brenda Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 The wiper motor has finally failed and is burnt out. On taking the motor out this morning I have a little question to ask. Can you pull out the cable rack from the Rigid tubing or is it a full stripdown as it is tight to move in and out approx 1/2 inche. Mike Redrose Group Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tr graham Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 mike if you undo the nut that holds the piping to the motor ,you can pull the drive out of the tubing , make sure you remove the wiper arms !!!! when re fitting push the drive as far as the first wheel box then turn the wheel box to engage the drive , repeat when you get to the second box , . graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
brenda Posted September 30, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 Thanks for that Graham I’ll give it a go, but it was very tight. If and when I get it out is there a lubricant I can put in the tubes. Mike Redrose Group Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 Hi Mike, before pulling the cable out - mark the wiper arm spindles (draw a vertical line across them) - rotate the spindle 120' before refitting Remember the orientation of the cable in the motor. - rotate the cable 180' before refitting. The above will use unworn parts of both parts (assuming they hadn't already been turned over). Use a fairly light grease that doesn't go too stiff in cold weather. There is a pulling tension test outlines in the WSM on the rack cable. If you are not a concourse advocate then seriously consider the TR6 14W motor. These are cheap and plentiful and work very well. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Grahamgl Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 Mike, All as above but before you can withdraw the rack you will either need to pull it out whilst still attached to the motor or remove the cover off the motor to disconnect the rack from it. Graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 30, 2019 Report Share Posted September 30, 2019 Hi Mike, have a read of this to see how to make changing a wiper motor exciting. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chris Hubball Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Hi Roger Converting to a TR6 wiper motor is something I have been considering no doubt many others, could you be persuaded to write an article for TR Action explaining how to mount it and the wiring and other changes involved. Cheers Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Hi Chris, that sounds like a good idea. I'll give it a go. Do I get paid Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 19 hours ago, RogerH said: Hi Mike, have a read of this to see how to make changing a wiper motor exciting. Roger Hi Roger, Interesting topic referring to replacing with TR6 motor. Will a 152 degree sweep cause a problem on a 4A do you think? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Hi Roger, very much so. The standard sweep is apprx 120'. If you go over tot he 14W motor then you have to start from te beginnning to see what gear wheel you need. The standard TR6 f=gear wheel 115' but that is with TR6 wheel boxes. I have found that with the standard TR4A wheel box a 95 or 90' gear wheel works well - with added bonuses. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
brenda Posted October 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Just spent a happy two hour getting the cable rack out, full of old grease and dirt. Found out why the motor has burnt out the drivers side wheel box cannot be moved with fingers and very stiff with wiper arm on. Removed from car and cleaned still very stiff so ordered two new ones, also found that the live cable from the lng switch has burnt out ( no fuse to wiper motor another job to do) so if you have not looked at you wipers for a while, I have found you a winter job before it costs you. Mike Redrose Group Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 Hi Mike, to add to your above comments. If you have a normally working 2 speed motor (DR3 I think) and it jams on the screen before it self parks you will burn out the high speed over winding (resistor) and possibly the armature as well The motor will continue to draw current until it burns out - hence the burnt Ignition switch wires Simple way around this is to remove the self park facility but annoying. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tim hunt Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 A word of warning re replacement wheel boxes Mike. It's highly unlikely you have acquired original NOS Lucas wheel boxes. Be aware that due to poor dimensional control on some repro items it was possible for the rack to come out of mesh with the gear wheels under high torque. Before fitting reproduction parts to the car test them carefully. Fit the rack in a wheel box and then clamp the spindle carefully in a vice to avoid any damage to the splines. Next grip the drive end of the rack with a mole wrench and exert considerable force to ensure that it will not come out of engagement with the pinion at high torque. This can happen, don’t ask me how I know! If the rack does ride over the pinion then separate the two halves of the wheel box and carefully reshape them so that the rack is held in closer contact with the pinion without binding. Repeat the exercise on the second wheel box and pat yourself on the back for having potentially saved yourself a lot of grief! Tim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted October 1, 2019 Report Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) All getting very complicated - but I have found a solution............................ not taking car out when it's raining! Edited October 1, 2019 by rogerowen Quote Link to post Share on other sites
