Jump to content

Recommended Posts

27 minutes ago, RobH said:

More similar papers:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20075838v1. (Vitamin D Insufficiency is Prevalent in Severe COVID-19)

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3571484.  (Vitamin D Supplementation Could Possibly Improve Clinical Outcomes....)

Quote from the first:

Strikingly, 100% of ICU patients less than 75 years old had VDI. Coagulopathy was present in 62.5% of ICU COVID-19 patients, and 92.3% were lymphocytopenic. Conclusions: VDI is highly prevalent in severe COVID-19 patients.

The first paper defines VDinsufficiency as 25(OH)  <30 ng/ml = 75 nmol/L

Compare that with UK advice from NICE/SACN/PHE that   50 nmol/L is adequate

Our advisoors advise a D3 level that is a risk level for COVID.   However PHE accepts that up to 4000 IU pd is safe, and that will give us between 100 and 150 nM.

Indonesia data ive just seen bears out the first of Rob's links, with same 75 nmol/L cutoff.

So to date South USA, Indonesia and Philippines have got data collected, anlysed and pre-print publisshed

Where  is the UK ........??????????

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 1.9k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

HELP THE NHS ~ I've let my adjoining empty house (fully furnished) to four NHS nurses free of charge during this National Emergency. We have a very large General Hospital at the top of the r

Very very Harsh Geko. I see a man, in an unenviable position, doing his utmost to balance the impossible tasks of trying to control the spread of a new novel virus - for which there is no treatme

By the book...

Posted Images

Two sets of data, from Indonesia and Philippines, show the same: if serum 25(OH)D3 is below 30 ng.ml = 75 nmol/L the risk of severe COVID is high.

http://www.drdavidgrimes.com/2020/05/covid-19-vitamin-d-ethnicity-and.html

UK supplement guidelines from PHE target an 'adequate' level of 20 ng/ml = 50 nmol/L .  And that is what a multivit provides, no more.

Eventually the central importance of D3 deficiency in the pandemic will be recognised, but before "eventually" comes many will die unecessarily. Very sad.

So I hope I am forgiven for labouring the point.

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Peter Cobbold said:

Two sets of data, from Indonesia and Philippines, show the same: if serum 25(OH)D3 is below 30 ng.ml = 75 nmol/L the risk of severe COVID is high.

http://www.drdavidgrimes.com/2020/05/covid-19-vitamin-d-ethnicity-and.html

UK supplement guidelines from PHE target an 'adequate' level of 20 ng/ml = 50 nmol/L .  And that is what a multivit provides, no more.

Eventually the central importance of D3 deficiency in the pandemic will be recognised, but before "eventually" comes many will die unecessarily. Very sad.

So I hope I am forgiven for labouring the point.

Peter

Peter

on this Covid19 tracker app, today for the first time they are asking for a very wide varieties of Ethnicities by skin colour. UCL or Kings College ???? Are doing the research here, perhaps contact them with your research on D3 and skin colour.

It must be worth a try as they are definitely taking notice.

Sue x

5595A5B3-B852-4AC4-98FC-7B0A4F0A93EA.png

Edited by SuzanneH
Link to post
Share on other sites

Peter.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20075838v1.       n=20 . As they conclude.....warrants more greater numbers to validate.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3571484

Vitamin D supplementation could possibly improve clinical outcomes of patients infected with COVID-2019. Further research should conduct randomized controlled trials and large population studies to evaluate this recommendation.

Their own conclusions.

 

 I respect your knowledge, but the data does not exist in a manner that convinces the medical fraternity. There are reasons to hope but until better data is available nothing more.

Outrageously, the FDA have approved remdesivir for emergency use, https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-issues-emergency-use-authorization-potential-covid-19-treatment. On the basis of non significant results! I smell dollars here.

Iain
 

Edited by iain
Link to post
Share on other sites
52 minutes ago, iain said:

Peter.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20075838v1.       n=20 . As they conclude.....warrants more greater numbers to validate.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3571484

Vitamin D supplementation could possibly improve clinical outcomes of patients infected with COVID-2019. Further research should conduct randomized controlled trials and large population studies to evaluate this recommendation.

