Advice on help.

[CalT]

Morning all,

Sorry for the fuzzy title and long post I didn’t know what was best to say.

Hope everyone’s lockdown is going well! 

I am a long term follower of the forum and have posted a few times.

I have a 1972 TR6 which I have been footering with for the last few years trying to get back on the road.

The long term previous owner (my Dad) who owned the car for the last 40 years has recently and unexpectedly passed away and now I have a renewed drive to get the car going in his memory.

Previously I have only been messing about in the garage when time permits and those one constraints still exist. So essentially the advice I am looking for is:

Should I pay someone to help me get the car back on the road? 

The car to me is a solid example and shouldn’t need any body work restoration (other than a new paint job) but is currently not running, it turns over nicely and makes oil pressure etc, but I just can’t seem to get it to fire.

I have had the fuel system overhauled by Neil Ferguson and am pretty happy with this. But I feel getting it going may just be a bit beyond the time / knowledge I can give to the car.

Ideally if I was to pay someone to get the car back on the road I would essentially be looking to get it running and through an MOT (the car will be exempt but I would like to get it to the standard required to pass one). I don’t want a concourse car, partly because I am happy footering around with cosmetic stuff, and partly because I don’t think I could afford the cost of a full strip down and rebuild by a specialist. 

As the car is a non driver it would need to be picked up (I am in the Edinburgh area).

Can anyone recommend someone who would be willing to take on work like this? I don’t mind how far the car has to travel but as I say it would need to be transported and so the garage would need to be within a reasonable distance. 

I get that nothing can happen at the moment with lockdown ongoing and so I will continue to spend a few hours a day in the garage but I don’t expect any miracles! 

Thanks for taking the time to read!

Cal.

[openroad]

Hi Cal, sounds like you need a good classic Garage. 

The usual advice is to contact your local TR group, and they will undoubtedly have some ideas of where to have your Dads Car recommissioned as it were.

Best of luck,  

Conrad.

[Richard71]

Hi Cal,

Sounds like all you need is to get the engine running and take it from there. These engines and running problems aren't too complicated for someone with even the most basic mechanical knowledge. You'll need to check first if you have fuel supply, spark, ignition timing etc. I note you're in Edinburgh, shame about the lockdown, I spend a lot of time working in Edinburgh, this morning the City Centre, then Easter Bush/Roslin this afternoon, it wouldn't have been a problem for me to have paid a visit had we been living in normal times.

Do you have the relevant workshop manuals, you could use them to follow some trouble shooting guides???

Regards,

Richard.

[CalT]

Thanks for the replies so far.

Conrad, maybe (once we are back to normal) getting in contact with and maybe meeting up with some of the local club would be a good idea. What would be the best way to go about locating said club and getting in touch? 

Richard, yes I would say getting the engine going is the main thing, then taking it from there (although there is a bit more than that to be done) I would appreciate any help once we are back to normal times (whenever that may be!). I have the relevant manuals, both the Haynes manual and the brown workshop manual and I am comfortable working on the car, it’s just sometimes the lack of a second pair of hands! 

My main worry is that the longer the car sits the more may degrade / go wrong. For example when I put the car into the garage the clutch was working, when I went to (attempt to) start it the other day the clutch was not disengaging, I think it’s a lack of fluid potentially from a leaking seal in one of the cylinders, but just an example of something that was working but now isn’t. 

I think the current situation with the world will give me a lot of time to work on the car, just a shame that ordering parts is taking longer and getting any help is impossible! 

Cheers

Cal 

[iani]

You could give Chic Doig a call, he's not that far away and I'm sure he could recover the car if necessary. http://www.chicdoig.co.uk

Ian

[Mike C]

My local club has a TR6 expert backed by the collective wisdom and experience  of the club . He's a great help with technical issues and finding local specialist technicians. If I were you I'd join the local branch of the Register or any other club that specializes in TR6's- in Australia it's the TSOA.

It's important that the club has collective experience with the PI system.

