Peter Cobbold Posted April 12, 2021 Report Share Posted April 12, 2021 59 minutes ago, john.r.davies said: Please be careful, Peter. Your last post is awfully like the QAnon/David Icke posts that see tiny coincidences as evidence of major conspiracies, let alone an Illuminati of extraterrestrial, paedophile, blood-drinking lizards, as equal in evil as only the Baby-Eating Bishop of Bath & Wells! JOhn, you are clearly better read on those topics than me. I shall keep taking the gel-caps ( 40,000 IU pd now) to protect me from those unmentionalbles and their alter-egos the pharmas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted April 12, 2021 Report Share Posted April 12, 2021 1 hour ago, john.r.davies said: Please be careful, Peter. Your last post is awfully like the QAnon/David Icke posts that see tiny coincidences as evidence of major conspiracies, let alone an Illuminati of extraterrestrial, paedophile, blood-drinking lizards, as equal in evil as only the Baby-Eating Bishop of Bath & Wells! Hi John, I appreciate that Peter's post is linking an interesting possibility (conspiracy theory, almost certainly) based on typical actions of powerful people. Your reply is utter bollocks, based not even on conspiracy. Ask yourself the simple question - why do NICE etc steadfastly refuse to accept the small scale successes that have been publish in their 100;s if not 1000's. Even if they accepted it to simply support the vaccine (improve general immunity) that would be something but they happy to see people fall by the wayside. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 12, 2021 Report Share Posted April 12, 2021 (edited) Thank you, Roger. May I refer the Honourable Member to my previous post, dated 9/4/21 and starting, "A philosophy that rejects all views....." John Edited April 12, 2021 by john.r.davies Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 Reverting to public information mode, I've been sent this link,so that I am informed enough to advise punters, coming for their vaccinations, about the blood clot saga. Published by Public Health England, you may like to read it too. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/977688/PHE_COVID-19_AZ_vaccine_and_blood_clots_factsheet_v2.pdf Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 48 minutes ago, john.r.davies said: Reverting to public information mode, I've been sent this link,so that I am informed enough to advise punters, coming for their vaccinations, about the blood clot saga. Published by Public Health England, you may like to read it too. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/977688/PHE_COVID-19_AZ_vaccine_and_blood_clots_factsheet_v2.pdf I doubt the nurses that did my jab know anthing about that, and if they did would 5 mins be long enough to get it across to pts? A hando-out of section 11 would be better. The AZ vax can induce an acute auto-immune response in some pts eg https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2104882?query=recirc_mostViewed_railB_article The possibility that many more pts suffer lower intensity, chronic responses cannot be eliminated. I have profound doubts about these emergency vaccines especially long term. Thay are experimental. If I were not aware of D3 i would rush to take it, and all follow-on revaccinations needed to cover agianst new virus variants. But for me D3 wins out, hands down. New virus variants are going to evolve around the globe, some in response to mass vaccinations other in response to mass infections. I have doubts that these can all be addressed by re-jigged vacccines fast enough. I am not too concerned though as D3-promoted innate immunity defends us against all virus variants, indeed all enveloped viruse and bacteria and fungi. D3 has had 500 miilion years to "learn" how to do that. D3 will win this battle, the only question is how long will it take, how many millons will die,and hundreds of millions suffe long covid, before global D3 deficiency is recognised as driving the pandemic. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 That is a little unkind to the nurses, Peter! This is information that has appeared in the last two weeks - when was your second vaccine given? Let alone your first! Anyone who is concerned, about any aspect of the vaccine, will be welcome to ask questions, and should insist on answers, if necessary from a doctor or more senior nurse in charge of the clinic. That is a better option than the vaccinator having a prolonged discussion, delaying further patients' opportunity to be made immune. The cases reported on in the paper you referred to were all of the type similar to that allied to heparin treatment. To describe that as "auto-immune" is not correct as it is the complex of heparin and proteins on blood platelets, the normal and intended result of anticogulant treatment with heparin, that becomes an antigen. This then attracts the immune system, platelets are destroyed, but in the process blood clots are started. The usual treatment for that is to change to a different type of anticoagulant and manage other complications of the syndrome ( https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/bjh.12059 ) That management usually and specifically does not include platelet transfusions, steroids or immunoglubulins, so the Norwegian paper has some interesting innovations, which the success of those treatments may indicate that the OAZ and heparin syndromes are not so alike. Finally, to suggest "The possibility that many more pts suffer lower intensity, chronic responses cannot be eliminated" is, I fear, unreasonable. You have no evidence for that allegation. Half of those who are vaccinated will have 'cold' symptoms for two to three days, and there are no reports of long lasting fever or dysphoria and malaise. But Covid itself is associated with "Long Covid" and 1 in 10 who acquire the disease has symptoms lasting more that 12 weeks. One, in Ten. The risk assessment of this aspect of vaccination cannot be more clearly in favour of vaccination. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 JOhn, We shall have to agree to differ in our attitude ot vacciines and D3. The immune system is by far the most complex, multi-component, diverse and dynamic feedback-controlled system that we know. It is vastly more complex than anything humans hhave devised, including Silicon Valleys finest. Messing with it in a hurry is not to my mind wise. D3 immunity is also a black box but humans have not designed it, evolution did that and evolution tells us we in UK have too low 25(OH)D unless we supplement. To me an intervention to restore physiology will be safer than any artifice that attempts to tweak this ebormously complicated network, in which half the cells in our body - by number- are engaged. Let's leave it at that. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 Glad to, Peter, but I reserve my right to correct any errors that appear, even if only I see them as that, and to offer vaccine related information on this thread. It has become an advocacy for VitD, but of course, the subject is "Coronavirus" it all its complexity. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 13, 2021 Report Share Posted April 13, 2021 JOhn, Agree Coronavirus is complex and readers of this thread will know that vax are not the only game in town. However the public at large have been kept in the dark re D3, and that is wrong; morally indefensible. I have devoted hours daily on D3 since March 2020 and some of my efforts to disseminate D3 for C-19 can be found by searching : Peter H Cobbold +BMJ. Many other efforts, including letters to newsmedia by me and many members of the Campaign Group have vanihsed without trace or aknowlledgement. There is real anger about this within the group. What you read on here is the tip of a D3 iceberg and it can only be a matter of time before a vaccine-starved developing nation takes up D3 to save its population. New D3-C19 papers are appearing at the rate of a couple a week. Its only a matter of time............. This thread may appear to lack balance to you, but for the public at large -globally - its vaccines or nothing. That is wrong, period. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 14, 2021 Report Share Posted April 14, 2021 Posting my selection of official documents on Covid having been well received, perhpas this may also be of interest, and use to you. The NHS has long had a "Yellow card" scheme, by which it can collect reports of "Adverse Drug Reactions" (ADRs), because as has been said, every medicine has side effects. The same scheme has been collecting reports of the side effects of Covid vaccine. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting The understanding of such side effects develops as we learn. Initially, the Pfizer was thought to be associated with a few cases of acute anaphylaxis (severe allergy), so much so that we all had adrenaline immediatley to hand to give if it happened. That concern is now less, the risk is thought to be no more than the very small one shared with other vaccines and only people with a history of allergy to something in the vaccine should be excluded. No doubt as we learn more about the blood clot effect, a similarly considered management will be in place. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 14, 2021 Report Share Posted April 14, 2021 Had second AZ jab this morning, havent congealed yet. But am looking through the cupboards for some yellow card, jsut in case... Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted April 14, 2021 Report Share Posted April 14, 2021 But I have seen nothing to say why it is on hold for the younger ones Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 13 hours ago, ntc said: But I have seen nothing to say why it is on hold for the younger ones The info overhere about AZ is probably the same you have. What I read is that mostly people aged <60 have shown the severe blood cloth symptoms, and more females are affected. But the same info tells the age distribution is not known (precisely); Science on this matter is work in progress probably? Waldi (who had his dosis of Moderna last week) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 Does this help, ntc? This graphic compares the risk against the benefit at different ages. Because the young people suffer so little risk from Covid, the benefit of vaccinatiion is much less, so that the balance is in favour of avoiding OAZ. The graphic is from Cambridge’s Winton Centre for Risk and Evidence Communication. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