Their own conclusions.

 

 I respect your knowledge, but the data does not exist in a manner that convinces the medical fraternity. There are reasons to hope but until better data is available nothing more.

Outrageously, the FDA have approved remdesivir for emergency use, https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-issues-emergency-use-authorization-potential-covid-19-treatment. On the basis of non significant results! I smell dollars here.

Iain
 

Authors still in post have to behave or risk upsetting funding bodies and referees. Hence the caveats about more trials. Observational studies plus the known safty of D3 supplements, even to very high serum levels, is enough.

We now suspect PHE and SAGE are well aware of D3 but dare not pronounce more than amultivit dose (400 IU) because supplies will run out. There are indication on Amazon of soem brands becoming NLA.  To supplemtnt all UK at ca 2000 IU pd needs about 10-15% of global D3 supply. Lets hope Unilever chemists are already on the job of synthesising our own

D3 risk/benefits are not solely for the medics to decide. The economic and societal stresses are rapidly building and add weight to the benefits. D3 adequacy provides an answer to removing the  lcckdown before the onset of winter. Also the first nation to embrace D3 adequacy will gain a humungous advantege over thos still festering in lockdown.

D3 will happen and I hope UK gets in first. Fingers crossed, we dont want to be amongst the also-rans

Peter

Edited by Peter Cobbold
Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow you are cynical Peter. The industry is biased, the scientists can’t write what they want, CMO CSA are just out of kindergarten, BAME activists are using this to show social inequality are just some of your recent statements. Come on, good science gets published in good journals  and good data is incontrovertible. 
 

Iain

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, iain said:

Wow you are cynical Peter. The industry is biased, the scientists can’t write what they want, CMO CSA are just out of kindergarten, BAME activists are using this to show social inequality are just some of your recent statements. Come on, good science gets published in good journals  and good data is incontrovertible. 
 

Iain

Iiain,  There is a mountain of excellent science published on D3. But it gets lost when the ridiculously limited NICE protocol is used to try to define the correct serum level and hence dose. NICE, SACN and PHE make no reference whatosever to physiology in thier deliberations, treating the hormone D3 as if it were a drug. Of course  I am cynical, but I am far from a lone voice. Excellent D3 science is lost upon NICE. 

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, SuzanneH said:

Peter

on this Covid19 tracker app, today for the first time they are asking for a very wide varieties of Ethnicities by skin colour. UCL or Kings College ???? Are doing the research here, perhaps contact them with your research on D3 and skin colour.

It must be worth a try as they are definitely taking notice.

Sue x

5595A5B3-B852-4AC4-98FC-7B0A4F0A93EA.png

Hi Sue,  I think thay are very concerned about the disproportionate BAME deaths and the tracker may be intended to try to find assocaitions with sciological influences. I doubt its anything to do with D3. However the excessive  death rate amongst senior BAME clinicinas, it it continues, may start to appear in                  the app data. And start them looking for biological factors,  in addition to deprivation, income etc

I gather there is a 4nation group looking into D3 , and another into BAME deaths. Lets hope they compsre notes.

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites

The Covid symptom tracker app has found, by studying twins, that "roughly half of the difference in symptoms between people can be explained by underlying variations in their genes, while the rest is due to other factors such as amount of viral exposure (viral load), underlying health conditions, environment and lifestyle."   Their request for the ethnicity of respondants will no doubt allow them to extend that.

Their main interest will be "the ACE2 receptor - the molecular ‘gateway’ by which the coronavirus attaches and enters cells - and research is ongoing to investigate whether variations in this gene increase the risk of infection. Variations in other genes, particularly those involved in the immune response, are prime candidates as they will also affect the severity of the illness."   They seem more impressed by that than D3.  Perhaps the should be asking for A/ respondants' consumption of D3 and B/ their light exposure.

John

PS See: https://covid.joinzoe.com/post/genetics-covid

Edited by john.r.davies
Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, john.r.davies said:

The Covid symptom tracker app has found, by studying twins, that "roughly half of the difference in symptoms between people can be explained by underlying variations in their genes, while the rest is due to other factors such as amount of viral exposure (viral load), underlying health conditions, environment and lifestyle."   Their request for the ethnicity of respondants will no doubt allow them to extend that.