[elclem1]

You could always FaceTime and do it that way? I have done this a couple of times from here to the uk. Usually it’s the process of fault finding that is difficult, for example is there fresh fuel in the tank it may be worth emptying it and getting rid of any crud that may have accumulated over the years start simple and make sure you have all of the elements in order for the engine to fire. If you have changed the injection equipment it will take time for fuel to arrive at the injectors and if you did change the metering unit did you check the timing? All things to consider. If you need any help just let me know. Cheers Clem

[Oddball]

It sounds like you can do most of the work yourself, which under the circumstances would be the most appropriate way with a family car like yours  There are a number of us in your area who would be more than happy to help you out.

Keep in touch 

Cameron  

 

 

 

 

 

[CalT]

Again, thanks for the replies guys.

Ian, I have seen chic recommended before, have you used him before?

Thanks Mike, definitely sounds like finding and getting involved in the local club is worth while! Will I find details of them on here? 

Thanks Clem, yes, I had the fuel tank out not that long ago, emptied, cleaned and fresh fuel in, the new MU was installed with the correct timing (as per the manual) to the best of my knowledge. 

I think it is either the lack of fuel, a lot of people have said that you need to bleed the system for a while, or it may be the lack of a spark, I haven’t really looked much at the ignition system. 

Thanks Cameron, so far I have done all of the work myself, I’ve been at it a while with no success so I think the head is going down a bit! Maybe instead of paying someone to finish what I started, a bit of help from some helpful register members would be the way to go! There have certainly been a few offers on this post alone! 

At the present time it’s impossible to take up any of these offers, other than the FaceTime option from Clem, but hopefully people wouldn’t mind a message once we are back to normal? 

Cheers

Cal

[Richard71]

Hello Again Cal,

If you can confirm you have a spark and you haven't upset the ignition timing by moving the dizzy (distributor), then with a fully charged healthy battery, remove the spark plugs, disconnect power supply to the coil, turn on the ignition and let the fuel pump run for 20-30mins, during this time, by hand using the cooling fan turn the engine a few revolutions, re-fit plugs and supply to coil and try starting the engine with half to full choke.

This is what I do anytime the car hasn't run for many months, in fact I'll be doing that this afternoon.

Richard.

[CalT]

Thanks Richard,

I will give this a bash, if I have no joy then I’ll need to start working through the ignition system! 

Cheers

Cal 

[glasgow4a]

Hi Cal you have PM cheers Ian.

[iani]

8 hours ago, CalT said:

<snip>

Ian, I have seen chic recommended before, have you used him before?

</snip>

Chic rebodied a GT6 for me into a shell from a Californian scrapyard, in effect a total restoration, he did a great job and I was very pleased.

[Mk2 Chopper]

Hi Cal, 

Welcome to the forum, although sad circumstances have brought you to this point, it'll be a fitting tribute to get this TR6 up and running. 

When the fuel system has been apart it can certainly take a good while to bleed the system. 

To confirm you have fuel, undo and remove an injector place in a jar and crank the engine over and see if there is a spray of fuel coming out. If there is, check the other injectors, and work on the ignition. If no fuel, take the advice above to help bleed it. 

Gareth

[CalT]

Thanks again folks,

Ill see I can get some time in the garage this coming week and work through the advice, I’ll let you know how I get on.

Thanks again

Cal 

[elclem1]

Hi Cal just a thought but the PMV that regulates the fuel pressure to the MU may not be doing its thing the MU needs around 110psi from the Fuel pump and PRV {original pump} is designed to leak off excess fuel but if its not doing its job then there will be no pressure at the injectors and the nozzles wont open. I bought a tee piece and gauge to fit just before the MU worth its weight in gold [about the same price unfortunately} but it gives you the exact pressure before the fuel is metered to the injectors. Not enough pressure and the nozzle won,t open properly. I use this on all of my builds its a no brainer. Clem     

[CalT]

Thanks Clem, the PRV was refurbed along with the MU and fuel pump, so in theory that should be working, I’ll have a look into gauges tho, it’s a good idea. 

I am planning on sending the dizzy away for a refurb and hopefully that will solve the problem, I get the feeling that it’s lack of a spark rather than lack of fuel. 

Once I have that back I will be able to work through bleeding the fuel system knowing I should have a spark! 

Cheers

Cal 

Edited April 28, 2020 by CalT

[Mk2 Chopper]

Easy to check for a spark, worth doing as although it might be an idea to get the distributor refurbished, this may not be the smoking gun you're looking for. 

Might be as simple as the points, or the coil. Or it's the fuel supply, no point guessing, all these things are simple to check.