little jim Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 On the other site there's a bit of (medical) discussion about cerebral blood clotting relating to one of the vaccines. but the figures they give say that in non-vaccinated people the occurrence is 5-16 per million and with vaccinated people 3.5 per million. (their figures 79/22.2million). How do you work that so the vaccine gets the blame??? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 Yes, little jim, those incidence figures are so small that the differences are meaningless. The 'interesting' feature is that those - SOME of those! - in the vaccinated group share the thrombocytopaenia (low blood platelet count) finding with the similar blood-clotting complication of heparin treatment. But successful treatment of the vaccine-related complication has included things that don't work in the heparin-related one, so maybe they are not as similar as they seem. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Waldi Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 Thanks for sharing the graph John. The difference between male/female is not shown, do you know if this was considered? Cheers, Waldi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 Please see the source, Waldi: https://wintoncentre.maths.cam.ac.uk/news/communicating-potential-benefits-and-harms-astra-zeneca-covid-19-vaccine/ There MAY be a tendency for women to suffer this more than men, but the numbers are too small to be sure. So the Winton Centre didn't discriminate, and only refers to 'people'. John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ntc Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 3 hours ago, john.r.davies said: Does this help, ntc? This graphic compares the risk against the benefit at different ages. Because the young people suffer so little risk from Covid, the benefit of vaccinatiion is much less, so that the balance is in favour of avoiding OAZ. The graphic is from Cambridge’s Winton Centre for Risk and Evidence Communication. John Not really it does not answer it for it is the same as the government states as the younger ones still get vaccinated I would not be surprised if there is a drop in those who get the second jab Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 15, 2021 Report Share Posted April 15, 2021 6 hours ago, ntc said: Not really it does not answer it for it is the same as the government states as the younger ones still get vaccinated I would not be surprised if there is a drop in those who get the second jab Eh? Your message garbled, please resend. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 You may be interested in this brief update from Prof.Tim Spector, who leads the Zoe Covid study, monitoring Covid levels though the pandemic: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 John, As you know I'm not a fan, and even less so if he still reads the Beano. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 Am I alone in not taking Spectre's risk numbers as an assurance of safety. Yesterday there was a C-19 outbreak in small town 15 miles away from us, and completely unexpected: https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/coronavirus-outbreak-north-wales-bakery-20444100 By Spector's criterion of not dying I agree I might be 'safe' if infected, but cannot be certain re new variants, long covid etc. Bala had not re-opened for tourists and they get 40 cases out of the blue. My perception of risk is not that of an epidemiologist, its more like this " do I really need to run the risk of infection by going shopping, eating out, etc when life is acceptably interesting without such activities". Better safe than in a sorry state. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
john.r.davies Posted April 23, 2021 Report Share Posted April 23, 2021 What was the proportion of the vaccinated to the unvaccinated in Bala? And who were infected - those with one score, thnose with two or those with none at all? Peter, your criticism is unfounded unless you can give those figures, and Spector, thanks to Zoe Covid Watch, can! JOhn Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted April 24, 2021 Report Share Posted April 24, 2021 15 hours ago, john.r.davies said: What was the proportion of the vaccinated to the unvaccinated in Bala? And who were infected - those with one score, thnose with two or those with none at all? Peter, your criticism is unfounded unless you can give those figures, and Spector, thanks to Zoe Covid Watch, can! JOhn Probably very few vaccianted, workers in the factory looked on TV report to be mostly in 20s to 40s. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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