Their main interest will be "the ACE2 receptor - the molecular ‘gateway’ by which the coronavirus attaches and enters cells - and research is ongoing to investigate whether variations in this gene increase the risk of infection. Variations in other genes, particularly those involved in the immune response, are prime candidates as they will also affect the severity of the illness."   They seem more impressed by that than D3.  Perhaps the should be asking for A/ respondants' consumption of D3 and B/ their light exposure.

John

PS See: https://covid.joinzoe.com/post/genetics-covid

I wish...................

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it is VERY significant that D3 appears on Costco’s site alongside other Covid19 necessities ie hand wipes and sanitiser gel.

It looks as though the message is getting through to someone.

3EB91FAE-E2C2-401D-9F86-B5CF25EC22B4.jpeg

Edited by SuzanneH
Link to post
Share on other sites
30 minutes ago, SuzanneH said:

I think it is VERY significant that D3 appears on Costco’s site alongside other Covid19 necessities ie hand wipes and sanitiser gel.

It looks as though the message is getting through to someone.

3EB91FAE-E2C2-401D-9F86-B5CF25EC22B4.jpeg

 

A couple of weeks ago a colleague bought 300 to distribute to GPs. Now reationed to 2.  I think the message has got through.

Peter

Link to post
Share on other sites

With all the fuss about D3 it would be a pity to overlook blood-thinning vitamin E which are probably much more relevant to the matter at hand - says my MD partner

Link to post
Share on other sites

It's getting out there Peter. I think your group submission is mentioned here at the end of this Telegraph article picking up D3 deficiency.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/03/time-take-seriously-link-vitamin-d-deficiency-serious-covid/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr

Mick Richards

Link to post
Share on other sites

People are reacting it seems. I was checking the Healthspan website last night as I wanted to recommend the products we are taking to a friend, and saw that both the "Over 50" 2000iu D3 capsules and 1000iu "superstrength' D3 tablets are out of stock.

Edited by Rod1883
Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, foster461 said:

Tks Stan,

Hollis is a big name in D3 research, huge experience, he wont be embarking on a wild goose chase.

Peter

Edited by Peter Cobbold
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Motorsport Mickey said:

It's getting out there Peter. I think your group submission is mentioned here at the end of this Telegraph article picking up D3 deficiency.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/03/time-take-seriously-link-vitamin-d-deficiency-serious-covid/?li_source=LI&li_medium=liftigniter-rhr

Mick Richards

Tks Mick, a friend sent me a samizdat copy to get around the paywall. Yes it was this:

https://www.bmj.com/content/369/bmj.m1548/rr-6

Peter

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just watched the daily Press Conference with Raab and Professor Angela McLean.

McClean was incredibly curt with a number of her answers - I wonder if there is something going on behind the scenes between her and Raab, or within SAGE, or perhaps she is just getting fed up with answering the same inane questions every day?

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Rod1883 said:

Just watched the daily Press Conference with Raab and Professor Angela McLean.

McClean was incredibly curt with a number of her answers - I wonder if there is something going on behind the scenes between her and Raab, or within SAGE, or perhaps she is just getting fed up with answering the same inane questions every day?

Maybe she was just having a bad day. But also, I guess it gets a bit monotonous having to put up that graph every day that compares death totals between countries, then getting asked by journalists why the UK is topping the European countries, then having to explain that international comparisons don't really make sense.

Nigel

Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't make sense?    

 29,427 deaths recorded across the UK -

The latest total for Italy, previously the highest in Europe, now stands at 29,315. (BBC)

And Italy are about two weeks ahead of us, so they have had time to count the corpses, while we still have to count the care home deaths.   Why does that not make sense?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Totals do not make sense. Deaths expressed as a percentage of the total population makes some sort of sense but still doesn't take into account differences in demographics/ ethnic background (vit D)/ etc. etc. 

Useful for scaremongering but not for much else. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Please familiarise yourself with our Terms and Conditions. By using this site, you agree to the following: Terms of Use.