Gareth. 

[stallie]

CalT

First, Sorry for the passing of your dad, but what a wonderful memory he has left you. My dad passed unexpectedly 12 years ago now and left me his TR6. It was running, but needed work. He'd being using it as a daily driver (probably as it was more reliable than the Range Rover!). He'd had it about 10 years, but most of that time I was living a long way away so I never really got to to know the car.

I hadn't had a lot to do with rebuilding cars in my childhood - sure I liked them, but I spent my spare time in the mountains pursuing other hobbies. Then when it came my way in my 30s with the help of this forum (and others) and the wealth of information out there and you should be able to overcome your problems. It will give you a sense of achievement and a better understanding of your car. Get copies of all the books, manuals. Even the Lucas PI troubleshooting cars are out there scanned.

With the help of people on here, I rebuilt the suspension, pulled and rebuilt the gearbox, rewired the birds nest under the dash and a multitude of other tasks. Do not be disheartened. I started with little mechanical history, but a bit of common sense, the manuals, and this forum it's going well. Like you, it's not a concourse car - but something that I can drive with my kids and have fun in and remember the old man. And I now have a barn find TR that I am starting restoration of.

Re the spark - you can check you have it before you send it off .

But first, as above - Make sure that you have fuel coming out the injectors. pop the injector and put in a glass jar when cranking. you should get a cone spray. PIs are fiddly to set up, but once going they are good.

Edited April 28, 2020 by stallie

[CalT]

Stallie,

Thanks for the post, sounds like a similar story to mine, accept the last time my car ran was 2008! 

This and many other posts have definitely convinced that doing as much work on the car myself is the way to go, keeping in touch with the forum more is what I think I need to do to make sure thinks progress and I don’t get disheartened. 

I have a Marine Engineering background so am used to working on engines, just big Diesel engines not small petrol ones! Some things therefore are quite new to me, like the ignition system for example. 

I think I will still send the distributor away to get refurbished as it is in need of it, however before I do it would be good to check for a spark! 

There have been a few people, including one gent from the forum who was good enough to give me a call for a chat to impart some wisdom that checking for a spark is easy,

19 hours ago, Mk2 Chopper said:

Easy to check for a spark, worth doing as. 

would anyone be able to enlighten me? As I say, the ignition system is relatively new to me although I do understand the basic principal. But a dummy’s guide would be best! 

Thanks again for all the support

Cal 

[John Morrison]

Cal,

buy one of these off 'The Bay,' £5.

Safe and easy, and one operation.

If it flashes when you turnover the engine, with the key on,

You've got a spark at that plug, check them all, and then report back to us.

John.

 

Car In-Line Ignition/HT Lead Spark Plug Coil Circuit Tester Car/Van Vehicle UK

[stuart]

Direct link https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sealey-In-Line-Ignition-HT-Lead-Spark-Plug-Coil-Circuit-Tester-Car-Van-UK/264708898239?hash=item3da1e13dbf:g:ZKEAAOSwov5eoSvU

Stuart.

[Mk2 Chopper]

1 hour ago, CalT said:

...would anyone be able to enlighten me? As I say, the ignition system is relatively new to me although I do understand the basic principal. But a dummy’s guide would be best! 

Thanks again for all the support

Cal 

Hi Cal, 

Good move to check you have a spark before sending off the dizzy. To do this you can hold (with something insulated) an HT lead close but not touching the engine block (for added ease have a spark plug in that HT lead and hold the thread against the block). Crank the engine over and see if you see a spark. 

In the standard ignition system, there are contact breaker points inside the distributor just under the rotor arm, these trigger the coil to send the high voltage through the HT leads. These points can close up and won't create the spark.

So firstly determine if you have a spark from the HT leads and then we can go from there. 

Gareth

[John Morrison]

Hi Gareth,

all you say is spot on, but I went down the road of recommending the tester because Cal

isn't as expereinced as teh like of us, and I didn't want him geting the 'Lift' a HT lead can give.

Think he would be advised to go down the tester route, until we can get a couple of guys to

be in the garage with him, and go over some stuff.

John.

[Grahamgl]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/223502856344

I use a set of testers like these, you can check all four pugs in one go. I know Cal has  six cylinders but only two tests rather than six.

Graham

 

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Grahamgl