brenda Posted October 6, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2019 Evening all , Just had a few hours in the garage installing new wheel boxes and new motor. Wired up temporarily two speed switch to test and get the stop and park working. Next is to replace burnt out wire in the loom (that will be fun ) hopefully do that job mid week ready for going out over the weekend. Mike Redrose Group Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted October 7, 2019 Report Share Posted October 7, 2019 Well done mike. I admire your electrikery dexterity. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patrick Brady Posted May 2, 2020 Report Share Posted May 2, 2020 A bit late, but to add my experience of wipers, from bitter experience! I my rebuild I did fit new wheel boxes, rack and tubes, but refitted the original motor. First point -- do fit lengths of the plastic water tube to the wheel boxes before assembly on the car, as fitting them through the little wheel box access holes is extremely trying. Second, -- as Roger says above, use a light grease. I used Kleenol grease because of the proximity of water, but it seemed to set hard during a period of no use, and the motor wouldn't drive the wipers. I took out the rack, cleaned it, and re-greased with a light grease I had to hand: Lucas X-TRA heavy duty grease, which I trust will stay fluid. Third -- Setting the "park" position. Not well described in the Haynes manual, but in TR4 Autobook by Kenneth Ball he says "slacken the four cover screws and turn the domed cover on the gearbox until the setting pip on top is in line with the central groove in the gearbox cover" Adjust if required. (In my photo you can see the pip is in line with the groove. Also the Kleenol grease) That worked, and was great until: Fourth -- later the wipers wouldn't turn off. They came on with the ignition switch. Problem solved (eventually !) by seeing a slight spark. The bare terminal on top of the gearbox "dome" was shorting to the bolt of the cone bonnet buffer. Note also the bare terminal in the photo. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
qkingston Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 Ok so I'm having fun with this task as many have described, however I have an additional twist (literally). The centre section of rigid tube has a slight curve at both ends (it came out that way), however the curve is not equal at either end (see pic). Can anyone describe (or with pic) which way round this tube goes? I've tried every combination I can think of but it doesn't seem to sit right, any clues? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 37 minutes ago, qkingston said: Ok so I'm having fun with this task as many have described, however I have an additional twist (literally). The centre section of rigid tube has a slight curve at both ends (it came out that way), however the curve is not equal at either end (see pic). Can anyone describe (or with pic) which way round this tube goes? I've tried every combination I can think of but it doesn't seem to sit right, any clues? I would say the way you have it now is the best fit as the extra kink to the right hand wiper then misses the vent rod. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Prefect Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 I know i have banged on about it before but it would be prudent (IMHO) to fuse the wiper circuit. You were lucky the short bit of wire melted with burning the car up completely. Even better fuse the Brown wires that go under the dashboard. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
qkingston Posted January 6, 2021 Report Share Posted January 6, 2021 26 minutes ago, stuart said: I would say the way you have it now is the best fit as the extra kink to the right hand wiper then misses the vent rod. Stuart. Thanks Stuart, of course the vent flap rod - I knew there had to be a reason, just couldn't quite see what it was! Best Regards David Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Gosh, how time flies! All the above tips are very useful as I'm about to replace my 4A's wiper motor (with a TR6 one), and TR6 Wheel boxes (original LUCAS New Old Stock). Quick questions - does the fact that my car is LHD have any impact on the replacement procedure? Will I need to make a change to the original 4A switch? Many thanks, hope everyone is well Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Hi Roger, the 4A switch will NOT work on the W14 (TR6) motor Have a look here for switches and other stuff STUFF NOTE - you may have to be creative in getting the switch to fit but it will. It is a toggle switch rather than pull. You may also need an adaptor harness for the motor to the existing loom - I'm sure I got mine from Moss but can't find it on their site at present. Consider keeping your 4A wheel boxes as they are slight larger diameter thatn the TR6 so will improve the motor torque. The gear wheel in the W14 motor will give toooooo wide a sweep. from the SVC site get a 90 or 95 degree gear wheel. This will also improve the motor torque. With the 4A wheel boxes + 90/95 gear wheel + the W14 you can easily wipe a dry screen. WARNING - do NOT hold a wiper blade and then switch the wiper motor on - the torque is so great you will flip the car over Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, RogerH said: Hi Roger, the 4A switch will NOT work on the W14 (TR6) motor Have a look here for switches and other stuff STUFF NOTE - you may have to be creative in getting the switch to fit but it will. It is a toggle switch rather than pull. You may also need an adaptor harness for the motor to the existing loom - I'm sure I got mine from Moss but can't find it on their site at present. Consider keeping your 4A wheel boxes as they are slight larger diameter thatn the TR6 so will improve the motor torque. The gear wheel in the W14 motor will give toooooo wide a sweep. from the SVC site get a 90 or 95 degree gear wheel. This will also improve the motor torque. With the 4A wheel boxes + 90/95 gear wheel + the W14 you can easily wipe a dry screen. WARNING - do NOT hold a wiper blade and then switch the wiper motor on - the torque is so great you will flip the car over Roger Thanks Roger, nuisance about the TR6 wheel boxes - I had a notion that the rack of the TR6 motor would not fit the 4A wheel boxes...no idea where I got that from! And, they were Blurry expensive, hey ho. Anyway it does mean I don't have to twist myself into unimaginable contortions to replace them now. . Good heads-up about the switch, and the flipping the car over bit....I do need to look at the underside anyway Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 24, 2021 Report Share Posted February 24, 2021 Hi Roger, you will need to mount the motor securely. There are brackets etc for the job butt you can also make your own. I used 2 pieces of a plastic material. The bottom is attached to the car and the top is attached to the bottom. This keeps visible bolt heads to a minimum. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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