT (APK) tomorrow, I removed the item, assembled the pin with 2 additional peens (as Stuart said), but found it was still floppy. So I have welded 3 spots with my mig-welder to secure the pin in the hole/bracket. This also removes any clearance/flexibility, so the catch appears a lot stiffer and side wards travel is limited. Think it will hold. The triangulated (gusset) welding had to wait, I feared for welding the catch to the bracket, so need to get some thin copper foil (do nit know English name) I can slide in-between. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mike C Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 Hope the MOT goes well. The thin copper foil we would call in Australia a copper backing strip. I had the opportunity to install my replacement bonnet catch with a hook over the weekend (CV19 lockdown and all that). The replacement's hook fouled the emergency release requiring some rework. After reading some of the stuck bonnet postings I was paranoid about anything on the catch fouling. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
michaeldavis39 Posted July 19, 2020 Report Share Posted July 19, 2020 So is anyone going to make a new correct bracket for these cars??? I have a new repro one waiting to be fitted bought several years ago which I won't be fitting now as it's junk. Very frustrated by this it's absolutely ridiculous I have no problem paying a higher price for properly manufactured parts- who is allowing this cheap tat to be made and why is there so much of it about?? I have a friend overseas who is having similar problems with the County water pumps and the ones from Bastuck - I am going to start buying every original secondhand part and getting it refurbed to help owners keep these cars going- no more cheap crappy parts it's not good enough, get what you pay for , my Moto buy cheap buy twice, get something decent get something nice and it's worked for me over 30 years. I absolutely refuse to buy junk ever hence nothing on my restore is or will be. Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 10 hours ago, michaeldavis39 said: So is anyone going to make a new correct bracket for these cars??? I have a new repro one waiting to be fitted bought several years ago which I won't be fitting now as it's junk. Very frustrated by this it's absolutely ridiculous I have no problem paying a higher price for properly manufactured parts- who is allowing this cheap tat to be made and why is there so much of it about?? I have a friend overseas who is having similar problems with the County water pumps and the ones from Bastuck - I am going to start buying every original secondhand part and getting it refurbed to help owners keep these cars going- no more cheap crappy parts it's not good enough, get what you pay for , my Moto buy cheap buy twice, get something decent get something nice and it's worked for me over 30 years. I absolutely refuse to buy junk ever hence nothing on my restore is or will be. Michael You`ll find the original safety catches werent that good either, Ive seen plenty with the hook bracket broken off so TBH its often just that the repros arent assembled very well, make sure the small section of bracket that holds the hook is triangulated and properly welded and that the pin for the hook is either very well peened in or tapped and safety bolted or if your having it replated then weld it on. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, stuart said: You`ll find the original safety catches werent that good either, Ive seen plenty with the hook bracket broken off so TBH its often just that the repros arent assembled very well, make sure the small section of bracket that holds the hook is triangulated and properly welded and that the pin for the hook is either very well peened in or tapped and safety bolted or if your having it replated then weld it on. Stuart. Yep, here's my original which broke soon after having it plated several years ago - need to get it repaired at some point. The original is a much heavier gauge than the repro and without any gussetting. Cheers, Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
michaeldavis39 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Stuart we should not have to be fixing, ammending, putting right parts that should actually be fit for purpose. These repro parts are not fit for purpose so therefore should not be sold - where can I complain about this as I'm not happy about this and that the Triumph community know about it and haven't done anything either is quite disappointing- if we do what we always did we will get what we always got. This is bizarre to me as these cars haven't been made for at least 44 years and nobody has done anything about it very disappointed. Tell me where I can go to get this sorted out as it's got to be put right even if I have to find someone who can make these to the proper build and sell them myself! Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 (edited) 24 minutes ago, michaeldavis39 said: Stuart we should not have to be fixing, ammending, putting right parts that should actually be fit for purpose. These repro parts are not fit for purpose so therefore should not be sold - where can I complain about this as I'm not happy about this and that the Triumph community know about it and haven't done anything either is quite disappointing- if we do what we always did we will get what we always got. This is bizarre to me as these cars haven't been made for at least 44 years and nobody has done anything about it very disappointed. Tell me where I can go to get this sorted out as it's got to be put right even if I have to find someone who can make these to the proper build and sell them myself! Michael So, you're not happy about the Triumph community - if you haven't already done so, and it appears you haven't since March 2016, then why not join the TR Register and add your voice to the club's supplier complaints process rather than firing off from the sidelines? Cheers, Andrew Edited July 20, 2020 by Andrew Smith Quote Link to post Share on other sites
michaeldavis39 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 (edited) It's not that I don't like the Triumph community Andrew I think you missunderstand me- I'm just surprised that nobody has done anything I mean 44 years it is a long time isn't it? Thanks for the advice anyway and surely someone has fired off a complaint before now? I can't think of anything more disappointing than restoring a car to find the parts are available but aren't much good when the press say oh there's plenty of parts and even now my friend tells me that a simple thing like a County water pump fitted less than 300 miles ago had failed. Maybe I sound angry I'm not just sad as I don't have time to waste hunting around for decent parts when I thought they were available just like the generation who will come after me so I'm going to try and make a difference I will join up and I will complain if that's what it takes as I am like a dog with a bone not a sideliner. Michael Edited July 20, 2020 by michaeldavis39 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Smith Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Micheal, The problem is that historically classic car owners don't want to pay perceived higher prices for quality, so companies like Moss have many products manufactured to a price the market is willing to pay, so I don't really think it's their fault. I've had this discussion many times Moss and have had/and do have a very good relationship with them (and previously as Cox & Buckles) over many years of TR ownership. Personally, I would be happy to pay more for a higher quality part but others in the classic car world seemingly do not and that's why I buy good OE or NOS parts whenever I can. Moss have a very good returns policy but agree it shouldn't be necessary, but if only life was that easy. Glad you'll be joining the club and look forward to seeing your little blue 'TR Register Member' icon soon. Regards, Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 1 hour ago, michaeldavis39 said: It's not that I don't like the Triumph community Andrew I think you missunderstand me- I'm just surprised that nobody has done anything I mean 44 years it is a long time isn't it? Thanks for the advice anyway and surely someone has fired off a complaint before now? I can't think of anything more disappointing than restoring a car to find the parts are available but aren't much good when the press say oh there's plenty of parts and even now my friend tells me that a simple thing like a County water pump fitted less than 300 miles ago had failed. Maybe I sound angry I'm not just sad as I don't have time to waste hunting around for decent parts when I thought they were available just like the generation who will come after me so I'm going to try and make a difference I will join up and I will complain if that's what it takes as I am like a dog with a bone not a sideliner. Michael Thing is you CAN get most parts to restore 40/50/60 yr old TR`s OK customers do have to do some fiddling or searching for better parts sometimes but try restoring a Vauxhall or Riley of that vintage and you will find very little to help you. Biggest problem is customer attitude to price point. If its considered to be cheap then people will buy it. You can guarantee if there is a more expensive version then I know what 99% of people will buy and that is the cheaper version. Andrew above has put it in a nutshell as I was typing, If you have the money then buy from the more expensive organisations like Racetorations or Revingtons who deal in the higher end. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PodOne Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 I think there is a middle road here the likes of Racetorations and Revingtons are off the scale for a lot of folk and for me don't represent value for money. The usual other big players offer parts I've learned to avoid in the short time I've been involved with my project. The root I increasingly going is repair what I have or buy old serviceable or not OEM parts, repair and restore them, make them or buy the cheap only if they can be improved. Or better still ask first on here who offers the best parts! Andy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tim D. Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Having just sorted out a triumph 2500 saloon I have to say I really appreciate the availability of TR6 parts. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Wow excitement. My bracket came from my preferred supplier, and this item was not ok, and I got a full refund after showing what happened. I’m ok with that, it’s life. Yes, clearly the quality assurance and - control and firstly the engineering failed on this item. And since most (all?) suppliers use the same fabricator for items like this, we all get our share. But I have some understanding for that.If a thorough QA/QC plan would be established, things would improve, but at a cost. This is still small quantity production, unlike for modern car components, but often still cheaper than the same item for a modern car, mass produced. To improve the situation, I have contacted Roger, and Roger agrees this will be actioned (Roger, I owe you a PQI form by the way). This PQI team is run by volunteers within the TR Register, and we should be thankful they do. So anyone who has valid and properly documented complaints about a part, first try to settle with your supplier, and if needed because this is a broader, structural issue, or the supplier does not agree (which can happen): Contact the PQI team, and dovyour little effort. Better than complaining on here. Based on a previous PQI I raised and the appreciated feedback I received from the PQI team how individual vendors had responded, I made my decision where NOT to buy, and that’s a customer lost, forever in my case. I can accept failure, I make them often, but cannot accept ignorance. Just my 2 cts, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cord Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Would this be one of the offending artifacts? Dan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 You only have to look at the quality you pays your money and make your choice, for me most classic car owners are pretty clued up and should be easily capable of making most of the bad parts of the item better than new, so go for it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Yes Dan, same as mine. The pin worked loose, so I fitted it again and then welded. The little fillet weld In the inside corner could be extended a bit too, this will improve stiffness and strength. That weld is on my little list of things to do. Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 13 minutes ago, Waldi said: Yes Dan, same as mine. The pin worked loose, so I fitted it again and then welded. The little fillet weld In the inside corner could be extended a bit too, this will improve stiffness and strength. That weld is on my little list of things to do. Waldi Waldi You only have to look at a front mounted safety catch the clues are there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 You mean strengthen as shown in this pic Neil? To reduce flexing? Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 6 minutes ago, Waldi said: You mean strengthen as shown in this pic Neil? To reduce flexing? Cheers, Waldi Waldi Close but think of backplate extend then something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Classic-Mini-Bonnet-Safety-Catch-with-Spring-Pin-and-Split-Pin-Ready-to-Paint/264794025315?hash=item3da6f42d63:g:unMAAOSwwWNfC1XN Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 Yes Neil, making the base plate longer and then have a catch as you show would be better, but at the sane time the extended end is not supported (hanging free). Making it a bit thicker and angled would improve too, and since “originals” also fail (otherwise not so many of us would need a new one), having an original one may not be much better? Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
michaeldavis39 Posted July 20, 2020 Report Share Posted July 20, 2020 (edited) So I have joined the club just waiting for something for my membership - no idea what I'm getting but I'm paid up. Now back to this bracket what we going to do about it 44 years and it's still no good. Waldi you are always having a go at making things or improving things do you think you can put right this weak design? Did I read it right that you have put in a complaint to the parts people , what happens next. Can I do something to have a look at getting this part made properly I don't know but if someone can come up with a solution to how this should be made stronger safer and more reliable then I'm all ears- I live in the North East we have fabrication shops, 3d scanners injection moulders( not needed for this part I wouldn't think) all that would be needed to either make brackets from scratch or improve upon the existing perhaps. Michael Edited July 20, 2020 by michaeldavis39 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.